Competitive Random Plains, Calling all map makers!!!

[Orion]

"Aw, Mad Dawg chose random plains again. Does everyone have the random plains mod installed so we can get a random map?"

You don't have to install mods client-side to play on custom Native maps. The server would run a native-compatible mod to make the maps available, but that's the only effort required. The hardest part is getting server owners to put the maps on their servers.

[Edit]

I'm working on a simple concept for an open map which mixes things that can be found on random plains (and a few other things) together to make a cav-friendly map that isn't wide-open. I'm drawing up 2 versions of it, one with a river and one without. The version without a river is obviously more cav-friendly, and I think it's better overall, but the version with the river would lead to interesting open-map battles that are archer/infantry heavy I think.

隐藏: River Version

 

隐藏: Valley Version

 

The valleys/deep rivers may have slopes steep enough for cliffs, but not more. The hills would be gentle and rolling, with sparse trees. Clusters of trees would be found at the bases of the hills towards the center, and at the edges of the valleys closest to spawns. There would be an MotF spawn in the exact center, as well as equidistant from both spawns in opposing corners. The maps cannot be entirely controlled by cavalry because of reduced mobility, but the MotF positions are in relatively flat, open areas so cavalry is still meaningful (except for center MotF spawns on the river version). It would be possible for infantry & archers to take a position that gives them a fair shot at one MotF and the ability to fight for another.

Images are obviously not drawn to scale.

Thoughts?

 

[Catholic]

I really like the above. I'd give deep analytical insight, but I'm rather tired.

/support.

 

[Mr.X]

Can you have a map pick that randomly chooses between the 5 plains maps that you make available? That way it's random, but all the maps are "acceptable"?

 

[Orion]

There's no need for this thread to die so soon.

I really like the above. I'd give deep analytical insight, but I'm rather tired.

/support.

Elaborate.

 

[Lord Rich]

I would be happy to make a few maps of this sort for you if you want, they don't take long. The only thing I would possibly ask is that if you want me to make something like the diagrams you posted, the hills symbols are really difficult to work with. Might be better if you remade them with gradient lines like on a real map since that's a lot easier to translate directly into a warband map.

 

[Orion]

Their exact placement isn't critical. What matters is that they would offer elevation changes at least the height of a horse, and would only be steep enough (at most) to slow horses to a trot if you went straight up the slope.

 

[MrNomNom]

beautiful picture, vincent van marnid. :')

 

[Lord Rich]

Ok I made a little prototype version, see what you think:

隐藏

scn_multi_scene_custom_13 multi_scene_custom_13 256 none none 0.000000 0.000000 100.000000 100.000000 -100.000000 0x00000001300389800003a4ea000058340000637a0000399b 
  0 
  0 
 outer_terrain_plain

http://www.mediafire.com/?nod6335fliit6i7

 

[unicorn]

On Unicorns_Oval_Office right now if anyone wants to see

 

[Asheila]

just out of curiosity, is it not possible to just mod the parameters that the "random map'" chooses to use?

 

[Vendigr]

Ok I made a little prototype version, see what you think:

隐藏

scn_multi_scene_custom_13 multi_scene_custom_13 256 none none 0.000000 0.000000 100.000000 100.000000 -100.000000 0x00000001300389800003a4ea000058340000637a0000399b 
  0 
  0 
 outer_terrain_plain

http://www.mediafire.com/?nod6335fliit6i7

...Damn. I was about 40% done with the same map

 

[MrNomNom]

Ok I made a little prototype version, see what you think:

隐藏

scn_multi_scene_custom_13 multi_scene_custom_13 256 none none 0.000000 0.000000 100.000000 100.000000 -100.000000 0x00000001300389800003a4ea000058340000637a0000399b 
  0 
  0 
 outer_terrain_plain

http://www.mediafire.com/?nod6335fliit6i7

A bit small.

 

[unicorn]

just out of curiosity, is it not possible to just mod the parameters that the "random map'" chooses to use?

