Well, yes, in case it's a totally new team. If a new team of WB vets comes to BEAST it must play from DIV C for sure. But if DM and RM disband and form DRM with top-tier players from A division why should they start from scratch? Players make teams not just some names. These players deserved their place in high tiers and should only play in lower divisions because they want to.
BEAST - Bannerlord Early Access Skirmish Tournament
BEAST is the first Bannerlord Skirmish tournament in Europe.
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[BEAST#3] Suggestions
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Well it is not all black and white.
Keep in mind that we have 4 (rather 5) free slots across both Div A and B.
And at the same time we have teams that do not want to play in a higher divisions.
So teams that want to start higher are good for us to fill holes in the ladder.
Not to forget, if we just fill the C division with strong new teams it won't be fun for the teams that actually belong there.
Keep in mind that we have 4 (rather 5) free slots across both Div A and B.
And at the same time we have teams that do not want to play in a higher divisions.
So teams that want to start higher are good for us to fill holes in the ladder.
Not to forget, if we just fill the C division with strong new teams it won't be fun for the teams that actually belong there.
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Fair statement, but only if the position in higher divisions is first offered to the teams that are not new and have been in Beast 2. After that, if there are still some free slots I don't see an issue with those places being filled with even brand new teams.
Erminas is having a more radical approach than I'd take, but he is right. But if spots in other Divisions are free we should aim to fill them. However this should be done with caution and care to avoid situations like we had with Unity last season. Since I have been administrator before, I can say that Aeronwen and Ikea Knight and Ramon will do a good job, what we should do is to provide them counsel and advice if they need it.
We should try to minimize dropouts if possible. If a team disbands because they think they have the gut for Division A/B and they can't do it and then get stomped and go disband after a week it's super frustrating for everyone involved. If no spots are open for Division A/B, well, then tough luck, you either work yourself up or you don't. This is something done in every other sport as well if a more or less permanent league is established and the 'formation' of this league is already done.
If teams are getting denied a demotion to other leagues theoretically if they run into problems, then there should not be automatic elevation to the top either. If we just elevate people based on some screenshots or whatever evidence you can produce that you can beat a certain team, the work and dedication put into a tournament is useless, especially if you fight your way up through promotion matches, you have earned your place in that division so I'd strongly disagree with Aprikosenmann's Statement that someone else can take that place. Prove it in the damn season of BEAST that you're better, tournament matches are the only thing that counts imo.
We should try to minimize dropouts if possible. If a team disbands because they think they have the gut for Division A/B and they can't do it and then get stomped and go disband after a week it's super frustrating for everyone involved. If no spots are open for Division A/B, well, then tough luck, you either work yourself up or you don't. This is something done in every other sport as well if a more or less permanent league is established and the 'formation' of this league is already done.
If teams are getting denied a demotion to other leagues theoretically if they run into problems, then there should not be automatic elevation to the top either. If we just elevate people based on some screenshots or whatever evidence you can produce that you can beat a certain team, the work and dedication put into a tournament is useless, especially if you fight your way up through promotion matches, you have earned your place in that division so I'd strongly disagree with Aprikosenmann's Statement that someone else can take that place. Prove it in the damn season of BEAST that you're better, tournament matches are the only thing that counts imo.
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In the unlikely case i joined as a participant, TW would be my team, as i'm used to backstabbing alongside NIN3 and Armağan saving me as seen here
On a serious note, i hope to give some more ideas and things to think about concerning divisions (promotion/relegation etc), because i'd like to at least see multiplayer side of this game prosper, as much of the SP design is very curious to say the least.
This competition the way it is now looks like most european football leagues a lot, and i like it so (as i'm a huge sports person), would even consider following some streams for the #3.
However, a thing to consider might be implementing a north american major leagues system, where several divisions (usually reffered to as conferences there) would be considered equal, in that first 2 teams (or a different number for BEAST) from every division, after finnishing the league part of the season each in their own respective divisions, proceed to a tournament-type competition where pairs from different divisions are selected according to their final placements, and would, in this case, put couple of top teams from lower divisions in a position to fight directly for the trophy, while BEAST would still be maintaining similar quality across the divisions having the league type season part.
Even if these finals would always end with div A 1st and divA 2nd teams in it, it's would be a nice incentive for top teams of lower divisions.
I could go into detail of how this could exactly be made for BEAST, but all the info could be found online, and i believe the administration is more than experienced to adapt any real-sport competition, or mix of competitions to work with Bannerlord, so i'm just leaving this info as is.
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An interesting point. We are always open to the idea of using other formats.
The reason we are not using any system which tend to a KO system at the moment, is that for at least some weeks it excludes a large number of teams and at the moment, with the game in early access and updates occurring, the feeling is that we want to include as many teams and players as possible. The purpose is to entertain and include everyone and, hopefully, grow the scene.
The amount of Aserai lets my heart bleed.
rng! it shouldnt be overrepresented the though. The same amout of every faction was put into the list.
Note: this an answer to a post that has been removed.
