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Bannerlord was thought to be an evolution of Warband in almost all levels, but it finally wasn't.

Users who are viewing this thread

johnny keitz

Recruit
1)Immersion and lore. No significant improvements whatsoever. It's this spiritless world you don't give 2 cents about. Cities are meaningless names like dots on a map. No history, no secrets, no glorious past, no people's daily stories. No unique culture and quirks for each faction. No diplomatic and strategic differences when you interact interfactionaly. No historical alliances and hostilities between them either. Spontatneous wars erratically happening for no reason. No artifacts, no prizes to be sought after, no secrets to be brought to light.

2)Common sense lacking yet again. When the Lord aka you has to bother with the most menial of loots, like picking each fur coat after a battle one by one, you know no real thought has gone into the common sense department. You should be able to make your inferiors to bother with those matters. Or to select them en mass through smart menu buttons, or have a system that automatically picks only the best loot and resolves the lesser logistics like that. Or when you banter, there is no wit put into it like in classic RPG games with great bantering mechanisms like vampire masquerades or fallout. Bots and factions have no character. Also you are not motivated to up your skills and charisma for more bantering variety. Or when smaller armies than you still chase you around etc.Common sense is as lacking as ever.

3)Your land but not exactly your land. When anyone can come and pick men from your fiefs with no repercussions. No banter, no paying any fees as a sign of respect etc. When no matter your renown you get equally looted by bandits etc. When you clear an area and it is still as infected as ever. Caravans and foreign parties move through and through your lands completely unchecked and uninhibited.

4)Your actions overall are aimless and unrewarding. Fighting, besieging castles, beating impossible armies, nothing leaves a mark, nothing matters. It's just a +1 in whatever meaningless list you are upgrading.

5)Upgrade your village or castle, but for what? It's just useless clicking addons.

6)The AI of your Lords. well it's not exactly what you would wish for a companion.

7)Building your relationships with nobles and questing in general. You jusst can't bother with it. It's a copy pasta of WB yet again. Same with how limited are the activities that upgrade your individual skills. Like mechanics only through sieges etc. Or building relationship with your fiefs being so limiting and often stagnating too when they have no more silly quests to give you. Not like you could bring gifts, donate money, bring protection, raise infrastructures, marry your lords to their peasant girls etc to raise relationship status. Of course those couldn't be options, lol.

:cool:How imprisoned Lords escape from captivity so easily. Like you can't double the guards or put your trusted seasoned veterans to guard them.

Why so many years for this TW? you could just make more expansions for WB and save yourself unlimited effort and money... .
 

Archeonw

Recruit
It is all about the engine and core game I think. Native was never good. They never really made it balanced or fleshed out. Vikings was half finished when it came out and basically added boat fights to the game... which i don't even know if this game has. I haven't seen them.

It is going to be up to the modders to make great games like they had done with Warband to keep people invested in the game for years. I know I played multiple mods that were far superior to native in every conceivable way.

Why they didn't just hire some of the people from their community to really flesh out this new game for the last 5 years of its development is a sad state of affairs.

It really looks like the only thing they tried improving were the graphics and the seige mechanics. The latter of which could have been another amazing expansion to warband years ago that might have been a good test run for this new game.
 

johnny keitz

Recruit
It is all about the engine and core game I think. Native was never good. They never really made it balanced or fleshed out. Vikings was half finished when it came out and basically added boat fights to the game... which i don't even know if this game has. I haven't seen them.

It is going to be up to the modders to make great games like they had done with Warband to keep people invested in the game for years. I know I played multiple mods that were far superior to native in every conceivable way.

Why they didn't just hire some of the people from their community to really flesh out this new game for the last 5 years of its development is a sad state of affairs.

It really looks like the only thing they tried improving were the graphics and the seige mechanics. The latter of which could have been another amazing expansion to warband years ago that might have been a good test run for this new game.
Some really talented modders indeed. Maybe if they joined the team, their valueable experience and imagination could improve the experience. And forgive me for being a vanilla guy, but when i buy a game, i want it to be complete. If i were to wait for "pirate" extras to make it playable then please don't bother me with it in the first place... .
 

pRaX

Sergeant
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
I can tell you with pretty good certainty what's up with it.
They build the game and engine from the ground up with modding in mind. Which takes alot of time and effort. Tools have to be made aswell.
The current mods you find so amazing are 99% utilizing things that are already in the game but more or less locked for various reasons.

Show mods that have completely original functions/code. You will only find very very few. If at all.
You'd be amazed what you can find in the files right now if you were capable.

