Battania musings

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diehold

Recruit
Why is Battania the only faction in Bannerlord that never plays to it's strength in battle? Every other faction does. Vlandia always fields lots of cavalry. Khuzait's always masses with horse archers. Battania is an archer faction and yet they never mass many archers always mass infantry. It never made any sense to me. To have some of the best archers and never use them in any meaningful way. And considering that they are surrounded on all sides it would make sense for them to rely on their strengths to survive but alas they do. Just goes to show this game is more about massing numbers than any particular unit type. For good or bad.
 

geala

Squire
In vanilla Battania only has noble troops as archers. They are the best archers in the game and there are too many noble troops around to recruit on my opinion by far, but the AI don't necessarily amass them.

I like to play as Battania but I have massively changed troop trees (f. e. no noble archer line but added normal archers), for me Battania is more a no/low armor skirmisher faction with javelins and bows but not bow centric.
 

diehold

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In vanilla Battania only has noble troops as archers. They are the best archers in the game and there are too many noble troops around to recruit on my opinion by far, but the AI don't necessarily amass them.

I like to play as Battania but I have massively changed troop trees (f. e. no noble archer line but added normal archers), for me Battania is more a no/low armor skirmisher faction with javelins and bows but not bow centric.
I'm talking about how the AI plays these factions unmodded not human controlled players modded.
 

diehold

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Maybe they're getting raided too much and getting recruits from towns who have no archer units.
Possibly... But every playthrough... I would bet that it's an intended feature to handicap them by the devs. If Battania was allowed to play to their strengths they would probably run the map.
 

Ananda_The_Destroyer

Grandmaster Knight
Possibly... But every playthrough... I would bet that it's an intended feature to handicap them by the devs. If Battania was allowed to play to their strengths they would probably run the map.
Nope, it wouldn't matter at all because Fians aren't powerful in auto calc battles. The other t6 nobles who are mounted are all more powerful in auto calc battles. Archers also aren't particularly powerful for the AI in live battles because it does not properly position, move or protect them.
 

diehold

Recruit
Nope, it wouldn't matter at all because Fians aren't powerful in auto calc battles. The other t6 nobles who are mounted are all more powerful in auto calc battles. Archers also aren't particularly powerful for the AI in live battles because it does not properly position, move or protect them.
You're probably right about that but it's still of odd that they don't field more of them and opt for poorly armored infantry. Just curious with auto calc battles.. is there a difference in simulations between lets say sending in the troops or dying in combat and finishing it by auto sim? But you are right the AI is terrible in battles.
 

Ananda_The_Destroyer

Grandmaster Knight
You're probably right about that but it's still of odd that they don't field more of them and opt for poorly armored infantry. Just curious with auto calc battles.. is there a difference in simulations between lets say sending in the troops or dying in combat and finishing it by auto sim? But you are right the AI is terrible in battles.
Sending in the troops is an auto calc battle using the same rules as when 2 AI parties fight each other. Tactics, medicine and certain perks of the party leader effect it.
Being KO'd in battle causes your troops to go on delegated command but it is still a live battle using physics based damage where types of troops and thier behavior make a big difference in the out come. For instance if you had a large amount of ranged units in a good position when you were KO'd they will still be able to do a lot of damage after wards, even if some of their behaviors/movements aren't as good as you could control yourself. If you fast forward it's still just a live battle playing out. If you exit the battle and then send the troops, it's an auto calc battle.
 

diehold

Recruit
Sending in the troops is an auto calc battle using the same rules as when 2 AI parties fight each other. Tactics, medicine and certain perks of the party leader effect it.
Being KO'd in battle causes your troops to go on delegated command but it is still a live battle using physics based damage where types of troops and thier behavior make a big difference in the out come. For instance if you had a large amount of ranged units in a good position when you were KO'd they will still be able to do a lot of damage after wards, even if some of their behaviors/movements aren't as good as you could control yourself. If you fast forward it's still just a live battle playing out. If you exit the battle and then send the troops, it's an auto calc battle.
Interesting. That makes me not like tactics. Tactics seems to negate this game as some kind of realistic simulator based on troop type etc. Everything just comes down to a meaningless algorithm. Then like I said this troop type doesn't matter in this game just troop numbers and tactics.
 
I'm talking about how the AI plays these factions unmodded not human controlled players modded.
Because they can't really get enough noble archers from villages?

I don't even think it would be much trouble restructuring the troop tree. Just chuck the garbage horseman out, put the falxman there and then add a tree to the woodrunner line.
 

Ananda_The_Destroyer

Grandmaster Knight
Interesting. That makes me not like tactics. Tactics seems to negate this game as some kind of realistic simulator based on troop type etc. Everything just comes down to a meaningless algorithm. Then like I said this troop type doesn't matter in this game just troop numbers and tactics.
I've come to not care for the skill tactics too. There are a few okay perks on it but the skill is pretty useless, unless you actually don't want to do any live battles anyway and even then it's a paradox as it won't really help much until you've got it very high and have a huge party anyways. You could skip it and still auto calc battles and it's not going to change the game much. The only time I auto calc a battle is when I've been KO'd in a siege and have a keep battle. Even with almost no tactics I almost never lose a single troop in the keep battle.
 

Brano

Sergeant at Arms
Even I play for Battania a lot (underdog or challenge or whatever), I consider them a redundant culture/kingdom in the game 🤷🏻‍♂️
 

diehold

Recruit
I've come to not care for the skill tactics too. There are a few okay perks on it but the skill is pretty useless, unless you actually don't want to do any live battles anyway and even then it's a paradox as it won't really help much until you've got it very high and have a huge party anyways. You could skip it and still auto calc battles and it's not going to change the game much. The only time I auto calc a battle is when I've been KO'd in a siege and have a keep battle. Even with almost no tactics I almost never lose a single troop in the keep battle.
Exactly, I play it the same way. I've never gone past the first few perks cause I enjoy battling too much. How you explained it makes a lot factors that should be important to how a battle is decided very arbitrary. I would use tactics if it actually effected real battles and not simmed ones.
 

diehold

Recruit
Because they can't really get enough noble archers from villages?

I don't even think it would be much trouble restructuring the troop tree. Just chuck the garbage horseman out, put the falxman there and then add a tree to the woodrunner line.
The troop tree doesn't need restructuring. They have the same amount of noble troop villages as every other faction. It's about how the AI is programmed to play the Battanians.
 

diehold

Recruit
Even I play for Battania a lot (underdog or challenge or whatever), I consider them a redundant culture/kingdom in the game 🤷🏻‍♂️
They are completely different than every other kingdom. Their troops are unique compared to other kingdoms. How does that make them redundant? It's how the AI is programmed to utilize that faction that I find odd.
 

fragonard

Grandmaster Knight
WB
Trying to pin down exact cultural references will just make you nuts. They pick and choose ideas. The longbow and Celtic parts are like 11th C Welsh, otherwise Battanians seem pre-Norman Welsh/Irish/Scot. The falx comes from Roman era Balkans. It's all mixed up.
 
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