Been a Vassal, biding my time to take the throne. Now what?

[Azziane]

I need help!

I have been traveling the realm for a while now. Day 357 and I have been a Vassal for Ravenstern a short while and then decided to follow the real force in the (my!) realm, the D'shar. I have been a D'shar vassal for over 200 days, trying to find an opportunity to declare myself as the true ruler, making sure nobles around the continent would support me. I have a few nobles at 90-100 reputation, with a bunch more in the 50-90 range.

And here comes another war and there I go following our marshall, Mansour Bey, trying to make sure nobody knows of my future plan to slit all their throats and decorate my throne room with their intestins. But, darn poopy crap, there goes our king Khadan Bahadur Khan with his army of 1000 units strong. What in the hell happened? 100 days ago when I last saw him on campaign he had maybe 200-250 men when I had my 100. I am now boasting 173 men, while most every nobles have between 100 and 250. And the king jumped from that same range to 1000 and change. What? Why? WHY?

Not only that, but he also has a pet following him everywhere *Burgli the Usurper* who used to lead quite a strong army (about 600 men) but nothing I, as a King of my own realm, could not handle with a few followers. But Burigli now shows an army 2500 men strong.

The D'shar are taking over the whole freakin map, even without my help. The more I try to get stronger, the more I wait, the worse my situation, as the true usurper, gets.

So what is going on? And what should I do? The D'shar own most of the Sarleons territory ( I currently am the lord of Marleons and 2 neighboring castles/keeps, with a total of about 1000, low level recruits mostly, men defending them, 300 in each stronghold).

My plan was to raise my army, mostly gathering Empire crossbownmen and Dshar infantry (for easy access) in order to defend my 3 strongholds efficiently. But the D'share armies are growing about 5 times faster than mine are.

Any idea what my best move would be, if my goal is to "rule them all"?

 

[Kamos32]

Well the Khan and Usurper likely just rescued a lot of prisoners from somewhere. From there they took some towns or castles and got even more troops most likely.

You may be able to attack Burgli independently and kill him before rebelling but I'm not sure though. After that you could try and lure the Khan into a fight with a large number of enemies and abandon him hoping for the best.

 

[hoellenbewohner]

KILL THEM ALL! rape there woman and clash there children on the wall (crush there scull), burn there lands, poison there whater, TAKE NO PRISONERS  KILL THEM ALL

just attack the following hero spawn for your gadget and be surprised the king dosnt bother

 

[noosers]

Spoken like a true hoellenbewohner at half past 2 in the morning. 

 

[Azziane]

So let me get that straight. Your advice is for me to attack Burigli and his 2600 men with my 170? Should I scream that I will come back and rape his women on my way to my momma?

Any advice that actually will help me not get completely destroyed? I'm still fairly new to POP, and did not yet figure out everything. Can't kill any named spawns before Burigli and the king kills them (that's 3 so far), so low on Qualis gems. I just finally got awarded my first fiefs (and then 3 in a row, with almost no garrison that I had to spend forever filling up). Which also means that I did not have training grounds until day 300-350 and I am just now starting to look at how to get some elite troops.

Which reminds me... Any tips on what elite troops would be best to take down Burigli and the King's D'shar army? Right now the only noble troops I am offered are D'shar. I remember reading something somewhere, probably in the FAQ, saying I can get noble troops that are not of my current culture - still have to figure that out too though.

 

[NicotiN]

First you need tactics 10, second elite troops. Depends on how he arranged his troops so you can decide if the first wave you use archers/cavalry.
To bring him down you could lure a Jatu army to fight him and join the Jatu if you dont have --- relation with them. Or any other army you can join the fight.
You can keep 2 fiefs at most, the rest just conquer and re-conquer them until you grind the d'shar troops.
For the d'shar you could use snake prisoners and make them cobra knights, some crossbowmen. A knighthood would help. When you rebel capture his marshall so you can have a break and maybe he will offer peace so you can asemble an army of lords. Or just wait until you have a big war and betray them.
Usually big armies don't have a lot of elite units, defeating the first 2 waves it's important.

 

[Brother of blades]

If I where you I would take laria and start from there. its the best position to start a kingdom. Safe from most bandit spawns and From usual soldier routes. it also has the rangers of the clarion call which is the next best thing to Noldors in my opinion. Its got a nice Oil trade route to ravenstern as well and 2 castles nearyby that you can take that are still close by.

 

[NicotiN]

Yes that and the fact it's the most exposed city besides Sarleon teritory. You can get attacked by the empire very easy, sarleon and ravenstern...the factions with the strongest troops. And for trade you have to go thru the desert where those sneaky jatu patrols wait so they can catch and the big army can eat you If you take Laria put in at least 300 men(recruits or whatever). It's one of the best starting points for a kingdom but then again there is Signal, Valonbray, even Senderfall....depends on how you play the game. I recomand Laria too but it's kind of hard when it comes to defend it, i have  400 men in there and the empire just raids non stop my villages....i gave them to my vasals.

