Can we please talk about how stupid being a vassal is right now

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Itisausername

Sergeant at Arms
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So i was playing a vlandian campaign as a vassal i took dominion over battania but kept getting these random fiefs like way too far away

So can anybody please answer to me why will kings only give you things you dont want i think this is something that needs sorting out because i have dunglanys i was healing up and ramdomly i got iyakis so now i had to make a trip to garrison it

I think a change is needed and i am gonna suggest one lets say you have two castles near a town you take that tiwn and because most of you're powerbase is there you get it so its more proximity based is what im saying basically so i dont have to keep touring the world
 

MostBlunted

Squire
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Inappropriate behavior
So can anybody please answer to me why will kings only give you things you dont want i think this is something that needs sorting out because i have dunglanys i was healing up and ramdomly i got iyakis so now i had to make a trip to garrison it
Same "AI" as Warband had 8 years ago?

But enjoy this nice sheep!
 

AnandaShanti

Knight at Arms
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So i was playing a vlandian campaign as a vassal i took dominion over battania but kept getting these random fiefs like way too far away

So can anybody please answer to me why will kings only give you things you dont want i think this is something that needs sorting out because i have dunglanys i was healing up and ramdomly i got iyakis so now i had to make a trip to garrison it

I think a change is needed and i am gonna suggest one lets say you have two castles near a town you take that tiwn and because most of you're powerbase is there you get it so its more proximity based is what im saying basically so i dont have to keep touring the world
Yeah being a vassal is crap. There's all kinds of improvements they could make but letting the player just say no to fiefs, or nominate someone else in their place, or give away unwanted fiefs easier would all be basic simple fixes. I think being as vassal is supposed to just be a stepping stone and you should be doping the faction once you have significant lands...however being a kingdom sucks too (IMO) so ...... I like to just be my clan and beat everyone up, take thier fiefs and peace out whenever I can squeeze money out of a lord (how does it work? why?). I can squeeze for peace and then turn around a beat them up anyways. No consequences. It's fun but I would much rather HAVE CONTROL AND AGENCY OVER VASSALS AND CLAN MEMBERS.

Same "AI" as Warband had 8 years ago?

But enjoy this nice sheep!
Oh I will
 

Askorti

Sergeant Knight at Arms
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As far as I know, it was actually something kings would do very much on purpose, that is give their vassals lands that were scattered all around their domain. Why? So that it would be harder to rebel. It would be impossible for you to defend all the land you have if it's all over the place, so effectively you aren't as strong as the amount of land you hold as a vassal would suggest. If all your fiefs were concentrated in one place, you could easily consolidate it and rebel with a unified power-base. Which is something your liege obviously does not want.
So while I agree that getting lands all over the place is annoying, it is, for once, historically accurate and it introduces more challenge to the player. Rebelling against your liege is not supposed to be easy.
 

lockefeer

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M&BWBWF&SNWVC
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As far as I know, it was actually something kings would do very much on purpose, that is give their vassals lands that were scattered all around their domain. Why? So that it would be harder to rebel. It would be impossible for you to defend all the land you have if it's all over the place, so effectively you aren't as strong as the amount of land you hold as a vassal would suggest. If all your fiefs were concentrated in one place, you could easily consolidate it and rebel with a unified power-base. Which is something your liege obviously does not want.
So while I agree that getting lands all over the place is annoying, it is, for once, historically accurate and it introduces more challenge to the player. Rebelling against your liege is not supposed to be easy.
Wow this actually makes sense. Didn't think about it this way.
 

dannazgu

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So i was playing a vlandian campaign as a vassal i took dominion over battania but kept getting these random fiefs like way too far away

So can anybody please answer to me why will kings only give you things you dont want i think this is something that needs sorting out because i have dunglanys i was healing up and ramdomly i got iyakis so now i had to make a trip to garrison it

I think a change is needed and i am gonna suggest one lets say you have two castles near a town you take that tiwn and because most of you're powerbase is there you get it so its more proximity based is what im saying basically so i dont have to keep touring the world
Because a King, your liege doesn't care for what you think?