Curious about this too ^

And yeah, if the map was a little larger, and if the river in the middle was a little deeper/wider that'd be ideal (at the moment horses can ride right through it)

 

[KoA John]

The top half of the map has quite fewer trees by the river in the middle than the bottom half

 

[Chaingun]

I endorse this project and it's great to see things moving. I love good random maps but 95% of the generated maps are just... too random/weird or otherwise imbalanced (too hilly or too flat, etc).

Some inspiration: One of the coolest random maps I ever saw was a large river dividing map in two halfs with a lake in the middle of it with a large island in the lake. Around it were fairly high hills, but not so absurdly steep that cav couldn't cross at a good rate.

If the flag spawns had all been on the island and if the island had have more trees/cover from archers it would've been perfect. As it was, the map suffered from random flag spawn syndrome, and infantry trying to fight for the island had a bit of a hard time against long distance fire.

 

[Vendigr]

Some inspiration: One of the coolest random maps I ever saw was a large river dividing map in two halfs with a lake in the middle of it with a large island in the lake. Around it were fairly high hills, but not so absurdly steep that cav couldn't cross at a good rate.

Just finished a map that's somewhat similar to that, also a lot like what Marnid suggested. I'll post it up with some screens if anyone's interested in taking a look: http://www.mediafire.com/?33i1xjvt7th1e53

Screenshots:

隐藏

(Ignore the flag in the third pic)

Terrain code:

scn_multi_river_valley multi_river_valley 256 none none 0.000000 0.000000 100.000000 100.000000 -100.000000 0x00000000300c93c800033cce000020d5000065c70000071b
  0
  0
outer_terrain_plain



I think it should be balanced, but I haven't gotten a chance to play test it yet. I tried to keep # of objects fairly low, but if anyone is having lag issues let me know... it is possible to "optimize" the map if that's necessary (I can run it fine). The river doesn't get any deeper than 1.7 meters, which is about chest height. It still slows you down significantly, and I figure we don't want to have underwater fighting in competitive maps anyway. Tried to make it pretty balanced between inf/cav/archer, but I have yet to see it played.

 

[Mr.X]

Might be better if the motf on the right side of the island was moved to team 1's side of the river, with some sort of slightly defensible thing around it, to parallel team 2's ruins motf spawn

 

[Vendigr]

Hmmm.. I did originally have it set up that way as it was on the diagram. But at the moment Team 1 can reach the center MotF faster than team 2 due to the river/ford set up, and gets a fairly well-defended position there. The MotF on the far right, in its current position, takes about the same amount of time for each team to reach.

Another thing to consider though is that the flag spawn is random anyway, and by 2:30 teams may be nowhere near where they started, assuming there isn't an obvious camping spot available.

 

[Orion]

Hmmm.. I did originally have it set up that way as it was on the diagram. But at the moment Team 1 can reach the center MotF faster than team 2 due to the river/ford set up, and gets a fairly well-defended position there. The MotF on the far right, in its current position, takes about the same amount of time for each team to reach.

You could also move the ford left (relative to your overview picture) to make it a straight shot into the middle for both teams, then move the right-hand MotF into the bottom-right corner to mirror the other side of the map. I drew up my little picture with mirroring in mind, because it's the simplest way to balance a map. Right now, from the middle island, the second spawn has more separated access points to their spawn, while spawn one has a straight path across a dry ford. I would move the bottom-right ford to the right, so that it connects the right-hand river banks past the island, and move spawn 2's right-hand middle island ford into a similar position as spawn 1's.

Spawn 1 seems sparse compared to spawn 2's windmill and slightly denser forestation.

On a positive note, I like your elevation variations and aesthetics. The addition of cliffs near map edges not only adds style to the map, but gives players a clear indication of where the map edges are. Maybe you could work something out for the corners that don't have cliffs (behind the spawns)? Hay fields with fences at the map edges, maybe?

 

[KoA John]

Hay fields with fences at the map edges, maybe?

*Shivers*

Port Assault hay 

Many bad memories