SP Medieval Battle for Sicily 0.2 -- experimental sea battle added, plus other stuff

[Tegan]

Hey, just found the time to play Battle for Sicily this evening, and wanted to congratulate you on its quality, especially for an early version.  You show a good eye for changing the right details, so that what adds up to not much added content still feels like a significant change.  Your edits of the conversations are well done, and I can't tell you how refreshing it was not to spawn into that same old Zendar scene.  The new clothing & armour textures look good too.

A couple of minor bugs I've noticed so far:  When you return to collect your reward for destroying a band of renegades, the questgiver refers to "Zendar".

And there was a party opcode error while on the map on day 1.  I'm guessing it's a problem with one of your spawn triggers; you might want to have a look at those.

Keep up the nice work!

 

[Fimbria]

Well i tried this out and i think its a great start.
I love always having a battle to fight and the easy trade commute.

 

[nijis]

Many thanks for the kind words, and the bug reports. I'd thought I'd de-Zendarized it, but that one got away. I'm rewriting in Python right now, a long process (as you probably know), and will hopefully be able to catch that spawning bug as well.

One thing you may have confronted in 1066 -- in Python, it doesn't seem possible to fine-tune the weapon animations as well as in the unofficial editor, and you have to stick with broad itcs like "nodachi" and "longsword." This only seems to be a problem with a couple of weapons, like axes that can be swung with one or two hands but not thrust, but it's still a little frustrating. However, I might be missing something obvious, like a place in the Python files where you can define a new itc category.

 

[Tegan]

The itc's are defined in header_items.py, but the big red letters at the top say not to edit that file, so I'm guessing we're not to edit it   I'm not sure whether defining new itc's at the top of module_items would work, though; the imodbits constants are defined that way and it works; anyway there's no harm in trying it, just enter a new definition, use the itc, and see if it's recognized when you try to compile.

Regardless, that's not really necessary though, as you can assign any combination of capabilities to an item.  Just separate them by vertical lines and make sure you prefix "itc_" to combinations and "itcf_" to individual capabilities.  Here's an example from the 1066 items file:

 ["mallet","Mallet",[("mallet",0)],itp_merchandise|itp_type_two_handed_wpn|itp_primary|itp_two_handed,itcf_overswing_twohanded|itcf_slashleft_twohanded|itcf_slashright_twohanded|itc_parry_two_handed,29,weight(3.8)|difficulty(8)|spd_rtng(55)|abundance(8)|weapon_length(105)|swing_damage(35,blunt),imodbit_cracked|imodbit_bent|imodbit_balanced|imodbit_heavy],

Good luck with your Python conversion.  It is frustrating at times, but well worth it for the freedom and stability it gives you when coding.

 

[Oldtimer]

Hi all,

this is one impressive and enjoyable mod. Well done indeed. BTW, where is "Borcha" and eventual other heroes to be found?

Please don`t introduce the arena, makes game too easy. With 100 denars in starting capital you can hire men and go after the renegades.
But if there are characters starting on foot or with sumpters, then it`s very difficult without shield, agility and power strike way above any reasonable starting level. Maybe a saddle horse in the Syracuse tavern chest?

What abt. a set of national missions available to a neutral character? Missions too dangerous/dirty/undercover to be entrusted to nationals because of possible political implications if exposed. Performing them succesfully and helping people against bandits should give you a good rep with the faction concerned and voilà, you are everybodys valued friend and problem solver except for the criminals. Or you`re friends only with the criminals... Why not recruit baddies in the field and become a bandit king/queen? The ultimate goal? Your OWN state! Guiscard could...

Regards, Oldtimer

 

[nijis]

Tegan --

It never occurred to me that you could have two icps. In the end, all I needed to do for a 1/2-handed axe was have icp_scimitar|icp_nodachi. Many thanks for that.





Oldtimer --

Many thanks for the kind words, and sorry it took so long to get back to your suggestions (I was out of contact for a while).

The lack of any weapon with a too-powerful punch is intentional -- you're supposed to rely upon your men in this one, rather than tackle large bands solo. However, in future versions I'll try to have a range of starting characters, at least some of whom have enough of a weapons mix to stand alone. Rather than try to balance them at start-up I was thinking of giving each a "handicap" score, and a high one might make things more difficult later on.

