Dear Callum

[MrDayz]

This thread has proved that. We have Callum the voice of TW saying one thing, and Mexxico a developer saying something else.

I do not think that what Callum and mexxico say are in contradiction with each other. Callum basically says that Taleworlds is going to keep its promise to implement the features they advertised. On the other side, Mexxico says that they are %90 done and they will do balancing and adding a few more contents (which I believe refer to the features that are advertised yet missing at the moment). As @Telyon presented above, the road-map of Taleworlds fully confirms the both sides. Road-map suggests that Taleworlds is planning to polish the game and nothing else. Neither mexxico nor Callum talks about the novelties people are burning to see. All of them refer to more or less the same thing, the only difference being that Callum does it tacitly.

 

[Talbrys]

I do not think that what Callum and mexxico say are in contradiction with each other. Callum basically says that Taleworlds is going to keep its promise to implement the features they advertised. On the other side, Mexxico says that they are %90 done and they will do balancing and adding a few more contents (which I believe refer to the features that are advertised yet missing at the moment). As @Telyon presented above, the road-map of Taleworlds fully confirms the both sides. Road-map suggests that Taleworlds is planning to polish the game and nothing else. Neither mexxico nor Callum talks about the novelties people are burning to see. All of them refer to more or less the same thing, the only difference being that Callum does it tacitly.

I don't think you and I actually disagree then on anything other than how much of the game these features are considered.

 

[markp27]

I do not think that what Callum and mexxico say are in contradiction with each other. Callum basically says that Taleworlds is going to keep its promise to implement the features they advertised. On the other side, Mexxico says that they are %90 done and they will do balancing and adding a few more contents (which I believe refer to the features that are advertised yet missing at the moment). As @Telyon presented above, the road-map of Taleworlds fully confirms the both sides. Road-map suggests that Taleworlds is planning to polish the game and nothing else. Neither mexxico nor Callum talks about the novelties people are burning to see. All of them refer to more or less the same thing, the only difference being that Callum does it tacitly.

There you and I will have to disagree, as I believe that the features left to add is more than 10% of the game. Either that or they are deliberately delaying the full release of the game.

 

[mexxico]

I do not think that what Callum and mexxico say are in contradiction with each other. Callum basically says that Taleworlds is going to keep its promise to implement the features they advertised. On the other side, Mexxico says that they are %90 done and they will do balancing and adding a few more contents (which I believe refer to the features that are advertised yet missing at the moment). As @Telyon presented above, the road-map of Taleworlds fully confirms the both sides. Road-map suggests that Taleworlds is planning to polish the game and nothing else. Neither mexxico nor Callum talks about the novelties people are burning to see. All of them refer to more or less the same thing, the only difference being that Callum does it tacitly.

Correction : I did not said anywhere 90% is done. I only said 90% of coding is done (while discussing refactor issues) Its very hard for me to give a percentage for contents I can give information about my responsible areas not all game.

 

[Lord of Banners]

Correction : I did not said anywhere 90% is done. I only said 90% of coding is done (while discussing refactor issues) Its very hard for me to give a percentage for contents I can give information about my responsible areas not all game.

Thanks for clearing that up Mexxico and thanks for all the bug fixing and communication!

 

[Memoefe]

Correction : I did not said anywhere 90% is done. I only said 90% of coding is done (while discussing refactor issues) Its very hard for me to give a percentage for contents I can give information about my responsible areas not all game.

And then people are angry about why they don't receive more information while sharing all kinds of miss information that are 'devs words'

 

[Rycon Caldestan]

And then people are angry about why they don't receive more information while sharing all kinds of miss information that are 'devs words'

Yea, no kidding. I get frustrated reading misinformation and BS that people take out of context, I can’t imagine how the Dev’s feel when that constantly happens. ? to @mexxico, @Callum and dev team. I really enjoyed the communication level last week. Please don’t let some ruin it for all
Enjoying the improvements and looking forward to testing the next patch whenever it happens.