 

[Arekai]

I started with Laria and i don't know what's all the huss about defending beeing so difficult. Just lure an jatu army into them, if that doesn't help just go into laria the second they go in with your troops. If you have some raven archers or some kiergards or some other good units, you really have no problems defending it. I have like... 7 fiefs and in 6 of them only wield 60-70 troops (these starter ones), if i get besieged i just get my main troop and defend it, then, when they're outside again i just chew them.

 

[Azziane]

Another question, unrelated but not worthy of its own thread - are Empire Knights best used as Archers or regular cavalry? I've been trying to build my army with Horse archers and Cavalry to keep my speed up. I can't stand not being able to catch up to small armies (bandits and such) but also like keeping my army maxed out.

I have Raventern Mounted Archers (top tier ones, whatever they're called) but was wondering if Empire Knight could fill that role instead. I have more of them and they are easier/closer to find. Plus I am fighting mostly the Jatu and Snake cult right now (who spawn in Empire territory in my game it seems) and they all have plenty of empire prisoners.

 

[hoellenbewohner]

are Empire Knights best used as Archers or regular cavalry? I've been trying to build my army with Horse archers and Cavalry to keep my speed up. I can't stand not being able to catch up to small armies (bandits and such) but also like keeping my army maxed out.

to keep my speed up

do you mean on world map? this is a lot depending from patch-finding (skill). cav. troops count with riding (skill), inf. troops with athletics (skill). also have horses in you inventory helps out (used as pack mule).

empire knights are not that good. they use broad head spears and a empire sword + shield. they are flagged as ranged + shield, mean's AI will use them as *archer* kind of troop, also spear (throwing weapon) + shield is always equipped.
they are the source for immortals and shadow legion centurions.

 

[NicotiN]

Another question, unrelated but not worthy of its own thread - are Empire Knights best used as Archers or regular cavalry? I've been trying to build my army with Horse archers and Cavalry to keep my speed up. I can't stand not being able to catch up to small armies (bandits and such) but also like keeping my army maxed out.

I have Raventern Mounted Archers (top tier ones, whatever they're called) but was wondering if Empire Knight could fill that role instead. I have more of them and they are easier/closer to find. Plus I am fighting mostly the Jatu and Snake cult right now (who spawn in Empire territory in my game it seems) and they all have plenty of empire prisoners.

Errr, yes but mounted are regular troops and you can get a lot of them and knights are a bit harder to get so you might want to use them for something else.Those mounted crossbowmen are a bit defenceless against lance cavalry so you might want to test them a bit before mass production

 

[GreenApple]

If you want to lower the amount of men your king has talk to him and ask him to go take a castle. Follow him, talk to him when he's ready and then tell him to start the siege but don't help him. Even if he wins most of his troops will be dead. Ravensteins mounted archers are the best mounted archers, but you're probably better off with rangers or whatever they're called. They're almost twice as cheap and have better bows/melee abilities. Just use the prisoners you recruit as fodder while your rangers kill everything. You should also have a lot more leadership and charisma. 173 is really really low for starting a new kingdom.

 

[Azziane]

If you want to lower the amount of men your king has talk to him and ask him to go take a castle. Follow him, talk to him when he's ready and then tell him to start the siege but don't help him. Even if he wins most of his troops will be dead. Ravensteins mounted archers are the best mounted archers, but you're probably better off with rangers or whatever they're called. They're almost twice as cheap and have better bows/melee abilities. Just use the prisoners you recruit as fodder while your rangers kill everything. You should also have a lot more leadership and charisma. 173 is really really low for starting a new kingdom.

King with 1500 men with Burigli following him with 2600. The D'shar have captured all the Sarelon forts/cities besides Sarleons itself and everything in the South except Cez. Sarleon armies and Empire armies boast 50-60 troops tops with about 800 defending their last town. I saw the Ravenstern King whom we have not had a war with in a  long time and who has not lost a city/fort yet, and his army is at 250. So no, not really a great idea. The king and Burigli could take on quite a few castles on their own. The imbalance seems really weird.

I actually ended up training them onto Jatu's. And of course Burigli ended up losing and, I assume, is now dead. I tried joining into the fight when Burigli was down to 100 troops against the Jatu's 600. But when I finally won after a couple of reloads, Burigli's army was right back at 2300.

How much do Charisma/Leadership affect the max army count again? Was it 20 per Lead point?

 

[Alavaria]

Well yeah, if the lords have 1500+ the 173 is low.

But I think I started with 150 ish, where 50 were infantry, the rest Maiden Adventurers, different rogue knights and 25 Heroic/ine Adventurers. The heros really rip up the enemy forces. With 10+4 surgery you'll only lose a few here and there, so make sure to go around to friendly towns and restock with the tavern nobles t train more heros.

