Companion build questions

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ripple

Knight
I've divided my companions into 3 categories:

1) Meleers
NPCs like Alayen and Firentis. I put all stat points into strength and agility and give them the best armour possible, at least 4 in riding so they can mount warhorses. All have shields, lances, and one handed weapons, except Matheld, to whom I give a 2-handed war sword because I read on these forums that some companions perform well with them--and indeed she has outpaced everyone else in the number of kills. All skill points are devoted to power strike, iron skin, shield, and weapon master. Extra points go into trainer.

Question: Is there a point in splitting their weapon points between polearm and 1-handed melee? I am using a mod that has Hatonastick's lancer script, so at least 90 percent of the time, the companions will start the battle using their lances (and will never use lances when on foot or during sieges). But I don't notice an increase in the number of kills with lances/1-handed weapon combo vs. just 1-handed weapon. Matheld is clearly a killing machine with her 2-handed war sword, and if they didn't need shields for siege assaults, I would have turned them all into 2-handed meleers.....

2) Mounted Range
Klethi, Rolf, and Baheshtur. Same as above, except instead of giving them lances, I max out throwing for Klethi and Rolf (because they start with ranks in throwing), and power draw/horse archery for Baheshtur. Klethi and Rolf gets heavy jarids while Baheshtur gets the best bow his power draw rank allows him to use. This category does not seem very effective in comparison to the meleers, at least not in terms of the number of kill. I noticed two interesting things in my testing: Baheshtur is basically useless when I order him to "follow me" on the battle field. Instead, when I order him to "charge", he will ride around the battlefield shooting his bow and get more kills. This is strange because I read some horse archery guide where the player advised putting horse archer companions in "follow me" mode. Klethi and Rolf will sometimes gain points in polearm skills, which is strange because I thought companions with throwing weapons will always exhaust their ammunition rather than use the last one as a melee weapon (I can only imagine they are using the jarids as melee weapons to have gained points in polearm, since their backup weapon are 1-handed swords). A drawback for companions in this category is that their skill points are spread across more skills than the meleers and there is never extra points to point towards anything else (eg. trainer).

Questions: Should I bother with this category or should I just turn them all into meleers?

3) Support
These are the companions I put at the bottom of the troop list, who I never want to send into combat. They each specialize in a set of party skills. Marnid in trading and persuasion, Katrin in looting, Artimenner in siege and tactics, Deshavi in spotting, pathfinding, and tracking, Jeremus and Ymira in healing skills (in case one of them falls in combat). Extra points into trainer. I boost their strength to 9 or 10 and give them the best armour they can use, then pray they last at least more than 30 seconds when one of them suddenly appears during siege battles. I give them crossbows and one-handed weapons + shield on back, except Deshavi, who gets a bow because she starts with ranks in power draw.

Question: bow or crossbow? Since it's unlikely any of them will ever get their power draw past 3 or 4, because I devote all of their stats points towards whatever stat is associated with their specialized party skill (usually intelligence, charisma, or agility), crossbow seems the better choice, no?
 
There's tons of ways you can do it, this is what I do. I give every companion a blunt (heavy war hammer when I find enough), a shield, a light crossbow (best xbow you can still shoot from horseback) and steel bolts, and a horse. Then I pick one party skill for them (a few have more). They end up being decent at melee, horse archery, and their specialty skill (Ymira my surgeon ends up the worst at fighting because she has 3 skills to work on, but she's still good in a fight). Nobody really ends up uber, but they're all pretty good at everything.
 
But any thoughts about my questions?

1) is there a point in splitting companions' weapon points between polearm and 1-handed melee?
2) should I bother cultivating throwing skills for companions?
3) for support companions who will likely not have more than 3 or 4 ranks in power draw, so I just dispense with power draw and give them crossbows?