The Borcha character I think is in Trapani, and the Marnid/Metrios one in Syracuse. That's it for NPCs, for now.

However, the very next version in progress will be pretty limited in scope, with a heavy emphasis on the military aspects, and probably be geographically restricted to the area of the map between Enna and Troina. (Thanks to Colt's map, that will be quite a big space in game terms, big enough to have every medium- to large-sized village and geographical feature in the real Sicily without getting too crowded). Each major town will be surrounded by a number of satellite villages and small fortresses, and the player will try to sack the enemy's villages and loot their caravans, defend friendly ones, and depending on how strong he/she feels either dodge patrols or try and lure them out to fight. The idea is to simulate the rather gruelling campaigns of economic attrition that characterized medieval warfare. And if you succeed in reducing the enemy to a point, you might be able to storm their provincial capital, and get your own county/emirate.

Once I'm satisfied with the military game, I'll try to develop the role-playing aspects. I'm thinking of moving the setting forward a hundred years or so, to the decline of the Norman kingdom and its eventual conquest by the Holy Roman Empire. The player can work for the dying Norman Hauteville dynasty, trying to cobble together a coalition in a kingdom torn apart by conflicts between Muslim and Christian, nobles and towns, the bureaucracy and the aristocracy, or be an imperial agent and sew discord in preparation for the coming of the Emperor. Or you take advantage of the chaos to run protection rackets in the back alleys of Palermo, commandeer a ship and prey on coastal merchants, or whatever.

That will be several versions in the future, however.

 

[Oldtimer]

Hi Nijis,

I think you`re on the right path with this magnificent mod, judging from above info.

I also quite agree that play should be abt. using and developing your party to your best ability as a tool for fulfilling your ambitions in game. I like to play a leader, not an ueberkiller.
To me it`s sort of contrary to the spirit of this game to become a solo performer. But to each his own...
BTW, are you considering some better morale system?

And although I find the last days of Norman Sicily a very interesting setting I would dearly miss the current period with the RPG aspects you mention and playable Byzantines included.

Regards, Oldtimer

 

[Keinonen]

Can "Swein The Saxon", or something like that, join your party and how? "Tell me some stories" doesn't tip me off.

 

[nijis]

Nope -- Swein is basically a gimmick to 1) express my own views on the effectiveness of the couched lance, and 2) provide a bit of cosmopolitan color. There were actually a fair number of former Huscarls, most likely including Hastings veterans, wandering around the Med at this time. They are reckoned to have supplanted Vikings as the mainstay of the Byzantine Varangian guard in the late 11th century. They had a rematch against the Normans at the battle of Durazzo (Dyrrhachium, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Dyrrhachium_%281081%29) in modern-day Albania in 1081, and unlike any other force in the Mediterranean at that time were able to repulse the Norman cavalry. However, the rest of the Byzantine army didn't do so well, and the Saxons were overwhelmed.

Anyway, the only two recruitable NPCs so far are clones of Marnid and Borcha in Syracuse and Trapani, respectively. The next version should have a few more possibilities.

 

[KhergitKiller]

Nice mod, but I found a bug: when fighting on the boat against the pirates I fell in the water and I landed on solid earth under the water the pirates jumped after me and fell unconciuos.

 

[nijis]

Yeah -- jumping overboard doesn't work. Liquids apart from their surfaces aren't modeled, and putting AI barriers around the boats had other unfortunate effects, so I had the choice between allowing the player to wander about in a waste-deep sea, or descend to a surreal undersea realm where presumably you'd hit TAB and lose the battle. I didnt expect the pirates to follow you overboard, though.

 

[Mengke]

Hi! This is a great mod and I've enjoyed it immensely.  However, I've been trying to recruit Metrios to no success even though the script said to provide him with a weapon.  Also, you mentioned the other recruitable character is in Trapani, however I do not see it on the map.

Once again, great work on this mod.

 

[thesneakster]

Yeah -- jumping overboard doesn't work. Liquids apart from their surfaces aren't modeled, and putting AI barriers around the boats had other unfortunate effects, so I had the choice between allowing the player to wander about in a waste-deep sea, or descend to a surreal undersea realm where presumably you'd hit TAB and lose the battle. I didnt expect the pirates to follow you overboard, though.