 

[markp27]

And then people are angry about why they don't receive more information while sharing all kinds of miss information that are 'devs words'

Yea, no kidding. I get frustrated reading misinformation and BS that people take out of context, I can’t imagine how the Dev’s feel when that constantly happens. ? to @mexxico, @Callum and dev team. I really enjoyed the communication level last week. Please don’t let some ruin it for all
Enjoying the improvements and looking forward to testing the next patch whenever it happens.

The problem is often in wording. As I have stated earlier in this thread Callum put up two posts, the first one was left open for interpretation and the second was not. The same could be said of Mexxico's posts. Being clear and concise on a medium such as a forum is important. By putting up how an individual read the post has helped clarify the point as Mexxico and Callum have both come in and been more concise.

Attacking for people how they read something does no good for the community. It will put people off posting.

 

[Blood Gryphon]

The problem is often in wording. As I have stated earlier in this thread Callum put up two posts, the first one was left open for interpretation and the second was not. The same could be said of Mexxico's posts. Being clear and concise on a medium such as a forum is important. By putting up how an individual read the post has helped clarify the point as Mexxico and Callum have both come in and been more concise.

Attacking for people how they read something does no good for the community. It will put people off posting.

Its not about how people read it, its that they feel they can quote the Dev's without literally quoting one of their posts and making a shorthanded summary of what they think the dev said. IF you are going to evoke a devs name claiming something, take the time to go find the actual post and quote it, otherwise you forum trolls waste all day arguing what someone thought the "devs said". I am just as guilty.

 

[Sigaretovic]

You knowingly bought an unfinished game and now you are complaining that it is unfinished. You could have not bought it, or you could have waited, but you didn't want to do that. So now you no life play the game you claim to hate and spend the other 6 hours of the day harassing the devs on the forums. They'll probably just stop communicating, no point in trying to reason with this. Won't be the first time I've seen a few people ruin it for everyone. I know a lot of us are still under lockdown but do yourself a favor, take a break, go outside, find something else to do for a week a two.

I love you for this post.

Anyway... I get it that a lot of you are wondering whats going to happen with this game, but give the devs a break from this ****storm of negativity. Stop playing and whining if you don't like it! I have no idea what coding is like and I'm guessing most of you don't have a clue either (judging by your comments at least). I mean one of you even said something like 'how come the modders van pull things off that you didn't?' that's hardly fair isn't it? It's probably 'easier' to rework something while the foundation is solid, rather then actually making a stable foundation.

Furthermore I understand that some of you spoiled brats aren't happy with that the dev team didn't implement your wishes. But get over it. It's their choice. Just like it was your choice to buy the game even though you knew they ignored your wishes. And now you're complaining? You guys make me sick.

 

[markp27]

Its not about how people read it, its that they feel they can quote the Dev's without literally quoting one of their posts and making a shorthanded summary of what they think the dev said. IF you are going to evoke a devs name claiming something, take the time to go find the actual post and quote it, otherwise you forum trolls waste all day arguing what someone thought the "devs said". I am just as guilty.

The question is, when did I become a troll? I can bring up just as many posts where I have defended TW, as to those where I have attacked them. Calling people a troll just because they disagree with certain elements of the way the game is developing, does not make them a troll.

As to your reply, I would highly disagree. Wording is everything on a forum.

Definition of Internet Troll from urban dictionary:

An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum or chat room, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.

Do you notice the line where it states that the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response?

That clearly defines yourself, by calling people trolls when it is not their intention to be so.

 

[Blood Gryphon]

The question is, when did I become a troll? I can bring up just as many posts where I have defended TW, as to those where I have attacked them. Calling people a troll just because they disagree with certain elements of the way the game is developing, does not make them a troll.

As to your reply, I would highly disagree. Wording is everything on a forum.

Definition of Internet Troll from urban dictionary:

An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum or chat room, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.

Do you notice the line where it states that the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response?

That clearly defines yourself, by calling people trolls when it is not their intention to be so.