I think this a normal behavior, specially if you have good relations, perharps that's help get fiefs. But, honestly I think as vassal you shouldn't get much of a say what you'll get or not, if you don't like then let it take back by your enemies. Losing a fiefs has great repercussions and you start to fall behind in the "gifts"

Now, if you want a real world example: A king/emperor, never cared for what his minor powerless vassals wanted or care, they had no power to raise against them.

But, in Bannerlord? Idk they are working to fix AI and lords, we should wait for that improve

I think that should have an option to say: Thanks, but I must refuse, my liege!

Of course, that should come with a great penalty to your liege and loyal vassals relations like - 20 points in relations for refusing a king's "gift"
 

Itisausername

Sergeant at Arms
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Because a King, your liege doesn't care for what you think?

I think this a normal behavior, specially if you have good relations, perharps that's help get fiefs. But, honestly I think as vassal you shouldn't get much of a say what you'll get or not, if you don't like then let it take back by your enemies. Losing a fiefs has great repercussions and you start to fall behind in the "gifts"

Now, if you want a real world example: A king/emperor, never cared for what his minor powerless vassals wanted or care, they had no power to raise against them.

But, in Bannerlord? Idk they are working to fix AI and lords, we should wait for that improve

I think that should have an option to say: Thanks, but I must refuse, my liege!

Of course, that should come with a great penalty to your liege and loyal vassals relations like - 20 points in relations for refusing a king's "gift"
In the real world in the game you are no minor powerless vassal you completely miss the point which is lieges should actually think
 

Skatan

Recruit
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Now, if you want a real world example: A king/emperor, never cared for what his minor powerless vassals wanted or care, they had no power to raise against them.
Yeah, because in Earth history you never read about any rebellions or civil wars? :razz: Sorry for taking this sentence out of context, but I just found it too funny not to reply to.

The only thing I miss is the ability to say no to a fief and potentially the option for a faction leader to use their influence to 'force' on you anyways (like "prove your loyality to our faction and take the fief or get the f out of here" kinda). The latter isn't necessary, but could perhaps be a tool if saying no becomes an option for both the player and the AI and you have your own faction.

Other than that, this topic has been brought up plenty before and I'm sure the Devs have heard about it already. Whether they want to implement it or not, who knows.
 

dannazgu

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Yeah, because in Earth history you never read about any rebellions or civil wars? :razz: Sorry for taking this sentence out of context, but I just found it too funny not to reply to.
What I meant was, why a King in game or real would care for a lower vassal with no big armies to threaten them? Even in real world a person is dangerous of course, plot to kill, etc; ancient times, middles ages, modern ages. I really doubt that a man with 100 or 200 would rebel against a kingdom that can muster thousands and overpower you. Rebellion happened yes, frequentely, civil wars? totally.. but, the powerles vassal wasn't powerless anymore, he had allies he had money, he had armies and mercenaries.

I think we had a imprisionament system would be cool... I still think players should penalize to refuse a king's gift... Since, this meant a slight on his lieges honor

In the real world in the game you are no minor powerless vassal you completely miss the point which is lieges should actually think
Yes, you're until you get a real income, allies, armies and rebellion implemented on game. Sorry, but when you begin the game and join a Kingdom/Empire, you're a nobody until you get plentiful of resources. The same was in midle ages, why someone who led a small castle with only few hundres would rebel againt their liege who had allies, money and overpower you to 5 to 1 in battle?

Now, if you're saying you have several fiefs and can muster a great force to battle your king that wait for rebellion be implemented. And overthrown him
 

Itisausername

Sergeant at Arms
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Yes, you're until you get a real income, allies, armies and rebellion implemented on game. Sorry, but when you begin the game and join a Kingdom/Empire, you're a nobody until you get plentiful of resources. The same was in midle ages, why someone who led a small castle with only few hundres would rebel againt their liege who had allies, money and overpower you to 5 to 1 in battle?