I sometimes get the feeling that if I'd fire up a simple hexeditor nowadays, change something and release it... I'd be allowed to call myself modder. Which is a ridiculous notion to me.

I love the modding community as much as the next guy.

The game isn't finished though. Alot has to be done still. Not trying to silence you but yelling TW bad Modders better is just pathetic and shows your lack knowledge. Hell I am an absolute amateur when it comes to these things but some people really need a reality check.
 

Archeonw

Recruit
Some really talented modders indeed. Maybe if they joined the team, their valueable experience and imagination could improve the experience. And forgive me for being a vanilla guy, but when i buy a game, i want it to be complete. If i were to wait for "pirate" extras to make it playable then please don't bother me with it in the first place... .

For me, I basically wanted them to do this exactly. I knew I was never going to like/love vanilla, so I hope they get the mod tools out soon because I know there are really great modders out there that are going to make this game last another 5000 hours for me.

So honestly, chucking 50$ at this title was easy. Even if it is hardly finished. Like Skyrim, this game thrives on its modding community and i'm sure I will spend thousands of hours just riding around taking peoples heads off.
 

johnny keitz

Recruit
I can tell you with pretty good certainty what's up with it.
They build the game and engine from the ground up with modding in mind. Which takes alot of time and effort. Tools have to be made aswell.
The current mods you find so amazing are 99% utilizing things that are already in the game but more or less locked for various reasons.

Show mods that have completely original functions/code. You will only find very very few. If at all.
You'd be amazed what you can find in the files right now if you were capable.

I sometimes get the feeling that if I'd fire up a simple hexeditor nowadays, change something and release it... I'd be allowed to call myself modder. Which is a ridiculous notion to me.

I love the modding community as much as the next guy.

The game isn't finished though. Alot has to be done still. Not trying to silence you but yelling TW bad Modders better is just pathetic and shows your lack knowledge. Hell I am an absolute amateur when it comes to these things but some people really need a reality check.

They reality check is when you hype a game for 10 years better produce an improved product. If it was me i would prefer to never publish it, than do it in that condition. I wouldn't make them wait for 10 years for a WB copypasta.
 

pRaX

Sergeant
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
They reality check is when you hype a game for 10 years better produce an improved product. If it was me i would prefer to never publish it, than do it in that condition. I wouldn't make them wait for 10 years for a WB copypasta.
I don't disagree that they announced Bannerlord waaaay to early. That was a big mistake.
 

Maximum997

Squire
It is going to be up to the modders to make great games like they had done with Warband to keep people invested in the game for years. I know I played multiple mods that were far superior to native in every conceivable way.
Yes. Thats why the should make game works in the first place. Players are very annoyed that after so much patches half of the perks still doesnt works.
No one ******* cares about OP pottery or caravans.
 

Masakari

Recruit
I think they earned to much money with this game.
Well, everyone can do whatever he want. When you make cash with an idea ( M&B1). You can do with it whatever you want.
But im sure, not even 5% of it went into Bannerlord.
Modders made Mods like Prophecy of Pendor for Warband without beeing paid.
With Backgrounds, with Story, with great ideas. In less than 1 year.
Ive played some hours here now....and i have to say. Prophecy of Pendor is better. In nearly everything except the Graphics.
I wish there would be the 3x speed Move Button on Map for M&B1...That and the better Trading and Inventory makes this game better than the old one.
I cant even restart a new Campaign. I do it....see the first Village quest and think "boahhh **** it nooo pülease not again 500x fail and reload for Family Feud...". And stop playing.
Every Modder in this World would have better Quest Ideas in less than one Week. And 20 more different Quests in this game in less than 1 Year.
And they needed what? 7 Years? For 20 Different Quests?
Hooooly ****! Where is all the money? ^^
 

qmax

Regular
Well, I have been playing Mount and Blade for the last 15 years, warts and all. There is not another game like it. And Bannerlord has improved on almost every aspect apart from many oversights which will get fixed. I am disappointed in the current state but also excited that there is an amazing structure for improvements over the next 15 years.
 

johnny keitz

Recruit
Well, I have been playing Mount and Blade for the last 15 years, warts and all. There is not another game like it. And Bannerlord has improved on almost every aspect apart from many oversights which will get fixed. I am disappointed in the current state but also excited that there is an amazing structure for improvements over the next 15 years.
I wish i could share your excitement. If i could, i'd get my 50 dollars back though... .
 