It was plural and did not reference you specifically mark (so if you think it applies to you it does and if you think it doesn't, it doesn't) and more a reference to the folks in the forum who go back and forth on what "devs said" without every quoting them and doing the actual research. LOL also thanks for dropping the definitely in here ?, did you read the next line where I said I am just as guilty?

As far as devs stating things clearly, look english is not most of their first language as they are a turkish company in Turkey. Its probably the reason why we have so little interaction from a lot of the developers because just like we are talking about if they don't say things perfectly they can be misunderstood. This is why you see callum give us the typical conservative PR answer and why you see Mexxico give us answers but it doesn't always translate over exactly as he means it. People not just using their original quote and forcing them to come clarify is a WASTE of their time, as much as i love Mexxico and his openness, its time he's having to waste trying to explain his thoughts to people who arent giving him the time to actually read his post. You got us no new information that wasn't already available if you just searched like I said to you in my first post to you.

They will be putting out dev updates soon. Maybe do a little searching on Callums post history before making threads like this.

In the end all I'm saying is people need to use the search function to find the quotes from devs they are referencing for the sake of everyone else not being misinformed.

 

[markp27]

It was plural and did not reference you specifically mark (so if you think it applies to you it does and if you think it doesn't, it doesn't) and more a reference to the folks in the forum who go back and forth on what "devs said" without every quoting them and doing the actual research. LOL also thanks for dropping the definitely in here ?, did you read the next line where I said I am just as guilty?

As far as devs stating things clearly, look english is not most of their first language as they are a turkish company in Turkey. Its probably the reason why we have so little interaction from a lot of the developers because just like we are talking about if they don't say things perfectly they can be misunderstood. This is why you see callum give us the typical conservative PR answer and why you see Mexxico give us answers but it doesn't always translate over exactly as he means it. People not just using their original quote and forcing them to come clarify is a WASTE of their time, as much as i love Mexxico and his openness, its time he's having to waste trying to explain his thoughts to people who arent giving him the time to actually read his post. You got us no new information that wasn't already available if you just searched like I said to you in my first post to you.



In the end all I'm saying is people need to use the search function to find the quotes from devs they are referencing for the sake of everyone else not being misinformed.

Your quote was in reference to what I wrote, therefore the statement was to me. That was how I viewed the post, or are you now saying that clearly defining your meaning now is important?

As to many of the developers not speaking English as their natural language, that is easily resolved by employing 1 Community Manager (Callum) and 2 Assistant Community Managers (preferably you would have 1 European manager, 1 Australian manager and 1 from America). Covering all time zones, this way they can keep an eye on the forums and help clarify points for the developers.

As to what I got out of the conversation, it gave me a direct quote from Callum with his beliefs. This was what the thread was about, a 2 line reply that clearly defined the developers view.

 

[Blood Gryphon]

Your quote was in reference to what I wrote, therefore the statement was to me. That was how I viewed the post, or are you now saying that clearly defining your meaning now is important?

As to many of the developers not speaking English as their natural language, that is easily resolved by employing 1 Community Manager (Callum) and 2 Assistant Community Managers (preferably you would have 1 European manager, 1 Australian manager and 1 from America). Covering all time zones, this way they can keep an eye on the forums and help clarify points for the developers.

As to what I got out of the conversation, it gave me a direct quote from Callum with his beliefs. This was what the thread was about, a 2 line reply that clearly defined the developers view.

Its a forum post not a direct message, i assume multiple people will read it and are open to reply. If I use the plural form, I'm talking about multiple people not just you. I also used a conditional statement saying "if you claim to be quoting the devs" before the thing you think im implying of you? As far as i know you havent done that (you just asked questions), hence i made a plural statement about it. Again if you read what i wrote you could come to the correct conclusion, but you failed to read it correctly so i had to WASTE my time correcting you (lucky for us I'm not developing the game). His reply was in the EA statement on the steam store page.....

