Devs and "Community" Employees Are Averaging Less than 1 Post Per Day - Where Is The Engagement?

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Mad Vader

Duhpressed
Duke
M&BWB
Good point, might be a good time to never visit this forum for a year
Put this question on a poll to see what vox populi wants. Brace yourself.

Different theme and dump part of the core M&B experience, but still recognizably inspired by M&B:
Starsector
Yeah, no.
The game was made entirely by Fractal Softworks, led by indie developer Alexander Mosolov.[1] Mosolov cited Star Control II as a "major" influence on the game's development, as well as Wing Commander: Privateer, Sid Meier's Pirates!, and Solar Winds
 
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bunions

Sergeant
Good point, might be a good time to never visit this forum for a year

well-bye-bye.gif
 

Mad Vader

Duhpressed
Duke
M&BWB
That's marketing, it's nothing like Mount and Blade unless you claim anything with an open overworld and tactical combat encounters is like Mount and Blade, and games like that existed before Mount and Blade.
It's a lot like Star Control 2 or even Pirates, but you can't tell that to the kids nowadays, and it's a statement made by a modder, not the author.
 

geala

Squire
I bought Starsector some time ago and I have difficulties to associate it with M+B. What is true is that you move on a map and fight battles in a different screen, but I would compare that more with Total War games.

And to the general discussion, the foremost conclusion for some people probably should be, don't buy games in early access any longer if you fear disappointment.
 

Roy1012

On probation
And then people justify their insults and disrespect by saying they've been suggesting improvements for the game for YEARS but they don't listen... The perfect definition of entitled players.
Yeah, us pearl clutchers asking for the servers to not crash every 15 minutes for almost 4 years now is way out of bounds.
Look at the front page, a good third of it is about how the game sucks, how the forums are dead, how devs aren't listening.
But that’s all true lol
and posts tilted "I've been scammed by the devs" shouldn't be tolerated
Why not? I wouldn’t say we got scammed, but you could certainly make a false advertising argument.

If you want people to stay and devs to interact with the players again, there needs to be a better atmosphere around here.
But we tried that for like 10 years and got nothing. Then we tried being a bit unhappy for the closed beta and then first year of early access and got nothing. Then we got angry after the second and a half year of early access and the “full” release and got nothing. Why would us being nice change anything?
 

Roy1012

On probation
Ok so only up during EA - a failed aspiration.

I‘ve never played MP, but the level of server instability seems inexcusable.
What was this statement everyone is talking about? I may be stupid but I’ve scoured this thread and can’t find it.
 

NPC99

Baron
M&BWBWF&SVC
What was this statement everyone is talking about? I may be stupid but I’ve scoured this thread and can’t find it.
Taleworlds took our money while saying they were going to use that money to make (X game) to our expectations.
You need to give a source for that as I don't believe they ever made a commitment to implement our expectations.
During Early Access, the Steam store page said: "We will use consumer feedback to bring the game to the community's expectations." (It has since been removed).
 

five bucks

Knight at Arms
The point is you think of someone as being lesser because they are playing a product that you think is lesser. Its elitist. Simple as.
You are latching onto random nonsense so you can avoid replying to the actual point of the argument because you know you're wrong.
You didn't order this product to be made, TW is making it and selling it to other people. The people buying it literally have no control over its creation.
Already addressed this, Taleworlds offered to sell the game saying it would have certain things in it, people gave them money to do that, now they should do that.
It is the artists product, it is their choice as to what goes into it. Whether its a painting, whether its an album, whether its a house. It is entirely their decision what gets into the game and what doesn't. There have been countless examples of games that have had content been cut, the biggest of which being Bioshock: Infinite, and Bannerlords is the same.
Bioshock Infinite was not an Early Access title. Cut content is acceptable when you have not already sold the game saying you would have it. After that it just becomes false advertising which would not be acceptable in any other industry.
The main that I disagreed with however many posts ago was the idea that TW can't add anything that the community doesn't want. Its their game, they can literally add whatever the **** they wanted to it. If they wanted to add guns, they can add guns, if they wanted to add Dickplomacy, then it gets added. You don't get to dictate what gets added, nor really the community. Are there things that should be added, yes. Criminal elements being the largest that anyone can point to. However they can still add whatever they want in the meantime. Not the entire dev team will work on one part of it.
I already responded to this, and you ignored it: sure, they can add whatever they want, but not when it is massively delaying what people actually bought the game for.
We have now been waiting 10 years for Bannerlord to be complete and even after "official release" it still isn't. The delays need to end.
Good point, might be a good time to never visit this forum for a year
Don't let the door hit you on the way out!

And to the general discussion, the foremost conclusion for some people probably should be, don't buy games in early access any longer if you fear disappointment.
Look, you are right there. But I thought Taleworlds would be different as an established AA dev with a good reputation, and I thought that "better version of Warband" was utterly impossible to stuff up for a 10x larger dev team over 10 years of development.

So much for that.
Ok so only up during EA - a failed aspiration.
I'm not sure how that's meant to be an excuse. They had it up for two years on the page where people actually buy the product. If you don't intend to do something you're being paid hundreds of millions of dollars for, then don't say you will.
 

