Dev Blog 15/10/19

cherac

Sergeant Knight
Best answers
0
Chuma180 said:
I dont see the difference between Warband Morale System and the Bannerlord System, overall with so many Blogs I didnt saw anything really new, despite Siege Engines, some Weapon Crafting (not even Armor Crafting) or the Perma Death feature with kids. I thought Taleworlds mentioned they have many new Features but at the moment I see only a Warband reskin with awful Combat Mechanic and some new Features and only for this they took almost 8 years of development time? I dont want to mention even the Banner System, Combat or Multiplayer overall in my Opinion everything got more simplified and boring I dont see any depth Gameplay Mechanics at the moment.
That is so not fair, for a game you haven’t actually played that is an unwarranted judgement, also I think you should reread and review all released info and content, Bannerlords is by no means shallow , its a really big improvement on warband, a worthy sequel , yes its not perfect but you have to realize its still in development, and would be polished over time
 

FBohler

Knight
WBNWWF&S
Best answers
0
Mirabelle said:
FBohler said:
It would be nice to see terrain affecting morale.

For example:

- Wet terrain such as rivers;
- Fighting from lower ground;
- Climbing up a hill (temporary morale drop for unmounted troops in this case);
Shouldn't mounted troops also receive a penalty? I'd imagine that charging uphill, even with a horse, would be pretty bad.
On a second thought, I agree with you. Furthermore, cav is OP enough :lol:
 

Beron

Sergeant
Best answers
0
Reuven said:
Deer said:
Would also be interesting with a shock-effect from getting flanked or hit by heavy cavalry
That would be good, like in Total War.
but this is all the important Thing about manouvering, and it's missing  :sad:
what is the Point of outflanking, or Managing a charge from behind, if it does not affect morale?!

without an influence of flanking on morale , all goes down to: higher killing, higher morale, so you just have to have the best troops, and rush them straight on. Is it fun?  :facepalm:

and what About Fatigue? and lower/higher gorund? and surprise if hidden troops jump at you from a forest?

@ Callum: sorry for the rant, but do you see any Chance of implementing a morale modifier which depends on being flanked? it cannot be so difficult, total war has it since 20 years, shadow of the horned rat evn longer…
the other Points, like Fatigue/lower Ground/surprise, any Chance? Maybe by modding?
 

FBohler

Knight
WBNWWF&S
Best answers
0
Beron said:
all goes down to: higher killing, higher morale, so you just have to have the best troops, and rush them straight on. Is it fun?  :facepalm:
Welcome to Calradia  :lol:
 

LeChat

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBM&BWF&SVC
Best answers
0
I have never been annoyed by moral in Warband. Maybe in a mod (Medieval Conquest) where I lost some troops. But not in Native or Age of Calradia Enhanced.
(maybe because I am fighting very often ^^)

Callum_TaleWorlds said:
That arrow was from a horse archer if I remember correctly. The AI is pretty sneaky in battles tbh, so horse archers will constantly be flanking and harassing the enemy, archers will push forward to fire then fall back behind the infantry lines when enemy cav approach, who then, in turn, pull out of their charge rather than run into a shield wall. There is actually a lot going on in battles come to think of it... And soon enough you will get to experience them for yourself!
Haha ! Never soon enough !
 

vicwiz007

D
Knight at Arms
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Best answers
0
fedeita said:
Callum_TaleWorlds said:
That arrow was from a horse archer if I remember correctly. The AI is pretty sneaky in battles tbh, so horse archers will constantly be flanking and harassing the enemy, archers will push forward to fire then fall back behind the infantry lines when enemy cav approach, who then, in turn, pull out of their charge rather than run into a shield wall. There is actually a lot going on in battles come to think of it... And soon enough you will get to experience them for yourself!
Dear Callum don't hate me for saying this but after watching almost all the videos avaiable I'm 100 % sceptical about your statment, we never seen something any close to what your describe.
If something has been done to the AI, just show us please.
You said it, partner.
FBohler said:
On a second thought, I agree with you. Furthermore, cav is OP enough :lol:
Theyre actually not too bad any more, at least in captain mode. The issue now is that AI still suck at dealing with them, which will be infuriating tenfold when in singleplayer.
 