Habut

Sergeant
WB
1)Immersion and lore. No significant improvements whatsoever. It's this spiritless world you don't give 2 cents about. Cities are meaningless names like dots on a map. No history, no secrets, no glorious past, no people's daily stories. No unique culture and quirks for each faction. No diplomatic and strategic differences when you interact interfactionaly. No historical alliances and hostilities between them either. Spontatneous wars erratically happening for no reason. No artifacts, no prizes to be sought after, no secrets to be brought to light.

2)Common sense lacking yet again. When the Lord aka you has to bother with the most menial of loots, like picking each fur coat after a battle one by one, you know no real thought has gone into the common sense department. You should be able to make your inferiors to bother with those matters. Or to select them en mass through smart menu buttons, or have a system that automatically picks only the best loot and resolves the lesser logistics like that. Or when you banter, there is no wit put into it like in classic RPG games with great bantering mechanisms like vampire masquerades or fallout. Bots and factions have no character. Also you are not motivated to up your skills and charisma for more bantering variety. Or when smaller armies than you still chase you around etc.Common sense is as lacking as ever.

3)Your land but not exactly your land. When anyone can come and pick men from your fiefs with no repercussions. No banter, no paying any fees as a sign of respect etc. When no matter your renown you get equally looted by bandits etc. When you clear an area and it is still as infected as ever. Caravans and foreign parties move through and through your lands completely unchecked and uninhibited.

4)Your actions overall are aimless and unrewarding. Fighting, besieging castles, beating impossible armies, nothing leaves a mark, nothing matters. It's just a +1 in whatever meaningless list you are upgrading.

5)Upgrade your village or castle, but for what? It's just useless clicking addons.

6)The AI of your Lords. well it's not exactly what you would wish for a companion.

7)Building your relationships with nobles and questing in general. You jusst can't bother with it. It's a copy pasta of WB yet again. Same with how limited are the activities that upgrade your individual skills. Like mechanics only through sieges etc. Or building relationship with your fiefs being so limiting and often stagnating too when they have no more silly quests to give you. Not like you could bring gifts, donate money, bring protection, raise infrastructures, marry your lords to their peasant girls etc to raise relationship status. Of course those couldn't be options, lol.

:cool:How imprisoned Lords escape from captivity so easily. Like you can't double the guards or put your trusted seasoned veterans to guard them.

Why so many years for this TW? you could just make more expansions for WB and save yourself unlimited effort and money... .

1- fair criticism and even devs acknowledged this I think. The world needs to feel more alive.

2- stupid criticism if anything UI has improved greatly. I hope to god TW doesn't take this point seriously. Current loot system is fine. That is what makes M&B special, you are more hands on and personal with stuff. This isn't a tabletop strategy management game. Your suggestions are not improvements but worse than ever actually lol. The banter can be improved but its not abysmal. Also small armies don't chase you but follow you in case they gather enough support.

3- You expect people to pay you in order to travel through your lands? That also be worst **** ever. Overall the most important thing is gameplay and player experience. What you suggest provides none of those. You are just throwing **** out there for the sake of realism without any thought. Caravans and foreign parties can and should move through your lands unless you are in war with them, that is how things also work in real life. They are also in danger if they go into enemy lands. Even in reality there were no border controls back in medieval times, raiders were looting a lot. If they implement the system you describe it would be insanely suffocating and you literally can't go anywere at the start of the game as well. Also clearing looters and bandit hideouts do have an impact.

4- You literally listed everything you can do in game and said you don't like them so what is even the point.

5- Upgrade your village or castle so that they won't get sieged easily. Upgrading walls have huge impact on sieges. Have you played the game or just watched videos? I am not even gonna describe the other stuff, if you don't manage the cities they can literally starve rofl. What is the point i guess.

6- again fair criticism, AI has issues and can be improved

7- I really don't understand your logic. You improve relations so that they join you later when you form kingdom and stay in your kingdom. They also vote heavily in your favor if they like you. Same logic with king/queen if they like you they literally give you a lot castles.


To me it sounds like you just had huge expectations of this game, was disappointed and literally wanted to complain about every single aspect of it for no reason. I can understand if you are disappointed after waiting a lot of time however most of your criticism doesn't make any sense because you are just criticizing the core concepts of the game, not even the implementation of the devs. From your criticism what I understand is you just don't like this type of game overall. Because most of the **** you say you don't like isn't actually implementation but the core concepts of the game. I guess you should have waited until the end of early access at least.
 

hruza

Knight at Arms
1)Immersion and lore. No significant improvements whatsoever. It's this spiritless world you don't give 2 cents about. Cities are meaningless names like dots on a map. No history, no secrets, no glorious past, no people's daily stories. No unique culture and quirks for each faction. No diplomatic and strategic differences when you interact interfactionaly. No historical alliances and hostilities between them either. Spontatneous wars erratically happening for no reason. No artifacts, no prizes to be sought after, no secrets to be brought to light.

