Beta Patch Notes e1.6.1

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Rizer

Recruit
About the multiplayer balancing:
In general, I like the changes. One thing worries me however. It appears that cav is indirectly buffed even further while cav is already dominant in every gamemode except for captain.

Arguably the two major counters to cav, throwing spears and arrows are nerfed drastically. Throwing spears are not able to be picked up from corpses and taking them no longer gives javelins as well, and pierce damage against horses is lowered. This only leaves spears and pikes to counter cav. Pikes are buffed a little bit sure, but they still suffer from glancing if the horse is too close (which makes no sense for obvious reasons). Spears are just poor counters to cav because they suffer from glancing, often dealing low damage to a cav from the front letting the cav move on. Infantry spears are also shorter than the lances or long spears that cav have, so stabbing a rider is unrealistic and just results in the inf being stabbed, and likely killed, instead. Furthermore, if a stab on a horse head is done successfully, the stab does about 50-90 damage which is by far not enough to dismount, and only yields a single stab on the staggered rider for 20-40 damage. In melee fights, it's even worse. Either the infantry holds a spear and gets killed in the melee, or the inf holds a sword/mace/axe against the enemy infantry and gets killed by cav.
Cav is already op with couches that always instakill, the ability to ride away relatively unscathed after being staggered, doing major damage without real opposition (except for other cav), bump stabbing/slashing which is unblockable, being able to knock down non-cav by riding into them.
I would like a response from the devs, because this will most likely further destroy the balance of the game.

In conclusion, cav was already dominant in every gamemode other than captain and will likely be even more so in 1.6.1 unless spear damage against cav is heavily increased or cav damage, couches and bumping is nerfed significantly. Alternatively, cav cost could be increased significantly. I know this was hinted at for TDM and siege, but skirmish would need this as well.
 

Firunien

Grandmaster Knight
About the multiplayer balancing:
In general, I like the changes. One thing worries me however. It appears that cav is indirectly buffed even further while cav is already dominant in every gamemode except for captain.

Arguably the two major counters to cav, throwing spears and arrows are nerfed drastically. Throwing spears are not able to be picked up from corpses and taking them no longer gives javelins as well, and pierce damage against horses is lowered. This only leaves spears and pikes to counter cav. Pikes are buffed a little bit sure, but they still suffer from glancing if the horse is too close (which makes no sense for obvious reasons). Spears are just poor counters to cav because they suffer from glancing, often dealing low damage to a cav from the front letting the cav move on. Infantry spears are also shorter than the lances or long spears that cav have, so stabbing a rider is unrealistic and just results in the inf being stabbed, and likely killed, instead. Furthermore, if a stab on a horse head is done successfully, the stab does about 50-90 damage which is by far not enough to dismount, and only yields a single stab on the staggered rider for 20-40 damage. In melee fights, it's even worse. Either the infantry holds a spear and gets killed in the melee, or the inf holds a sword/mace/axe against the enemy infantry and gets killed by cav.
Cav is already op with couches that always instakill, the ability to ride away relatively unscathed after being staggered, doing major damage without real opposition (except for other cav), bump stabbing/slashing which is unblockable, being able to knock down non-cav by riding into them.
I would like a response from the devs, because this will most likely further destroy the balance of the game.

In conclusion, cav was already dominant in every gamemode other than captain and will likely be even more so in 1.6.1 unless spear damage against cav is heavily increased or cav damage, couches and bumping is nerfed significantly. Alternatively, cav cost could be increased significantly. I know this was hinted at for TDM and siege, but skirmish would need this as well.
Cavalry is nerfed on other fronts like maneuverability on heavy horses, there is perks against Cav, overall it surely wont be buffed
 

BigFat

Regular
Happy to see a new update this week since I start a new job next week and won't have tons of time to play anymore, but I was really hoping to see armor value tweaks, AI vs AI death and adjustment to death rates, and/or maybe some troop tree revisions so I'm a little disappointed.
 

MadVader

Duke
M&BWB
TLDR:

- Keep battles have been added.
- The rest is rework and fixes, which continually feed into each other in a vortex - snip-
Grossly harsh, but too funny. Consider this a theft for future reuse.
 
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Hello.

What do you think, if I ran the campaign on beta e1.6.0 and now upgraded to beta e1.6.1 - is it worth downloading the old save or is it better to start the campaign again?