froggyluv

Master Knight
NW
Best answers
0
Sounds good. Would like to see maybe some special heroes or religious nuts that simply dont break cause they live for glory
 

JuanNieve

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
Best answers
0
Sounds interesting how morale will work, but I think the infantry fights should last longer. Perhaps that A.I has a more defensive behavior or better use their shields. This would favor flanking maneuvers or "the hammer and anvil"
 

JustinTime49

Sergeant
Best answers
0
This was an informative blog. Although it is steps up from Warband I wonder if this is as deep as the morale system goes.

Any surrender system? Something behind the scenes where eventually the total army morale would reach a threshold that prompts either groups(up to 10?) or the rest of the army to simultaneously surrender as opposed to flee. Maybe in encirclement situations where your army is cutting the enemy to pieces to the point where they don't flee but rather lay down arms.

I really like the chain rout system, however from the content it seems that morale is only calculated and manipulated via kills and player/formation buffs. Will any shock effect, weather/terrain be a thing, like charging the flank with cav or even those two handed monstrosities seen in the screenshot. Taking hold of the high ground, troop tier, homeland advantages? Would have been nice to know.

Still, looking forward to it!


Callum_TaleWorlds said:
That arrow was from a horse archer if I remember correctly. The AI is pretty sneaky in battles tbh, so horse archers will constantly be flanking and harassing the enemy, archers will push forward to fire then fall back behind the infantry lines when enemy cav approach, who then, in turn, pull out of their charge rather than run into a shield wall. There is actually a lot going on in battles come to think of it... And soon enough you will get to experience them for yourself!
I do wonder though, what you described is in complete contradiction to what Petmonster_tw said few weeks back.
petmonster_tw said:
About infantry vs Cav. We are still trying to find the right balance. We did have -at one- point unbreakable wall of spears and quickly decided to make the infantry act more foolish. Otherwise Cav vs Inf is not fun at all. In real life no Cav formation charges directly to the infantry. They did get into charge numerous times just to turn back at the last moment. It was a battle of nerves. The infantry "died" many times before finally that last cav charge is real this time. (The cav charge becomes real when the cav commander decides the inf formation has lost its nerve and about to break.) since we cannot simulate this in the game it is somewhat OK to make inf act a bit goofy.
Unless I misunderstood, comparing these two I got that: you guys implement smart feint charges that wouldn't smash into their deaths but decided to keep goofy AI anyway, or you guys couldnt get cavalry commanders to recognize when formations are going to break since its dependent on the individual ai, or your description of battle was very over-exaggerated, or one of you isn't telling the truth(hope its petmonster :p).

Ugh, ik its off topic for the blog, but what is this? Why make inf ai stupid if you have tactical feint charges?
 

cherac

Sergeant Knight
Best answers
0
fedeita said:
Callum_TaleWorlds said:
That arrow was from a horse archer if I remember correctly. The AI is pretty sneaky in battles tbh, so horse archers will constantly be flanking and harassing the enemy, archers will push forward to fire then fall back behind the infantry lines when enemy cav approach, who then, in turn, pull out of their charge rather than run into a shield wall. There is actually a lot going on in battles come to think of it... And soon enough you will get to experience them for yourself!
Dear Callum don't hate me for saying this but after watching almost all the videos avaiable I'm 100 % sceptical about your statment, we never seen something any close to what your describe.
If something has been done to the AI, just show us please.
I believe “You’ll get to experience it yourself soon enough” makes your statement irrelevant!? Or maybe I might be wrong
 

Deer

Sergeant at Arms
Best answers
0
Beron said:
Reuven said:
Deer said:
Would also be interesting with a shock-effect from getting flanked or hit by heavy cavalry
That would be good, like in Total War.
but this is all the important Thing about manouvering, and it's missing  :sad:
what is the Point of outflanking, or Managing a charge from behind, if it does not affect morale?!

without an influence of flanking on morale , all goes down to: higher killing, higher morale, so you just have to have the best troops, and rush them straight on. Is it fun?  :facepalm:

and what About Fatigue? and lower/higher gorund? and surprise if hidden troops jump at you from a forest?