I've read a ton of posts in these forums, about other people's companion builds (which is where I got most of my ideas like Matheld's 2-hander spec, horse archery for mounted throwers), crossbows vs. bows (which seems to center on how it works for the player's character, but not so much for companions), and companions with lances (which seems to be of no use for those playing native, since companions apparently don't switch weapons properly without the lancer script). Also I've made sure there are no overlaps in party skills (like 2 companions specializing in looting) because apparently it's useless (except trainer, which works different from other party skills). The only exception has been keeping two healers in the party (because eventually I intend to make Jeremus the minister).
 
1. pole arms are good for pole arm use (couch lancing) but they get weak in melee so you need a backup 1handed as well. same logic applies to 2-handed
2. throwing is kinda like a super far range melee weapon, not a true "ranged" weapon like bows a crossbows, its an okay addition to a pure infantry companion who doesn't ride a horse, but its not great due to lack of ammo in throwing weapons... they are very powerful though.
3. for support companions (jeremus/artimener/ect.) just use crossbows and don't waste points in power draw, they'll build their own proficiency (plus some help from you putting points there when they level up.) but that's for pure support companions, for pure archery/ranged you want bows, bows eventually get stronger than crossbows, crossbows just start out at an advantage.
 
Thanks for the reply. I enjoy this kind of micro management but I imagine this kind of stats gaming must be annoying to some people :smile:
 
@OP

This micromanagement/stats gaming/RPing...all in all "taking your time"...is what makes this game replayable and enjoyable. Well, to me at least.

1) Backup one-handed is necessary. I tend to give mounted companions the Jousting Lance as it is blunt...they do a fairly decent job of knocking folk out. I also like keeping them lance and board or sword and board, skipping two handers, to keep them alive longer in the field.

2) I'd say it is useful to have ranged companions, for sieges if for nothing else. Deshavi with a warbow, Bunduk with a siege crossbow, etc, end up doing quite a bit of damage during sieges for me. Mounted archery is always a bit sketchy...I tend to leave Bashetur to his own devices, but put the rest of the ranged companions in the Archers category and issue a "dismount" order at battle start.

3) Definitely crossbow.

Shingen 说:
Does the horse archery skill affect the accuracy of xbows for companions?

Yes. And throwing weapons while on horseback.
 
Caba`drin 说:
Yes. And throwing weapons while on horseback.

OK kewl. I didn't know if it was the horse archery skill, or just increasing their agility.

I generally just solo sea raiders until about lvl 25 and a training skill of 6ish before I even bother recruiting any companions. They die exceptionally well at low levels, so I'll train them while doing trade runs with the midnight training skill. When they get around lvl 15, then they can go against sea raiders. Once they can handle sea raiders, then I'll usually start taking over towns and castles.
 
I've found that it's not such a good idea to mix weapons on mounted companions who aren't specialized (mostly non-combat skills). Meaning, if you haven't built up their STR (for armor and health) and weapon skills , do not give them weapons to swap between or they'll get themselves mobbed.

In their cases, I almost always just give them an incredibly nice shield and a pole-arm, but take their horse away in big battles where I know there are ground troops to help.

I don't even bother with a 1 hander, since it'll just get them dancing with enemies that are probably way better than them. Letting them use a long melee weapon keeps them from getting too close. Light lance seems to do well for speed and range.

When they're on a horse, they'll almost always swoop in and then away, which keeps them alive longer. Not a good idea letting them linger in crowded areas.
 
If I can get 8-10 companions with decent xbow skills, mounted, they usually do pretty good against infantry and archers if I position them on a hill overlooking the field, as I run circles around the enemy with my master warbow. I don't bother with polearms 'cause I never capture prisoners.

But yeah, generally, don't mix weapon types with companions. They aren't smart enough to know the difference between ranged and close combat. With 8 companions I'll put 4 with xbows; mounted, and 4 with bastard swords; infantry. I don't even bother with shields. Waste of denars.
 
Caba`drin 说:
This micromanagement/stats gaming/RPing...all in all "taking your time"...is what makes this game replayable and enjoyable. Well, to me at least.

I think so too :smile:.