Sry bad english
 

granitestone

Recruit
  • Fixed an issue that caused troops to not use ladders in certain situations.
  • Fixed an issue that caused troops to not break the interior castle gate in certain situations

I... don't have a good enough imagination to imagine this being fixed. This can't be real, right? I'm downloading it now. If these are really - I mean REALLY - fixed, it will buy Taleworlds my goodwill for like 8 months. I'll start acting like I only paid $47.99 for early access.

But it can't really be fixed though, right?
 

Shun

Squire
WB
My game crashes wheneveer I try to load into the gameworld (Sandbox and Custom Battle).



I... don't have a good enough imagination to imagine this being fixed. This can't be real, right? I'm downloading it now. If these are really - I mean REALLY - fixed, it will buy Taleworlds my goodwill for like 8 months. I'll start acting like I only paid $47.99 for early access.

But it can't really be fixed though, right?

So I cannot test it, another user said:

my 2 first sieges i almost cried seeing A.I using all laders, but after some more tests, it looks like depending on the map they will struggle to climb the ladders
 

Pejot

Sergeant Knight
WBVC
I... don't have a good enough imagination to imagine this being fixed. This can't be real, right? I'm downloading it now. If these are really - I mean REALLY - fixed, it will buy Taleworlds my goodwill for like 8 months. I'll start acting like I only paid $47.99 for early access.

But it can't really be fixed though, right?

10 sieges. They use the ladders. All of them. They have some minor issues from time but they do use them. And I noticed better behaviour from defender's near the gate. They don't let enemy in but circle entering enemies right at the gate.

It is something that I couldn't believe that's why I've run from siege to siege as merc.
 

Clsy

Squire
WBWF&S
mp player just want less and less thing to play with their final demand would be forcing everyone to fight with their fist because it will be equally sucks
 

Maelstrom8

Sergeant
WBWF&SNW
Ah there we go, progress! Seems to be a little on the smaller end but no biggie, I appreciate any kind of improvement or content, especially small things like the Encyclopedia remembering where it left off when you go back to a page and having more than 2 upgrade paths on the UI. Though to be fair, I prefer things like this (good luck with that!).

Thanks for the beta patch! Look forward to this coming to the stable build, because right now I'll be instead using stable 1.6.0 (and also proceed to wait about a week for mods to update, hopefully the good ones come over).
 

TheShermanator

Sergeant
10 sieges. They use the ladders. All of them. They have some minor issues from time but they do use them. And I noticed better behaviour from defender's near the gate. They don't let enemy in but circle entering enemies right at the gate.

It is something that I couldn't believe that's why I've run from siege to siege as merc.

Uh ... really? No way. It feels too good to be true. We need a bigger sample size.

In the meantime, Pejot is the hero Gotham needs right now. Keep on testing those sieges; we are all counting on you. :smile:
 

Maroon

Grandmaster Knight
WBWF&SNW
May I take you on a trip down memory lane? In particular: the "discussion" regarding why TW is using the class system, full stop. In this discussion, You mentioned the following reasons for using the class system:

  • Prevent snowballing
  • Making picking equipment simpler. New players don't know what to pick and why, and spawning time is limited.
  • We wanted to see fully armored knights AND peasants on the same battlefield and they should NOT be equal in power.
  • And we want to see both of them available on round 1.
  • We want the knight to be able to picked by anyone, not by the already skilled player who killed everyone and now has enough money to buy the equipment.
  • Making troops distinctive enough with a glance you know all about what you are facing. Capabilities, gear, etc.
  • Giving each class a predetermined purpose. To enable players to work on building effective teams, adapting tactics depending on the situation.
  • To provide better visuals for the spectators or other players by having properly dressed soldiers. Knights looking like knights, Crossbowmen looking like crossbowmen etc.
  • To be able to use the same system for all game modes - Captain mode and Skirmish mode etc.
Let's ignore that final point, since you've already quietly understood how nonsensical it is. Feast your eyes in particular on this quote:
  • Making troops distinctive enough with a glance you know all about what you are facing. Capabilities, gear, etc.
So to achieve that, you're adding passive perks that radically change how someone should be approached (for example because they aren't stunned by attacks that deal less than 35 damage)? I sure hope that those are actually visibly unique. Not that we can check since we won't be able to test these changes until they go live, because there are no servers to test them on. Nice.
 

vonbalt

Sergeant Knight
WBNWVCM&B
I just made that xml change to test/show the horizontal scroll.
wow that change is soo good, will the vanilla game make use of it revamping the troop trees so some units have more than two upgrade paths? anyway that is awesome for modding since before you always had to design troop trees following 2 upgrade paths at maximum and try to have everything making sense :grin:
 
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