Damage in this game is Ridiculous

Wyzilla

Veteran
WB
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Now, granted I normally mod the crap out of Warband and toy with the damage values on a regular basis, but I don't remember native warband being this ridiculous in terms of damage. Most melee weapons are sitting around at f*cking 60 cutting damage with swords, axes, etc, and maces can deal a whopping 50 damage. In Warband you are lucky to get your hands on a weapon that good that's two handed, and armor at least does something in native warband. In bannerlord however? It's expensive garbage that merely drags out your slim healthbar by an meager sliver. Why the hell are so many weapons not only so damaging, but able to deal damage what is supposed to be the toughest armor in the game? I even tried using the dummy max value heavy armor and it still wouldn't protect me from looters throwing rocks, or basic melee strikes from some of the weakest melee units in the game. Why the hell is fodder able to counter elite units like Catpahracts, when the entire purpose of such units is that they are essentially invulnerable to fodder with no armor and wielding one handed weapons with no shields? Arrows likewise are absolutely ridiculous, as are missile weapons in general, to the point that there really is no point to ever get in melee. You will get swarmed by the cheapest and most garbage infantry swiftly and cut down regardless of how "good" your equipment is, and you're basically screwed as soon as you run out of ammo for your missile weapon of choice. Considering this is supposed to coexist with permadeath, the current lethality in bannerlord is ridiculous. And not just for a basic character level, but for gameplay as well. Being able to hack apart even the toughest units or characters with just a couple hits isn't fun, it's goddamn boring. There's no such thing as a lengthy good fight with the bots even on hard, as one of you will go down in just a couple hits despite wearing armor that should render you impregnable to most basic weapons.

Please, for the love of god, either nerf the damage of every weapon in SP into the ground to make fights drag out for an actual length of time instead of these ridiculous anime-esque battles with people wielding lightsabers disguised as arming swords, or at least give us the modding tools (or just module armor soak and armor reduction values to damage) to do it ourselves ASAP. I'm pretty much losing all interest in bannerlord for the time being until something is done, as the combat is just dull compared to Warband.
 

helari

Sergeant
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Are you hight? Warband was one hit city, glancing hits are more common in bannerlord if anything.
 

Dearmad

Veteran
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Opposite experience to OP and #2 poster for me.

taken many a rock today at most 5 or so points wearing robes
 

Danny D

Regular
M&BWBWF&SNW
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I have to disagree. Everyone has at least 100hp it feels like and sometimes you’ll overhead somebody and just do 4-10 dmg. Don’t even get me started on spears....
 

Diavolo

Knight
M&BWB
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The high damage seems to fit with how 100 health seems to be the norm in this game compared to 50 which was the most common in warband. (So divide bannerlord dmg values by 2 to get what it means in warband) so this 50 dmg sword is actually a 25 damage sword. So you have two handed swords with 120 damage in bannerlord, (60 in warband) but then also Spears with 26 (13 warband damage). To me it seems more that Spears are super **** for some reason, and two handed swords are amazing. Since it seems like they have balanced spear dmg on how spears are often used on horse and then you get speed bonus.
 

Dianoctis

Recruit
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I don't know what game you're playing but I go through villagers that throw rocks at me like butter and they don't do any damage to me.

You can disable permadeath or you can make the damage output to player to very easy
Also its not anime to have a 1hit one kill weapon you know. It's actually realistic xD.
Even if it doesn't cut you a big 2 handed axe to the head can damage your helmet so much it will go through your skull.

However I think that it's dumb that a lord can survive a spear through the head but if you're dead once that's it, no chance of a knockdown

Just take it as hardcore difficulty. You don't have to activate permadeath if it annoys you.
 

SkarJino

Recruit
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the pumped up weapon damage exists because of the abscence of power strike,power draw, etc. if you compare the damage that you deal before with maxed power strike vs now with all the damage perks for a weapon, bannerlords damage actually ends up being lower. the reason why you are seeing higher damage outputs is because the momentum system actually works now hence why people complain about looter stones when in fact it only ever deals high damage when you are galloping towards the thrower at full speed. I actually see this as a good balance as it lessens the "superhuman" feeling of some troops. realistically, a group of average joes throwing rocks (keep in mind this rocks are huge based on the in game model and not just pebbles) on an elite soldier dumb enough to ride towards him at full speed should take significantly more damage.

with this in mind, the damage goes like this:

bannerlord damage with well used momentum >> warband damage with pumped up power stats > bannerlord actual damage values

if you want to try this out use a throwing weapon (javelins preferred) throw it at a stationary target then throw it at an enemy riding towards you on full speed. youll notice that the damage is significantly weaker on the stationary target (weaker than warband damage values with 10 in power throw)
while the second shot would potentially one shot most heavy cav (impossible to one shot heavy cavs running towards you even with power throw 10 on warband)

as for the OP's concern, attack placement and proper movements matters a lot more now as this is what affects the momentum damage increases.
 

