Daggers need some love

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Reiksmarshal

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
Lol.. exactly you just can't have your daggers dangling unprotected!

But yeah the low hanging fruit that TW could improve is dagger thrust speed and sheaths for them daggers.
 
Seems like some good ideas. +1

Also, was it not common in the middle age for you to carry a dagger that you could pierce through the hole of an enemy's helmet?
 

Askorti

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WB
Bannerlord covers and fictionalizes an approximate time period in which daggers as an off-hand weapon weren't common. Sure, you would carry one around town as a self-defense tool, but it would only ever come up as a tertiary back-up on a battlefield. Basically the kind of thing you pull out when all else failed and **** hit the fan.

I think people would do well to stop romanticising daggers as somehow a viable weapon of offense that could reasonably be picked over something else. Sure, there are scenarios where a dagger is the right tool for the job, but it's rarely on the battlefield, and M&B does not simulate such situations in any way.
 

Ted Striker

Veteran
I think people would do well to stop romanticising daggers as somehow a viable weapon of offense that could reasonably be picked over something else. Sure, there are scenarios where a dagger is the right tool for the job, but it's rarely on the battlefield, and M&B does not simulate such situations in any way.
Peoples' views are built by videogames. It's the same reason people think duel wielding in real life is something that can give an advantage, or that you can cut through metal armor with a katana. Or even that you can easily parry an attack from a mace or warhammer with a sword without gripping it in both hands.

Bannerlord is a videogame as well but at least it's trying to simulate real life when it can (with varying success, I mean it is a game after all).
 

Reiksmarshal

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
I never took Bannerlord for period accuracy since there are armors that would be at least 1000 years out of period for some factions. This is a fantasy game in a fantasy world where swords do cut through meatal armor like it is paper. That said I do agree about the comments on duel wielding, but the main purpose of this thread was maybe get a little attention for daggers. Maybe get sheathes for them and some improved rogue/bandit game play improvements, as it stands now you can do more melee damage with throwing weapons because of the flexible fighter perk.

The rogue perk tree would have been an interesting way to improve daggers for thief type builds by adding back stabbing/sneak attacks for missions. Maybe have a perk that improve dagger fighting as daggers/knives are one of the most archaeological found weapons/tools from the period this game roughly is inspired by.
 
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Ted Striker

Veteran
Daggers might find some use in towns and castles when in civilian clothing, if there was gameplay to support more clandestine quests and whatnot.

But not on the battlefield.
 

Reiksmarshal

Sergeant Knight at Arms
WBWF&SNWVC
Maybe once the bandit system is fully implemented there will be things like assassination missions. As of now there are serval quests that they could be useful specially street brawl and gang fights.
 
fUxXl8h.jpg

Daggers has always been a weapon I have enjoyed in RPGs, but in Bannerlord they really don't have a purpose other than for role playing reasons. That said just want to see what others thoughts are on the subject and thrown down some ideas and put it in the suggestion thread if we come up with some vetted ideas. Here are some of my thoughts on the topic of improving daggers in the game.

Dagger Sheaths

It would be nice if daggers had sheaths, looks bad when they just hang unsheathe on your side. This would be a nice little touch to fleshing this unfinished weapon out, plus having a dagger sheath looks cool when next to a sword sheath like what knights often wore together. They just look terrible without them and the main reason I don't use them. I just go with throwing knives since they have a case.

Back Stabbing

Let’s bring back stabbing back to the series and maybe just limit it to daggers to simulate finding the chinks in armor.

Dagger Thrust Speed

This is something that should be improved as well as they are kind of slow and would make them more appealing for rogue missions.

Better Melee Stats vs Throwning Knives

One of the things daggers should have over throwing knives is better melee stats, currently they are about the same which is another reason to just take throwing knives over a dagger. A dagger should be superior to throwing knives used as a melee weapon as they are weighed differently and are designed for close combat.

Rogue Tree Perks

There should be some rogue perks that improve dagger fighting to encourage their use in missions and thug battles. Daggers should be nasty if the player puts in the time to develop a character to use them. For example they could be nice for an archer character that wants to keep their gear light to be able to move fast on the battle field.

Off-hand Dagger

There should be an off-hand dagger that equips in the shield slot, the player would still block with their main right hand weapon, however the off-hand dagger would use the shield bash attack for a quick stab attack with the off-hand weapon and not to mention it would look badass.

These are just my ideas on how daggers could be improved in Bannerlord and used as a viable weapon for rogue type characters. Any thoughts?
That...would be fun. Daggers were actually quite useful in battle, because simply punching through plate is impossible. Going around it with a nice slim stileto is the way to go.
Besides, this game needs...fun. Like a wife that runs out with meat cleavers and tears stuff up, or other cool stuff. A ton of basically the same units is boring.
Like it's a big upgrade to go from riding a horse to riding a dragon, but just switching steppe horses for aserai horses...eh.