Each faction is represented 6 times but the end of the rng list is reserved for one (or two) finals weeks
and they came out like this:
Empire
Sturgia
Battania
Khuzait
Battania
Vlandia
Khuzait
Vlandia
It just was not announced yet because I have been very busy designing the threads
Each faction is represented 6 times but the end of the rng list is reserved for one (or two) finals weeks
and they came out like this:
Empire
Sturgia
Battania
Khuzait
Battania
Vlandia
Khuzait
Vlandia
It just was not announced yet because I have been very busy designing the threads
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I fully trust that you're doing a good job with it as I have been part of the staff, that's not it, the issue is that Aserai is no fun to play or play against and the same goes for Khuzait to play as. If anyone would be at fault for Aserai to be not fun it's the Devs and not you guys.
The ENL from Warband had a system which allowed more rapid promotion which worked quite well when AE got put in Division C. As a bit of background AE had a load of veterans and was obviously stacked and too good for C. After winning the Division C we played a play off with a team in Division B, then a playoff vs a relegated Division A team to decide and got placed into A. This allowed quick escalation of very strong teams without letting them skip the division system entirely. We had no real qualms about playing 1 season in a lower division. I think If you start expecting new talented teams to play through 2 entire seasons of chokeslamming kittens and mismatches then you will put off new teams and lower the competition of the tournament. I agree with Erminas that consistency should be awarded but stuff should be put in place for extremely stacked teams to quickly rise through the ranks.
ah I remembered AE started in C but forgot that they accelerated that way. Makes sense imo - we can have more placing matches at the end between divs.
'Chokeslamming Kittens' is going on my list of future character names ...
Aprikosenmann
Knight
Khuzait vs Aserai is by far the most unfair matchup and should not be played in a tournament.
Anyone else have a view on this?
The plan atm is to finish the regular season in about 3 weeks and have playoffs where indicated by the tables and a final.
How are people feeling about another season?
If we have another season
should we revote on class restrictions?
is the format enjoyable?
Aprikosenmann
Knight
The interest might be dependend on the release date of ranked mode.
I dont think we will ever again get away from the class limit
As we know from Beta branch crashed through will be removed from all 2hd weapons (saving only for 2hd maul/spiked mace).
Even now Khuzait is weakest faction in game (if we have class limits of course). Without crash through on archer's and cavalry glaives faction will be almost unplayable in competitive matches and it's absolutely terrible idea of playing almost default win/lose set up.
So yes, I hold up idea of ban on khuzait - aserai matchmaking in current game balance. And most desirable don't pick Khuzait on closed range maps like Xauna and maybe Echerion.
Tbh that is a valid suggestion.
Back in the day when we created the rules for BEAST #2 we discussed it internaly. We agreed that both, your and the version we have are about equal in pro and con.
The reason why I personally was in favor of the system we have today was that a) teams can play around their economy and don't have to try to win every round. In some cases it might be better to give up a bad round early to ( for example) have tripple spawns in the following round.
The other main reason why I was in favor of the current system is simply that it's coherent with the game mode.
At the end of each set one team loses and one team wins. That's the skirmish mode. I mean the absolut worst case in that system would be a 1(9) (9) 3 - where one team would win three sets but still have an overall draw. (But that obviously doesn't happen that often)
And last but not least:
It's not really an argument for either side but I just wanted to mention it: No matter which system we choose some people will always want to have the other option.
But that being sad.
If the majority of the playerbase would like to have a round focused system rather than a win focused system, we are absolutly open for input and changes for future tournaments.
@TheBard if I recall correctly you had a suggestion, too. Maybe you'd like to mention it here , too.
why not both? sets first, if its 2:2 you count rounds. if its still a draw then oh well, no different with either system anyways
Yes, I had back when I was still admin for BEAST and I actually left it in the forums as parting gift when I decided to step down for BEAST#3.
It's basicly this:
It will make draws impossible unless both sets and rounds are tied. It will satisfy both factions, those who like the round-system and the sets-system and provides a good middle ground solution to make either everyone happy or everyone miserable together.
I'd like to add that I supported the sets-rule in BEAST#2, basicly also because I wanted to try out something new, we counted 10 years by rounds. If change is needed and wished, I'd urge the staff to adopt "sets before rounds", like krex pointed it out. If the sets are tied (2:2) then rounds are used to determine winner, if there is a winner by sets (3:1/1:3) then this will be used. It's simple, fair and there is just one way to have a draw, not the 'cursed draws' we're seeing here right now. Also it would shut down the possibility to be drawn even though winning three sets, which could be considered equally cursed, but less common than by set counting.
Edit: I'd like to argue that Eco play in Skirmish is different and it might be better to give up one round to get an edge for the entire set. If we count sets before rounds, this economy factor would not be totally destroyed than by pure round counting, but we would have less cursed draws. DR v KW Light (10:6) in BEAST#2 Week 4 is the most extreme and best example, KW fought back hard on second map, but due to losing both sets on the open map we had a draw.
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