I've manged to get all my companions to around level 20+, but it seems like the mounted meleers aren't really performing any better than they were at level 15. They all have armours that give them at least 52 body/16 leg, if not better, a lance, a heater or kite shield, and a one-hander of at least balanced or tempered quality (usually a scimitar or saber), except Matheld, who I mentioned before as specialized in two-handers. Power-strike, iron skin, shield are all at least rank 6 or 7, spare points into trainer. Some of them have left-over skill points I am not sure what to do with. I've also not noticed that the mounted throwers are doing any better or worse than the mounted lancers/meleers.

Is there any point in raising companions' riding skill above 4? How about raising their athletics?
 
The main thing about companions is you have to pair them. If you have two that like each other, they'll pair on the field and do better.

At least that's what I've observed.
 
I find the most effective build for a companion is to give them a 2 hander and put them on a horse, for some reason due to the ai they get the most kills with this arrangement and therefore they level faster.

One strategy is to give them all weapons which can be used as 1 handers or 2 handers that way during seiges you can just give them all crappy shields, this works pretty well cause by the time they get into the fight there shields are broken and they get to make use of their high 2hander skills.
 
Really, the best way to work companions is to pair them.

But, yeah, they seem to work good with 2-h weapons.

4 on xbow and 4 on bastard..paired to each other.

They don't seem to do good with regular bows, even with high archery and draw skills.

This is being vanilla M&B and/or vanilla Warband.

I've been playing this game since 2008, but never found a mod better than the original.

I always play vanilla M&B / WB


 
I used Bahestur as heavy infantry, one handed, and he's good too. Recently I gave him javelins, but does he have any riding skill on start? I think he didnt for me, thats why I didnt give him horse. Also, Nizar is good for cavalery, Bunduk as crossbowmen.
 
(which seems to be of no use for those playing native, since companions apparently don't switch weapons properly without the lancer script).
:?:
This is my first attempt at a Quote, bear with me pls.
Is this still true for the Current Native?
My normal load for FIrentis and a few others is, top to bottom.
Lance, H. Huscarl Shield, Bastard Sword and Bardiche.
Speed over Dmg, as far as "+" to wpns, ie. Balanced > heavy.
 
Deadly **** 说:
One strategy is to give them all weapons which can be used as 1 handers or 2 handers that way during seiges you can just give them all crappy shields, this works pretty well cause by the time they get into the fight there shields are broken and they get to make use of their high 2hander skills.
This is an interesting tactic to force 2H companions past the initial ladder rush stage alive. I generally try to keep a good shield on companions because I rate survivability higher than sheer killing power, but I'll try this. What shield do you recommend? Is old board shield good? Or something crappier?

And since I' here..... is adding shield skill for companions any good (assuming I give my companions shields that is)? I usually give my melee tank companions points in power strike, ironflesh, shield and athletics/riding/both, with weapon master only when I have spare points.
 
My normal load for FIrentis and a few others is, top to bottom.
Lance, H. Huscarl Shield, Bastard Sword and Bardiche.
Speed over Dmg, as far as "+" to wpns, ie. Balanced > heavy.


For a while I equipped my companions somewhat similarly (1hand axe, shield, bardiche, and jarids).
I followed them around the battlefield a few times watching what they'd do and I never saw them use the bardiche. Seems they prefer to use shields as long as they have them.

Right now I have Rolf equipped with a 1hand sword, shield, light lance, and jarids. I have seen him use the lance and the jarids but I am not sure if he uses the sword when he's in the middle of one of the fusterclucks or if he just stabs with the jarids. His survival and kill rate seems pretty good either way.
 
My problem is I don't like the AI for lance (running vanilla). It seems a lot of times they just stop, then jab with the lance doing 0 damage. So I equip everyone exactly the same, just like me: 1h sword, shield, x-bow. This gives 0 confusion to their AI. They are calvery, then on ground they are x-bow except when enemy close they go melee. This also works great for sieges because I have 7 guys that take forever to kill. One time the 8 of us alone held the top of the ladder for about 800 kills (of course we had sharpshooters too, but they ran out of ammo after about the first 100).
 
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