What majority?I have next to no hope that this game will ever not suck.
But if bumping a thread like this makes TW see their failure a little more clearly, then it's worth it. They might have a major shift in strategy once they realize that those of us who are pissed off are the majority, not the obsequious SOON-worshippers.
92.88% of the player base stopped playing in May 2020 and never came back.What majority?
Around 200 "yes" voters in this english speaking thread against +100K copies sold around the world...
And for me the game do not "s..k".
92.88% of the player base stopped playing in May 2020 and never came back.
There's your majority, compadre.
Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord - Steam Charts
An ongoing analysis of Steam's player numbers, seeing what's been played the most.steamcharts.com
Yes, but that other arguments was "X people bought the game and didn't complain", which is more stupid as we can't know what they thought about the game - we only know that most of them moved on. Out of boredom or disgust? Who knows.Ah the circles of this forum! Huge drop off happen after almost all games on Steam. Don't cherry pick.
That's normal for a single-player game though.92.88% of the player base stopped playing in May 2020 and never came back.
There's your majority, compadre.
Mount & Blade II: Bannerlord - Steam Charts
An ongoing analysis of Steam's player numbers, seeing what's been played the most.steamcharts.com
Probably because most people aren't like the super-users. They move on to the next hyped-up release.Yes, but that other arguments was "X people bought the game and didn't complain", which is more stupid as we can't know what they thought about the game - we only know that most of them moved on. Out of boredom or disgust? Who knows.
Ah the circles of this forum! Huge drop off happen after almost all games on Steam. Don't cherry pick.
edit: No idea what you are discussing previously on this thread (last pages), I did not read!
Wrong. Extremely wrong. Breathtakingly wrong. This casual excuse-making is part of why the game's EA development has been so cancerous.That's normal for a single-player game though.
Probably because most people aren't like the super-users. They move on to the next hyped-up release.
Steam Charts doesn't record the release numbers for Warband though. It only goes back to 2012 and Warband was released in 2010, so you can't say it maintained it's userbase better than any other single player-focused title.Also if you just look at the steam charts for each, you'll see that WB maintained a consistent fanbase for TEN YEARS on Steam with peaks of recurring interest while BL dropped like a rock since EA opened.
What? I did look at them: Total War Three Kingdoms -- 90% of the average player count gone in three months. Kingdom Come Deliverance -- 90% gone in three months. Some games manage better numbers through DLC releases, which confuses things.Similarly, if you look at the charts for popular or even niche pure-singleplayer games... they mostly have slow losses in active players with a gradual curve - where the curve for BL dropped off a cliff immediately after release.
To be fair, this happens with every popular EA game (there was some version of this in probably half of BG3 reviews last I checked). I agree that it's infuriating and a misuse of the review system, however.keep in mind that end-user reviews in almost every industry skew positive and most of these "positive" reviews explicitly say that the game sucks but they're looking forward to it not sucking in the future.
I get it, your salt levels are off the charts. But let's not try and portray the hardcore community as the majority ?They might have a major shift in strategy once they realize that those of us who are pissed off are the majority, not the obsequious SOON-worshippers.
The hardcore community isn't the majority. It's about 20% of the player base.I get it, your salt levels are off the charts. But let's not try and portray the hardcore community as the majority ?
What majority?
Around 200 "yes" voters in this english speaking thread against +100K copies sold around the world...
Only if the survey participants are representative of the playerbase and they aren't.There are 236 total votes in this thread (207 of which are "yes").Sample Size Calculator and Tips for Determining Sample Size | SurveyMonkey
How many people need to take your survey for statistically significant results? Use our sample size calculator and see how the sample size formula works.www.surveymonkey.com
You can survey a population of 100,000 people with 85% confidence and a 5% margin for error with just 207 respondents.
So, we can say with some confidence that the majority of Bannerlord's playerbase would agree with that list.
Okay, so in which way are you claiming this poll is non-representative? Let me guess: Forum users vs. non forum users?Only if the survey participants are representative of the playerbase and they aren't.
Yes, but more generally self-selection is a known biasing factor in polling. You can get pretty good confidence (with some caveats) out of surprisingly low numbers but not if they are self-selecting. Of course, you can also easily say that the wider playerbase is mostly casual and their opinions shouldn't count for as much as forum-goers because they'll move onto the next product -- regardless of quality -- very quickly, like a horde of locusts.Okay, so in which way are you claiming this poll is non-representative? Let me guess: Forum users vs. non forum users?
