I added this as a sidenote to a comment in a thread on the issue of rambo cav. This thread right here
I've always been a bit bothered by captain mode having this "meta" that forces to play in a really unfun way which really doesn't fit the point of the mode. By "unfun" ways to play, I mean using very cheesy methods to win games. For example having 4 squads of archers and two cavalry. The cavalry players leave their squads on the other side of the map and come alone and try to make the AI turn the enemy infantry around so the archers can shoot their backs. If the infantry doesn't turn, they get couch lanced at about 1 troop/5 seconds. If they turn around, they just die to arrows. Charge the archers? With what? A shield wall is so slow that you simply don't catch archers with it. If you try to charge in shield wall to catch the archers, half of your squad will scatter around the map and chase the enemy rambo cavalry. The other half still charging the archers is either:
A) Bombarded to death by 4 squads of archers
B) Just bonked to death in melee by a single unit of archers
There simply isn't any point in this so we need something to discourage this behaviour of going in solo to abuse the AI.
That's where the unit morale system comes in. It would be as follows:
Every time the player dies, a percentage of their troops will start routing, deserting the battle (similar to SP). Maybe the first death would do nothing, so it's not the end if you get hit in the face by a stray arrow. The second death would rout 20% of starting troop number. The third 40% and the fourth the last ~ 40%. So here's some math:
I think this would make the players focus more on tactics and commanding bots than trying to cheese their way to high K/D by ramboing and other tactics which require the player to pretty much just sacrifice one life for way too much benefit. It's also more realistic if you think about it. If you get a volley of arrows hammering into your shock infantry and the leader is also taken out, It's very probable that some troops start panicking. (Yes realism isn't everything and I would put gameplay above realism anytime, but both in a well applied balance is good.)
I would also be fine having the routing start right from the first death. This would stop ramboing and bring this certain kind of atmosphere to captain battles, and being able to turn the tide of battle by killing the enemy captain in glorious single combat would also be a cool addition, and a bonus for skilled fighters.
So this would fix:
- Ramboing, by adding a big risk to riding alone into enemies, especially multiple times.
- Abusing AI by running around a shield wall alone to make them turn their backs to allied archers, also adding a big risk to doing so.
Of course I'm all for flanking enemy shield walls, but only with your unit. High risk, high reward.
So tell me what you think, just throwing around ideas to fix issues in captain mode.
I've always been a bit bothered by captain mode having this "meta" that forces to play in a really unfun way which really doesn't fit the point of the mode. By "unfun" ways to play, I mean using very cheesy methods to win games. For example having 4 squads of archers and two cavalry. The cavalry players leave their squads on the other side of the map and come alone and try to make the AI turn the enemy infantry around so the archers can shoot their backs. If the infantry doesn't turn, they get couch lanced at about 1 troop/5 seconds. If they turn around, they just die to arrows. Charge the archers? With what? A shield wall is so slow that you simply don't catch archers with it. If you try to charge in shield wall to catch the archers, half of your squad will scatter around the map and chase the enemy rambo cavalry. The other half still charging the archers is either:
A) Bombarded to death by 4 squads of archers
B) Just bonked to death in melee by a single unit of archers
There simply isn't any point in this so we need something to discourage this behaviour of going in solo to abuse the AI.
That's where the unit morale system comes in. It would be as follows:
Every time the player dies, a percentage of their troops will start routing, deserting the battle (similar to SP). Maybe the first death would do nothing, so it's not the end if you get hit in the face by a stray arrow. The second death would rout 20% of starting troop number. The third 40% and the fourth the last ~ 40%. So here's some math:
| Example units | 2nd death troops lost (20%) | 3rd death troops lost (40%) | Total troops routed in 3 deaths |
| Heavy inf (16 troops, legionaries/sergeants etc.) | 3 | 6 | 9 (56% of squad) |
| Light inf (23 troops, tribal warrior and peasant levy) | 5 | 9 | 14 (61% of squad) |
| Heavy cavalry (8 troops, knights, lancers etc.) | 2 | 3 | 5 (60% of squad) |
I think this would make the players focus more on tactics and commanding bots than trying to cheese their way to high K/D by ramboing and other tactics which require the player to pretty much just sacrifice one life for way too much benefit. It's also more realistic if you think about it. If you get a volley of arrows hammering into your shock infantry and the leader is also taken out, It's very probable that some troops start panicking. (Yes realism isn't everything and I would put gameplay above realism anytime, but both in a well applied balance is good.)
I would also be fine having the routing start right from the first death. This would stop ramboing and bring this certain kind of atmosphere to captain battles, and being able to turn the tide of battle by killing the enemy captain in glorious single combat would also be a cool addition, and a bonus for skilled fighters.
So this would fix:
- Ramboing, by adding a big risk to riding alone into enemies, especially multiple times.
- Abusing AI by running around a shield wall alone to make them turn their backs to allied archers, also adding a big risk to doing so.
Of course I'm all for flanking enemy shield walls, but only with your unit. High risk, high reward.
So tell me what you think, just throwing around ideas to fix issues in captain mode.