 
The gaps in armor are too small to aim at
the crux of the matter is choosing a hurtboxes size to hit that is neither too small nor too large.
and just simulating it by registering hits in the general area would lead to cheesing it and the game has enough cheese
Precisely to avoid this I suggest changing the number and size of the hurtboxes, making sure that the joints (not covered by armor) are small and localized enough to be difficult but not impossible to hit but that they do not offer protection and that those that can be covered ( most) have strong protection.
It would have to be something like a move that grapples your target and uses the dagger after, but again it would lead to so much cheese
suggestion:
If you aim for the legs (both bare knees) and inflict enough damage, the enemy could fall and at that point you could start a melee where you stab him.
After all, if an enemy ends up on the ground and we remain standing, the only difficult thing would be to aim at a very precise joint, thus risking hitting parts of the armor.
In this case, however, with a key you start a melee, where you extract the knife and you are about to plant it on a vital patrte discovered while the enemy grabs the blade to avoid dying, and here you have to press a few keys or a sequence or repeatedly a key to win over the strength of the enemy.
If you succeed the enemy is stabbed, if instead he fails he drives you away by stunning you and gets up before you can resume to attack him (in such a way as to get up with confidence).

So if the knees are covered, then you have to hit it many more times to land it (so you could decide to give up the use of this mechanic to come out victorious).
Or you have to knock it down with other methods.
Lacking certain movement mechanics (such as step-dodge), it's hard to come up with knockdown mechanics that don't use kick or shield bash.
With a step dodge (mainly movement and defensive mechanics), you could use it together with kick or shield bash to take down an already weakened enemy.
The animation would not be fast (as it would require the use of two mechanics: step-dodge + kick or step-dodge + shield bash), which would make it dodge or parable (although it would inflict a knockback which however does not give any advantage other than the repositioning of those affected).
In this case the probability of knocking down would be proportional to the target's missing life points (although you can choose some other more suitable condition to knock him down)
Thus the more you weaken the opponent, the more likely you are to knock him down and take him out.
 

htlaets

Recruit
fUxXl8h.jpg

Daggers has always been a weapon I have enjoyed in RPGs, but in Bannerlord they really don't have a purpose other than for role playing reasons. That said just want to see what others thoughts are on the subject and thrown down some ideas and put it in the suggestion thread if we come up with some vetted ideas. Here are some of my thoughts on the topic of improving daggers in the game.

Dagger Sheaths

It would be nice if daggers had sheaths, looks bad when they just hang unsheathe on your side. This would be a nice little touch to fleshing this unfinished weapon out, plus having a dagger sheath looks cool when next to a sword sheath like what knights often wore together. They just look terrible without them and the main reason I don't use them. I just go with throwing knives since they have a case.

Back Stabbing

Let’s bring back stabbing back to the series and maybe just limit it to daggers to simulate finding the chinks in armor.

Dagger Thrust Speed

This is something that should be improved as well as they are kind of slow and would make them more appealing for rogue missions.

Better Melee Stats vs Throwning Knives

One of the things daggers should have over throwing knives is better melee stats, currently they are about the same which is another reason to just take throwing knives over a dagger. A dagger should be superior to throwing knives used as a melee weapon as they are weighed differently and are designed for close combat.

Rogue Tree Perks

There should be some rogue perks that improve dagger fighting to encourage their use in missions and thug battles. Daggers should be nasty if the player puts in the time to develop a character to use them. For example they could be nice for an archer character that wants to keep their gear light to be able to move fast on the battle field.

Off-hand Dagger

There should be an off-hand dagger that equips in the shield slot, the player would still block with their main right hand weapon, however the off-hand dagger would use the shield bash attack for a quick stab attack with the off-hand weapon and not to mention it would look badass.

These are just my ideas on how daggers could be improved in Bannerlord and used as a viable weapon for rogue type characters. Any thoughts?

I'm all for sheaths for daggers. You don't want them exposed to the elements like that, you gotta sheathe them.
i have recommended a extra "small weapon slot" only for dagger/knife. Thats the real advantage of this weapon, its not burdening and hinder any of the normal weapon slots, you always have it with you, no matter how much you experiment with your weapon sets, the dagger is on you as a last resort weapon or very close quarter combat. It would even make it more useful when weapons could break suddenly.
 

Occyfel

Veteran
Yeah sheathes sound good, if BL can have more rogue gameplay then I reckon daggers would have a nice place in the game.
 
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