@ Callum: sorry for the rant, but do you see any Chance of implementing a morale modifier which depends on being flanked? it cannot be so difficult, total war has it since 20 years, shadow of the horned rat evn longer…
the other Points, like Fatigue/lower Ground/surprise, any Chance? Maybe by modding?
I disagree. There are tons of reasons for manouvering: shooting them in the back, hitting them in the back (shield is only facing forward), hammering through on chargers to break up a tight formation from the rear. Uhh, lancing them in the back.. Positioning counts, already did back in MB1
 

fedeita

Marquis
Best answers
0
cherac said:
fedeita said:
Callum_TaleWorlds said:
That arrow was from a horse archer if I remember correctly. The AI is pretty sneaky in battles tbh, so horse archers will constantly be flanking and harassing the enemy, archers will push forward to fire then fall back behind the infantry lines when enemy cav approach, who then, in turn, pull out of their charge rather than run into a shield wall. There is actually a lot going on in battles come to think of it... And soon enough you will get to experience them for yourself!
Dear Callum don't hate me for saying this but after watching almost all the videos avaiable I'm 100 % sceptical about your statment, we never seen something any close to what your describe.
If something has been done to the AI, just show us please.
I believe “You’ll get to experience it yourself soon enough” makes your statement irrelevant!? Or maybe I might be wrong
I don't get why my statement have to be irrelevant, I just asked him to show us improvements he's talking about.
 

MKLVN

Veteran
Best answers
0
vicwiz007 said:
Theyre actually not too bad any more, at least in captain mode. The issue now is that AI still suck at dealing with them, which will be infuriating tenfold when in singleplayer.
I think cav will be less infuriating in single player. They’re frustrating in captain mode because you’re often standing in the open, flat ground to defend a flag or moving from one flag to another. In single player battles there won’t be an objective or time limit, you can use the terrain to your advantage or just get a mass shield wall.

I especially think a “circle” or square formation with a unit of shields and a unit spears crammed together inside the circle would be effective against cavalry. Typically if I’m in a shield wall and not completely exposed, I can knock out 2-4 cav if they charge into my unit because they get caught up and slow down/stop.
 

Iberian Wolf

Master Knight
Best answers
0
Thanks for the blog Callum!

I hope the proposed morale changes will be noticeable in the battlefield.

Also, I'd love to see the troops receiving a good morale boost upon defending their homeland(e.g. Vlandians troops defending Pravend).
 

Terco_Viejo

Spanish Gifquisition
Sergeant Knight at Arms
Best answers
0
AmateurHetman said:
I feel this blog would have benefited from a video showcasing a chain reaction of fleeing soldiers.
Don't try too hard, mate; I doubt very much if they'll show us anything we haven't already seen. You could say that what had to be scratched from the bottom of the barrel is scratched.
The PR of Taleworlds takes advantage of the boredom and lack of memory of the majority of the people who have followed and follow this lavish process of development.

All this "new" blog is an attempt to stretch once again the gum; a habitual practice of Taleworlds...Recycling:

MORALE IN BATTLES: WILL THERE BE A CHANCE FOR A BATTLE THAT DOES NOT END IN A TOTAL BLOODBATH ON EITHER SIDE?
“Party morale is a critical variable. It decreases massively if the leader does not pay wages regularly or if the soldiers cannot find food to eat. Leaders have two main responsibilities: wages and food. Other than this, travelling long distances without entering a town makes soldiers tired and decreases their morale. Some strategies, like leaving soldiers behind to run away from strong parties also make men unhappy. When you enter a battle with troops who have low morale, after taking some casualties your men can lose their courage and start to flee. This means that a battle can be lost even if most of your troops are still alive. These deserting troops go on to form a new deserted party on the campaign map which the party leader can no longer control. Thankfully, there are lots of different ways to keep party morale high!”
Dev Blog 12/07/18
 

Beron

Sergeant
Best answers
0
Deer said:
Beron said:
Reuven said:
Deer said:
Would also be interesting with a shock-effect from getting flanked or hit by heavy cavalry
That would be good, like in Total War.
but this is all the important Thing about manouvering, and it's missing  :sad:
what is the Point of outflanking, or Managing a charge from behind, if it does not affect morale?!

without an influence of flanking on morale , all goes down to: higher killing, higher morale, so you just have to have the best troops, and rush them straight on. Is it fun?  :facepalm:

and what About Fatigue? and lower/higher gorund? and surprise if hidden troops jump at you from a forest?