 

[sniparsexe]

It's okay guys, they'll release everything at once when they finish everything

Joke but it would be hilarous

 

[PGtips2012]

Funny again and again that people think their opinion is the one of "the community". Do you have any proof besides of perhaps some people in this forum that backs your argumet?Because if you look at steam the ratings are still pretty positive so i would think that most people are fine with the game and how it is handled.

I don't agree with the aggressive tone of the post but claiming that people are fine with the game is just disingenuous, especially when you look at how steeply the playerbase dropped off. The lack of new content/features is something that most are worried about. Sure the initial steam reviews were good and the game was exciting at launch but you can see how enthusiasm has dwindled

 

[Noschkov]

I don't agree with the aggressive tone of the post but claiming that people are fine with the game is just disingenuous, especially when you look at how steeply the playerbase dropped off. The lack of new content/features is something that most are worried about. Sure the initial steam reviews were good and the game was exciting at launch but you can see how enthusiasm has dwindled

Sure the playerbase dropped but not faster then in many other games which released at the same time. For example take Doom eternal(Playerbase of around 4 k now. They also started with around 105k players. Same for Ori and the will of the Wisp(60k --> unter 1k now) and so on. It is no unusual thing that games loose players after release. I think the mainreason why people expect other numbers right now are missing Mods(which we can get with the release of modding tools) but until then we should see Bannerlord like all other mostly singleplayergames. When players got their hours(some more some less) they will stop playing and go on to other games or wait till new features come out. I have done the same i played for some time and now i am only watching the forums and wait what we get to see in the future. My point is simply that it is no signal if people like a game or not when you only look at the player numbers because they develop nearly the same in most games. If you want a picture of the opinion in the playerbase look at review-scores. They are the best indicator in my opinion because they cover a larger sample size then the forums. Also when you just watch the forums you will see more negative posts compared to other sources because most people won't post when they have nothing to complain about.

 

[PGtips2012]

they will stop playing and go on to other games or wait till new features come out.

Right, except the new features never came so player numbers dwindled. Also your comparisons are not very good because those game are linear and story based, ie you play it once and there’s more or less nothing left to see. Find me another sandbox game that has numbers drop as steeply. Reviews may not have changed much from the initial honeymoon period but that’s more to do with a dispassionate playerbase than a satisfied one. If you think it’s just the forum then look at reddit posts and steam discussions, people are frustrated with the stagnant state of the game

 

[babelfisch]

Sure the playerbase dropped but not faster then in many other games which released at the same time. For example take Doom eternal(Playerbase of around 4 k now. They also started with around 105k players. Same for Ori and the will of the Wisp(60k --> unter 1k now) and so on. It is no unusual thing that games loose players after release. I think the mainreason why people expect other numbers right now are missing Mods(which we can get with the release of modding tools) but until then we should see Bannerlord like all other mostly singleplayergames. When players got their hours(some more some less) they will stop playing and go on to other games or wait till new features come out. I have done the same i played for some time and now i am only watching the forums and wait what we get to see in the future. My point is simply that it is no signal if people like a game or not when you only look at the player numbers because they develop nearly the same in most games. If you want a picture of the opinion in the playerbase look at review-scores. They are the best indicator in my opinion because they cover a larger sample size then the forums. Also when you just watch the forums you will see more negative posts compared to other sources because most people won't post when they have nothing to complain about.

+1

It's also important to point out that everyone waits for the release and plays the game ASAP. That's why you get high concurrent player numbers at release. They would only stay that high if everyone keeps the game running 24/7.
Remember that Steamcharts doesn't show the total active player base but the amount of people who are logged in at the same time.

 

[StewVader]

So we shouldn´t expect new content and only this "fix that bug, add this bug" updates?

I mean its been about 5 months. How could they put anything else into the game and have it ready by the 1 year mark? As you and I have both theorized, the game appears to be mostly complete, If Callum says they are on track for release in 1 year, not sure how anyone could see it any other way.


Imagine 5 months from now, when there is still no new content or features, just fixes and balances. I don't think any white knights or fan bois will be left by then. The forums will just be a barren wasteland.