Errr, yes but mounted are regular troops and you can get a lot of them and knights are a bit harder to get so you might want to use them for something else.Those mounted crossbowmen are a bit defenceless against lance cavalry so you might want to test them a bit before mass production

Maiden Adventurers are capable enough.

I don't like knights so much. Probably because I use my adventurer corps as archers/crossbows first, then order them to hold fire before charging. their AI sometimes will do dumb things like reloading crossbow while being stabbed if you don't. And since Empire Knights have short range javelins ... and usually on horses not as good as the Maiden Warhorse.

Thanks to Vickey and infantry squares, I've needed to apply more firepower to infantry blocks before breaking them. Adding some Empire crossbowmen or better yet Rangers is nice.

 

[Azziane]

10+4 surgery meaning 10 on a companion and 4 on myself? I thought 10 was the max, total.

Couple more questions:

1)I defeated a Jatu army that had 7 Knightso f the dragon as prisoners but did not get them in the list of rescued troops I could hire - is that how it works? Is it random?

2)As a D'shar vassal, can I only obtain D'shar noble troops? I have 2 knight orders (ebony and legion) and just now got awarded Janos (which I think has Immortals). I have shrines and training grounds in several keeps and getting about 15 noble d'shars every week. Just d'shars though.

Also the Empire is no more, so capturing/rescuing Empire knigths like I did before is not working anymore.

3)I just bought a "Noldor" horse from a vendor in Marleons. Is that the fabled noldor horse I hear about reading the boards? Or are there horses that I can obtain by other means that are er.... real noldor horses?

4)I want to work on my faction with the Noldor, but their forest is completely empty. Meanwhile the Jatu have about 4 armies with over 1000 troops, including the badass warlord. Could it be that the Jatu keep killing them while I'm away?

5)A god spoke to me asking me to kill Snake Cultists. I was all the way north in Ravenstern and some Snake army had spawned, before the god talked to me, near Cez. I finally made my way back south (after about 5-6 days), killed one snake army, with no result I can see. Is there something I am missing? An expiration date on the "quest"?

edit -- 6)Marshalls cannot order others to besiege anything, right?

 

[hoellenbewohner]

do not get it wrong, but has you ever considered to read the FAQ? there you will find all your answers.

there are also 2 wiki sites for pop (you would know IF you read the faq)

http://www.stormwind.co.uk/
http://popmod.wetpaint.com/

 

[NicotiN]

10+4 surgery meaning 10 on a companion and 4 on myself? I thought 10 was the max, total.

Couple more questions:

1)I defeated a Jatu army that had 7 Knightso f the dragon as prisoners but did not get them in the list of rescued troops I could hire - is that how it works? Is it random?

2)As a D'shar vassal, can I only obtain D'shar noble troops? I have 2 knight orders (ebony and legion) and just now got awarded Janos (which I think has Immortals). I have shrines and training grounds in several keeps and getting about 15 noble d'shars every week. Just d'shars though.

Also the Empire is no more, so capturing/rescuing Empire knigths like I did before is not working anymore.

3)I just bought a "Noldor" horse from a vendor in Marleons. Is that the fabled noldor horse I hear about reading the boards? Or are there horses that I can obtain by other means that are er.... real noldor horses?

4)I want to work on my faction with the Noldor, but their forest is completely empty. Meanwhile the Jatu have about 4 armies with over 1000 troops, including the badass warlord. Could it be that the Jatu keep killing them while I'm away?

5)A god spoke to me asking me to kill Snake Cultists. I was all the way north in Ravenstern and some Snake army had spawned, before the god talked to me, near Cez. I finally made my way back south (after about 5-6 days), killed one snake army, with no result I can see. Is there something I am missing? An expiration date on the "quest"?

edit -- 6)Marshalls cannot order others to besiege anything, right?

14 is max
you can't rescue high level prisoners, that means no top tier knights, level 40 is max i think.
For point 3 check faq
Noldor horse? there are more than one kind
The jatu can't kill all noldors, they just patrol somewhere else
Only one god really affects gameplay, the one who gives you the rune bow wich you will give to diev
I think i know what you mean but no, only lords who follow you come to the siege

 

[Azziane]

do not get it wrong, but has you ever considered to read the FAQ? there you will find all your answers.

there are also 2 wiki sites for pop (you would know IF you read the faq)

http://www.stormwind.co.uk/
http://popmod.wetpaint.com/

Only about 25 times.

14 max per skills means 10 on companions and 8 (/2) on myself then to max a skill out? Or a 10+4 which should make a 12?

3)Noldor horse - still can't find info on horses in the FAQ.

 

[thrashrat]

Try the Native Wiki. It covers a lot of basic stuff, including skills. http://strategywiki.org/wiki/Mount%26Blade/Table_of_Contents