@ Callum: sorry for the rant, but do you see any Chance of implementing a morale modifier which depends on being flanked? it cannot be so difficult, total war has it since 20 years, shadow of the horned rat evn longer…
the other Points, like Fatigue/lower Ground/surprise, any Chance? Maybe by modding?
I disagree. There are tons of reasons for manouvering: shooting them in the back, hitting them in the back (shield is only facing forward), hammering through on chargers to break up a tight formation from the rear. Uhh, lancing them in the back.. Positioning counts, already did back in MB1
Ok, but even if you have some Advantages, it is far from being a key factor for Winning a battle. You get some kills, but you don't route the enemy.

Like Reuven (I think?) did, I would take again total war as an example: very accurate thinking at the beginning of the battle, but then very fast thinking as the Engagement ensued was required to get the best position, to Keep your army facing the enemy, to Keep your archers safe, to get the best out of the melee. You typically had a Missile battle where you were trying to catch the enemy skirmischer with your cavlry and avoiding to get yours killed by the enemy mounted units, your were choosing carefully the Quality of the Units you were engaging, trying to Keep the best for the last melee, which often enough was started after the cavalry got bogged down by another and you send more and more in to win the local Engagement, which become the main one… engaging the strategic reserve at the Right Point and moment during the main melee was most of the time critical to win the battle. Keeping your line straight and compact was also critical: often enough you were Winning by protecting your flanks well and by puncturing the enemy line, sending your last reserve through it and terrorising the rest of the enemy Units by running your last available cavalry behind the tired and depleted enemy infantry line.

and this is, up to my Knowledge, as realistic as it can get in a medieval war-game.

those were Long, tiring, but terribly beautyful games… sometimes with 4vs4 generals and lot of troops on the field.

All this by commanding your troops ON THE FIELD, by entering the melee at the crucial Moment and killing with your Hand the enemy king :smile: I know what you are thinking, this is M&B after all, not total war... but one can have BOTH :wink:

IMHO it makes lot of fun MORE to have a more realistic morale System. Or a Chance to trigger it :smile:
 

JustinTime49

Sergeant
Best answers
0
Deer said:
Beron said:
Reuven said:
Deer said:
Would also be interesting with a shock-effect from getting flanked or hit by heavy cavalry
That would be good, like in Total War.
but this is all the important Thing about manouvering, and it's missing  :sad:
what is the Point of outflanking, or Managing a charge from behind, if it does not affect morale?!

without an influence of flanking on morale , all goes down to: higher killing, higher morale, so you just have to have the best troops, and rush them straight on. Is it fun?  :facepalm:

and what About Fatigue? and lower/higher gorund? and surprise if hidden troops jump at you from a forest?

@ Callum: sorry for the rant, but do you see any Chance of implementing a morale modifier which depends on being flanked? it cannot be so difficult, total war has it since 20 years, shadow of the horned rat evn longer…
the other Points, like Fatigue/lower Ground/surprise, any Chance? Maybe by modding?
I disagree. There are tons of reasons for manouvering: shooting them in the back, hitting them in the back (shield is only facing forward), hammering through on chargers to break up a tight formation from the rear. Uhh, lancing them in the back.. Positioning counts, already did back in MB1
I know what you're trying to say, and while I agree with flanking archers, you have to realize that unlike total war M&B is heavily based on individual AI. Even in tight formations, flanking troops won't really be flanking because if the AI are given "face enemy" command, it looks for the nearest enemy which may be behind them, which on top of having no penalty for being flanked allows the AI to successfully fight on two fronts. Also, in bannerlord cav is able to hammer through the front anyways, and from what is seen from the AI lances are longer than spears so lancing in front doesn't differ from lancing from behind.