NPC99

Baron
M&BWBWF&SVC
During Early Access, the Steam store page said: "We will use consumer feedback to bring the game to the community's expectations." (It has since been removed).
Seems the actual wording was: “These past experiences have taught us that it is vital to bring players in to help us iron out any issues and refine the game by utilizing feedback to bring it to the level that both our community and we expect.”

As far as I’m concerned that just says they will use EA feedback to improve the game’s level of performance. Nothing about implementing community requested features.
 
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five bucks

Knight at Arms
Nothing about implementing community requested features.
That's never been my argument. As I said on page 3 in my first reply to that guy:

I'm not saying they should be adding any old feature a random community member asks for, but they should certainly not be prioritising stuff nobody asked for over stuff the paying customers were told was going to be in the game when they bought it.

It stops being "their game" when they charge money for it, receive hundreds of millions of dollars from the community, and say "we are going to make the game to meet community expectations".
The reason I mentioned it is that it's further evidence it's not some solo artistic work and it's no longer "their thing", it's a product that's already been sold and is supposed to be completed.
 

Apocal

Grandmaster Knight
That's marketing, it's nothing like Mount and Blade unless you claim anything with an open overworld and tactical combat encounters is like Mount and Blade, and games like that existed before Mount and Blade.
It's a lot like Star Control 2 or even Pirates, but you can't tell that to the kids nowadays, and it's a statement made by a modder, not the author.
More like the party-based nature of it and the ability to create your own faction, in comparison to Pirates, where you get one ship in tactical battles and are stuck with historical sides to the conflict.

It's also the most common way people describe the game when shilling it.
 
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NPC99

Baron
M&BWBWF&SVC
The reason I mentioned it is that it's further evidence it's not some solo artistic work and it's no longer "their thing", it's a product that's already been sold and is supposed to be completed.
Vanilla Calradia will always be “their thing” - TW designed and built it. I agree that a product should be feature complete at release as opposed to EA. BL isn’t because outstanding items remain in their roadmap (not our wish list). I disapprove of that, but assume the date was entered into contractually with the console companies - TW has always overestimated what it could achieve in any timescale undermining most deadlines.
Imo post-release value should be added by modders and bonus features, not catch-up roadmap elements. By contrast, some companies would postpone the release of modding tools until after their game is published, whereas TW released them earlier helping modders but adding to their workload during EA.
 
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five bucks

Knight at Arms
Vanilla Calradia will always be “their thing” - TW designed and built it. I agree that a product should be feature complete at release as opposed to EA. BL isn’t because outstanding items remain in their roadmap (not our wish list). I disapprove of that, but assume the date was entered into contractually with the console companies - TW has always overestimated what it could achieve in any timescale undermining most deadlines.
The release date is not even the issue so much as the massive delays on fixing problems that are stopping this game from being fun.

Issues such as these: https://forums.taleworlds.com/index...can-do-to-make-the-game-much-more-fun.455935/ should have been resolved YEARS ago. They are SO easy to solve.
 

SpartanBG

Recruit
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Congratulations in your job? That has nothing to do with my comment, at all.

I didn't say they didn't do anything over the last two years chap. Don't put words in people's mouth and then try call them out for it.

I was implying the work they did do was not very progressive. As you stated yourself, the game runs a lot smoother than on release. Exactly my point, it was mostly just tinkering with the code/backend stuff over and over. This kind of stuff should have been done mostly before EA, and DEFINITELY before the final bloody release of the game. But here we are, still tinkering with the backend, and still missing a plethora of features and mechanics.

I would define over two years of progression where the game still isnt finished - where TW stated the game would finished in one year - not very progressed.
Look i hear you loud and clear, i do agree its unfinished (that's our opinions) And I would like to push them to action, but being negative like most folks on the forum ain't helping. Sometimes great things require good amounts of time, so 10 years in dev and 2 years early probably wasn't enough :smile:


Basically M&B clones:
Free Company VR
Tales of Glory
Kingdoms
The Viking Way

The ones that go for a different theme:
Kenshi
Freeman: Guerrilla Warfare

Same theme but dump part of the core M&B experience (first person battles):
Battle Brothers
Glorious Companions

Different theme and dump part of the core M&B experience, but still recognizably inspired by M&B:
Starsector
Thanks man I'll check all of those :smile:
 

NPC99

Baron
M&BWBWF&SVC
The release date is not even the issue so much as the massive delays on fixing problems that are stopping this game from being fun.

Issues such as these: https://forums.taleworlds.com/index...can-do-to-make-the-game-much-more-fun.455935/ should have been resolved YEARS ago. They are SO easy to solve.
Whatever our opinions are on the issues raised in that thread, none of them are bugs or performance problems. They are disagreements with TW’s design choices. Challenging TW’s choices is fine but they’re under no obligation to change anything.
 

five bucks

Knight at Arms
Whatever our opinions are on the issues raised in that thread, none of them are bugs or performance problems. They are disagreements with TW’s design choices. Challenging TW’s choices is fine but they’re under no obligation to change anything.
So why did they say they were going to build the game to meet community expectations if, in your opinion, community expectations don't mean jack ****?
What matters is what the people who paid for the product want. I don't know why you are arguing that the buyers' preferences should be considered irrelevant. You ARE a buyer, it only goes against your interests to argue otherwise.
 
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