Hehe, nah, i followed the pirates

 

[LCJr]

Finally got a chance to try this one.  Don't know how I missed it earlier.

Not sure if it's the generally lower maneuver, higher speed or combination of the two but mounted combat takes some getting used to and not sure I like it.  Maybe I'm just spoiled.

Like the limitation  on couching.

Weapons need work.  Specifically the ones that have had their reach modified need to be remodeled or have their size adjusted.  It's odd to moderately annoying to watch a weapon pass through a character model and not register a hit. 

Also look at pricing, I noticed today a Heavy Pickaxe with 17p/95spd is $44 while the Heavy Steel Mace with 18p/89spd is $345.  I'll trade -1p for a faster and far cheaper weapon anyday.

 

[nijis]

Thanks for the comments. I was going to adjust weapons to more accurate lengths -- that the current settings lead to odd graphical effects give all the more reason to do so. I'll also have a look at pricing.

I'm glad the changes in mounted combat (which were based on 1066) have a noticeable impact. They're supposed to make mounted combat harder. However, if it crosses the line from hard to frustrating, that's good to know.

Just as an update to whoever's interested, the next version (0.3) will be substantially different, particularly on the strategic level. There will be no quests as such; rather, the player gets exp from successfully prosecuting the war on one side or another, by looting villages in enemy territory, taking small fortresses, bushwhacking caravans, and preventing the same being done to his liege lord's territory. Both sides respond to raids, launch reprisals, dispatch siege parties to recapture fortresses, etc. Sewing disorder in enemy territory makes it more difficult for them to field armies, increases the number of bandits that prey on their internal trade, and has other effects. The scale of the mod -- at least this edition -- will be a lot smaller, however, limited to the county of Troina and the emirate of Enna. Each county/emirate has 10-12 villages or estates plus 3-4 small fortresses, in addition to the large towns. I'll add in the rest of the island in v 0.4.

Most of this is already coded, and the main thing I need to do now is add in grand finale sieges of the larger towns. If anyone wants to playtest what I have now, send me a PM. Otherwise the new version should come out in a few weeks, hopefully.

 

[LCJr]

Well it's definately noticeable and does make mounted combat harder.  Or I should say it makes mounted combat against infantry harder.  Like I said it may just be me so don't change the horses just over my opinion

One other thing I forgot mention last post.  On occasion I'm getting an error message after winning the Saracuse>Balermo pirates scene.  It always occurs after the battle is won and it's placing you in Balermo.  Hitting retry crashes the game.  Selecting ignore keeps the game running without any noticeable effects.  I apologize for not writing down the error message.  Next time it happens I will be sure to do so.

Arab Infantry/Deserters dropping the occasional Invalid_Item.

And suppose you already know the Jafaar's recruiting dialogue  makes reference to 4 different towns.

@Mengke  To get Metrios you have to find a Spathion in any condition.  Light Spathion doesn't do it as I found out the hard way.

 

[spirit]

Its a OK game.. 

 

[Dwarfs ftw]

I found out a weird thing when I was fighting against the pirates. When the fight was over on the ships. I noticed that there was still someone left but I saw no one onboard. Then I decided to jump in the water and I saw that there was a guy named drowned troop or something like that and he was fighting against a pirate. 

 

[ronin47]

Great Mod!!! I am playing it for 5 Weeks now and I´m not getting bored. Keep up the good work and get us the new Version ASAP!

 

[nijis]

Thanks for the kind words. In a few days I should be able to put out a summary of what the new version will have, and a few screenshots. It would be great to get some feedback. A fairly smooth playable version is probably a few weeks away, however.

The "drowning" guy was the only way I can think of to make sure that pirates who fall overboard die quickly and don't keep the game going, and he has that name so that the message line reads "Sicilian pirate killed by drowning." As far as I could tell, even the longest falls aren't necessarily fatal.  He's supposed to be able to finish off the pirates pretty quickly, but if they're living long enough to make you jump overboard to get them maybe I need to change something. There's probably a more elegant way to remove pirates and sailors who fall in the water, but I couldn't think of anything offhand.