Now, if you're saying you have several fiefs and can muster a great force to battle your king that wait for rebellion be implemented. And overthrown him
Oof who siad i was a small vassal though i clearly stated i was very powerful while you take nothing to that
 

dannazgu

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Oof who siad i was a small vassal though i clearly stated i was very powerful while you take nothing to that
Like I said before: " Now, if you're saying you have several fiefs and can muster a great force to battle your king than wait for rebellion be implemented. And overthrown him "

Story is different, but I think the player should be penalized for being agaisnt his liege's gift.. Since this was slight on his honor and perosn as your suzerain

I didn't notice your comments of being a powerful lord, that changes the tale of course, but for now we have no way to go against the Liege action, for now at least.
 

AnandaShanti

Knight at Arms
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Sorry, but when you begin the game and join a Kingdom/Empire, you're a nobody until you get plentiful of resources.
You can very easily skip this entire part in Bannerlord and just take fiefs on your own. It's the opposite of warband where doing so would make you a lightning rod for everyone. In Bannerlord you easily make peace and people will leave you alone until you make a full kingdom.
 

Itisausername

Sergeant at Arms
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Like I said before: " Now, if you're saying you have several fiefs and can muster a great force to battle your king than wait for rebellion be implemented. And overthrown him "

Story is different, but I think the player should be penalized for being agaisnt his liege's gift.. Since this was slight on his honor and perosn as your suzerain

I didn't notice your comments of being a powerful lord, that changes the tale of course, but for now we have no way to go against the Liege action, for now at least.
You do realize i can defect right i dont need to rebel yet that is the only thing you say is an option
 

dannazgu

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You do realize i can defect right i dont need to rebel yet that is the only thing you say is an option
Sure, you can, I meant the feature they intend to implement of course.. I thinkthe rebellion and civil war inside the Kingdom will meant for those who want overthrown their suzerain
 

dannazgu

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You can very easily skip this entire part in Bannerlord and just take fiefs on your own. It's the opposite of warband where doing so would make you a lightning rod for everyone. In Bannerlord you easily make peace and people will leave you alone until you make a full kingdom.
I ddn't know you could make peace easily.. since I'm not interested in creating my own kingdom for now... I meant first to take the throne of an existing faction and see how goo this can be with the developments.
 

jak1up

Regular
WBWF&S
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If I don't want a particular fief I just vote to give it to some one else, it works for me....
 

Itisausername

Sergeant at Arms
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If I don't want a particular fief I just vote to give it to some one else, it works for me....
But yet surprisingly sometimes even voting against yourself the ruler still gives it to you i think a simple i do not want this fief button would appreciated
 

jak1up

Regular
WBWF&S
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But yet surprisingly sometimes even voting against yourself the ruler still gives it to you i think a simple i do not want this fief button would appreciated
Yes that would be a much better option, I hope that they would add something like this in the future.
 

Dionaea

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In the real world in the game you are no minor powerless vassal you completely miss the point which is lieges should actually think
A perfectly reasonable answer was given, Lieges do think, they scatter your holdings so you are less tempted to rebel. Just because it's not beneficial to you doesn't mean it's not beneficial to someone else


You can very easily skip this entire part in Bannerlord and just take fiefs on your own. It's the opposite of warband where doing so would make you a lightning rod for everyone. In Bannerlord you easily make peace and people will leave you alone until you make a full kingdom.
I love this, I took Ustokol castle from the Vlandians who had taken it from Sturgia, made peace in exchange for releasing 2 prisoners, then took the city reyvil nearby from the Vlandians and made peace in exchange for a very expensive Javelin then took a castle close by and made peace again in exchange for a javelin, then decided to become a kingdom with these holdings and then was at war with Battania and Sturgia. Was doing well untill a new beta was released and I started a new campaign
 
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Itisausername

Sergeant at Arms
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A perfectly reasonable answer was given, Lieges do think, they scatter your holdings so you are less tempted to rebel. Just because it's not beneficial to you doesn't mean it's not beneficial to someone else
Yet i can still rebel it still does not make sense that is still a useful location and can be used