So you are considering the MP player base as an indicator.Bannerlord is NOT a SP-only game and the devs have made clear that SP/RPG elements are NOT the priority for dev in EA
Here we don't take into account the MP player base? I'm lost.Bannerlord is in EA with constant content updates, not full release where you consume all the content in one 80-hour playthrough.
Despite Bannerlord is the sequel of Warband, if we consider both products in terms of marketing, it is not comparable.Bannerlord can really only be compared to Warband: WB has 30% of the current users of BL despite being practically ancient and supposedly obsolete. It appears that roughly half of the WB userbase switched to BL on release and the number of WB players who haven't upgraded has stayed rock-solid steady since then.
You stay focused on the drop after release, if we look to the average and peak users in last 30 days from your source:Also if you just look at the steam charts for each, you'll see that WB maintained a consistent fanbase for TEN YEARS on Steam with peaks of recurring interest while BL dropped like a rock since EA opened.
Are you comparing with a early access game barely playable because of the multiple bugs?Similarly, if you look at the charts for popular or even niche pure-singleplayer games... they mostly have slow losses in active players with a gradual curve - where the curve for BL dropped off a cliff immediately after release.
Percentage is easy to purposely interpret.WB has 16.18% of peak users playing now vs 6.96% for BL.
Again, not comparable. let's wait a full release.WB stands at 97.7% positive reviews vs 87.4% for BL - and before you take pride in how "high" that is...keep in mind that end-user reviews in almost every industry skew positive and most of these "positive" reviews explicitly say that the game sucks but they're looking forward to it not sucking in the future.
All I see there is a good strategical position for the franchise.According to Steam250, Warband stands at the #17 best game of all time while Bannerlord stands at #1611. Warband has been in the top 250 for 99% of its 10.5 years of existence while Bannerlord has been for exactly one day.
By tags: WB is the #2 Medieval game of all time, the #3 Strategy game, the #2 Realistic game, the #1 Historical game, the #7 Open-World game, the #5 RPG game and the #6 Sandbox.
Bannerlord ranks #50 for Medieval, #61 for Realistic and #53 for Historical. It doesn't break the top 250 for Strategy, Open World, RPG or Sandbox. Bannerlord is ranked 129th in current Early Access games, just one spot under Granny Simulator. In one year, the general vibe of this forum has gone from overwhelming slavish dev-worship to overwhelming nine-stages-of-grief.
Speaking of performance, price strategy is also a huge factor.The point is: do not pretend that Bannerlord is a good or successful or growing game. Even by indie standards, the performance is weak and the player base is not happy. Despite the fact that WB cost as little as $3 at various points in time and BL has never sold for less than $40, WB earned an estimated ~$70M in net sales vs ~$110M for BL.
Yes exactly. Speaking about additional bias:Okay, so in which way are you claiming this poll is non-representative? Let me guess: Forum users vs. non forum users?
You're really grasping at straws here. How are language and age going to make a major difference in the problems people find with the game and want prioritized to be fixed?Yes exactly. Speaking about additional bias:
Language... I don't want to relaunch this debate, but it is an actual factor to consider if you want to have a representative sample.
Age. I don't think this forum also represents all the age levels of players.
Considering the poll doesn't ask, "do you like the game or not?", I'm not seeing how that's an issue.Influence. This forum tends to galvanize the negative minding about Bannerlord as well...
Okay, so if the bias you claim is forum vs. non forum, how is this meant to invalidate the poll? Keep in mind it's not asking "do you like the game". It's asking whether it does a good job of representing the fixes and inclusions the respondee would like to see made.Yes, but more generally self-selection is a known biasing factor in polling. You can get pretty good confidence (with some caveats) out of surprisingly low numbers but not if they are self-selecting.
Sorry, I'm not invalidating the poll.You're really grasping at straws here. How are language and age going to make a major difference in the problems people find with the game and want prioritized to be fixed?
As I have already said, English is a massively spoken language among Internet users, being both the most common first language, the most common second-spoken language in addition to a native language, and the most common language used on webpages. But even among the people who don't speak English as a supplementary language/don't choose to use the English forums, I look at the Chinese-language, Turkish-language and French-language subforums with Google Translate, and they're voicing many of the same concerns that are represented in the OP.
Considering the poll doesn't ask, "do you like the game or not?", I'm not seeing how that's an issue.
It isn't a question of negativity vs. positivity. It's the question "does this roadmap represent your basic wants for Bannerlord"?