Niewitch1

Recruit
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with any bow and arrow, could not pierce plate armor. There are even youtube channel, where they test medieval weapons and armors
 

SkarJino

Recruit
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with any bow and arrow, could not pierce plate armor. There are even youtube channel, where they test medieval weapons and armors
ofcourse this has something to do with game balance. do you think it would be fun if you were the archer and an invincible cataphract massacres you and your troops? 😅
 

Niewitch1

Recruit
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ofcourse this has something to do with game balance. do you think it would be fun if you were the archer and an invincible cataphract massacres you and your troops? 😅
yeah, just saying :grin: But there could be several balances to be done
 

TomaSkTemplar

Regular
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compared to warband, they doubled damage and health, but not armor.

What that means, is that armor is half-effective compared to WB.
Double the armor amount of all armor and you get similar results. (shoulder piece is extra, but no head armor)

As for a lack of power strikes, or power draw, your weapon skill, proficiency does this already. It did not disappear. Power strike is tied to your weapon skill. Best percentages come with 2 handed.

Bows, throwing also increase in power with skill, crossbow, not.

What is very unrealistic is missile speeds. Ingame you can exceed 100 m/s impact speed and that is not counting horses riding at motorcycle speeds all adding up, as there seems to be not much in air resistance to halt the speedy arrows.

Longbow tests showed some 55 meters per second.
Big crossbows with heavy bolts had similar velocity. Lighter (way heavier than arrows) ones were reaching 60 meters per second near the xbow.

This is what adds to the mix of need for speed horses and bullet-like bows, crossbows.

Looters shooting rocks at 40 meters per second ? Isnt that a bit over the top ?
 

SkarJino

Recruit
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8 angry peasants would F up a Knight in RL
idk if sarcastic but even a single well placed stone throw with proper momentum on a fully plated knights head could cause blunt force trauma that could effectively make him dizzy atleast. what more 10 stones coming at you. it could potentially knock you out
 

SkarJino

Recruit
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yeah, just saying :grin: But there could be several balances to be done
that i agree with.
Yeah. But in BL 3 peasants are enough to F up any elite unit. But that's another issue tbh
perhaps what they should focus on is making stones 100% knocked out only. i have had elite units DIE from these but you're not really gonna take life threatening damage from stones when in armor knocked out yes but dying is a big no no
 

iimstevo

Recruit
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The problem is armour, that's it.
Weapons should be lethal. If you're sat wearing a t-shirt and joggers (essentially peasant gear), and someone swings a sword at your chest, you're going to be fatally wounded most likely from one swing.

Now if I'm not mistaken, plate armour was effective at preventing slashing and cutting. It wasn't as effective at preventing piercing damage - and Chainmail was effective at preventing piercing damage, but could easily (in regards to what it actually is) be broken by excessive slashing and cutting.
EDIT: YES I WAS MISTAKEN PLEASE STOP QUOTING IT WEEKS LATER JUST TO CORRECT ME

So... there's the problem;
1. No Armour prevents mortal wounding to the point where a single slash, or single arrow, cannot actually kill a target (unless headshot).
2. Plate Armour doesn't prevent slashing damage much, its barely different than having no armour.
3. Chain Armour doesn't prevent piercing damage any more than plate armour would, which is essentially the same as having no armour on.

All in all;
Armour is broken.
 
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TomaSkTemplar

Regular
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So... there's the problem;
1. No Armour prevents mortal wounding to the point where a single slash, or single arrow, cannot actually kill a target (unless headshot).
2. Plate Armour doesn't prevent slashing damage much, its barely different than having no armour.
3. Chain Armour doesn't prevent piercing damage any more than plate armour would, which is essentially the same as having no armour on.
1. Why wear helmet when it doesnt protect from a headshot ? It means the helmet is gfood enough to protect the wearer or its a waste weight. Helmets thus should protect form headshots, when they are good enough and not open.
2. Armour values have been almost literally taken from warband. Damage and HP rose twice. Armour values did not scale and as such, armor values are too low.
3. Chain armour is definitely not better at sustaining arrow hits than more modern brigandines or plate. Chain armour was in some cases able to make some projectiles penetrate, that otherwise would bounce, because the rings helped hold the arrow or bolt in place that without the guide of the armor ring would only bounce from cloth armour. As such, the chain acted as a guide for better armour penetration. It depends on the projectiles of course. Some cut through cloth, some bounced, some were better vs plate armour. You simply did not have a generalist type of arrow or boltheads unless the projectiles were carrying way too much energy for any armour anyway.
 

Niewitch1

Recruit
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actually plate armors was very rare. Normally used by knights, so lords and roalty, armies had very few heavily armored troops. Those were very expensive like medieval tanks. Most medieval troops was lightly and medium armored. Mostly knights died blunt trauma. Swords, bows, etc, could not pierce heavy armor. Blunt force was needed to make internal damage. Added armor also meant slow acting
 
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froggyluv

Master Knight
NW
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damage is damage (hows that for cpt obvious). Ive never held a blade of any kind in any meaningful way except to slice an orange or butter my bread -but im ssure i could do alot of damage to someone should i land the hit. I got a buddy who teaches that Bali style knife fighting at a world class level -he knows exactly where the knives would inflict lethal damage and I would no doubt lose a knife fight to him.

The game needs to be played out in the 'who has the skill to hit who better' field - and show it in real time. faster swings, better blocks, evasive footwork for the champion fighters. The opposite for feeble fighters.