It's a sandbox game. Always was. Had always meant to be. While more flavor of the kind you have described would certainly be welcome, it's not core of the game.

2)Common sense lacking yet again. When the Lord aka you has to bother with the most menial of loots, like picking each fur coat after a battle one by one, you know no real thought has gone into the common sense department. You should be able to make your inferiors to bother with those matters. Or to select them en mass through smart menu buttons, or have a system that automatically picks only the best loot and resolves the lesser logistics like that.

There's "loot all" button on the top of a loot list. It will transfer everything to your inventory with one click.

Or when you banter, there is no wit put into it like in classic RPG games with great bantering mechanisms like vampire masquerades or fallout. Bots and factions have no character. Also you are not motivated to up your skills and charisma for more bantering variety. Or when smaller armies than you still chase you around etc.Common sense is as lacking as ever.

They are trailing you waiting for more allies to arrive.

3)Your land but not exactly your land. When anyone can come and pick men from your fiefs with no repercussions.

They are not picking men from your fiefs, they are picking them from "notables" -powerful people who live there and are not part of your property.


No banter, no paying any fees as a sign of respect etc. When no matter your renown you get equally looted by bandits etc. When you clear an area and it is still as infected as ever. Caravans and foreign parties move through and through your lands completely unchecked and uninhibited.

You own the village, not the country.

4)Your actions overall are aimless and unrewarding. Fighting, besieging castles, beating impossible armies, nothing leaves a mark, nothing matters. It's just a +1 in whatever meaningless list you are upgrading.

It's a sandbox game.

5)Upgrade your village or castle, but for what? It's just useless clicking addons.

To receive more coins and keep your garrisons fed.

6)The AI of your Lords. well it's not exactly what you would wish for a companion.

AI of enemy lords isn't better.

7)Building your relationships with nobles and questing in general. You jusst can't bother with it. It's a copy pasta of WB yet again.

No need to reinvent wheel.

Same with how limited are the activities that upgrade your individual skills. Like mechanics only through sieges etc.

How else do you want to upgrade skill that let's you besiege better?

Or building relationship with your fiefs being so limiting and often stagnating too when they have no more silly quests to give you. Not like you could bring gifts, donate money, bring protection, raise infrastructures, marry your lords to their peasant girls etc to raise relationship status. Of course those couldn't be options, lol.

You have complained about mechanics of the game been too shallow above. Now you to want to improve relations with people just by spending money on them.

:cool:How imprisoned Lords escape from captivity so easily. Like you can't double the guards or put your trusted seasoned veterans to guard them.

Lords were made to escape easily in one of the patches in order to prevent realms been steamrolled early game before player got chance to join one or make his own. Game is Early Access, it's still been worked on.

Why so many years for this TW? you could just make more expansions for WB and save yourself unlimited effort and money... .

Expanding WB can get you only so far. That game is decade old by now and not up to today standard.
 

johnny keitz

Recruit
It's a sandbox game. Always was. Had always meant to be. While more flavor of the kind you have described would certainly be welcome, it's not core of the game.



There's "loot all" button on the top of a loot list. It will transfer everything to your inventory with one click.



They are trailing you waiting for more allies to arrive.



They are not picking men from your fiefs, they are picking them from "notables" -powerful people who live there and are not part of your property.




You own the village, not the country.



It's a sandbox game.



To receive more coins and keep your garrisons fed.



AI of enemy lords isn't better.



No need to reinvent wheel.



How else do you want to upgrade skill that let's you besiege better?



You have complained about mechanics of the game been too shallow above. Now you to want to improve relations with people just by spending money on them.



Lords were made to escape easily in one of the patches in order to prevent realms been steamrolled early game before player got chance to join one or make his own. Game is Early Access, it's still been worked on.



Expanding WB can get you only so far. That game is decade old by now and not up to today standard.


Expanding wb can only get you so far yet here they are making a copy pasta of it. as for being a sandbox game that doesnt excuse anything. not the lack of depth and lore, nor the lack of interesting gameplay and mechanics. And the lack of a thoughtful, balanced and progressive reward system depending on gravity of actions etc. Or immersing you with the lively reactions of the npcs in cities etc.
 

johnny keitz

Recruit
1- fair criticism and even devs acknowledged this I think. The world needs to feel more alive.

2- stupid criticism if anything UI has improved greatly. I hope to god TW doesn't take this point seriously. Current loot system is fine. That is what makes M&B special, you are more hands on and personal with stuff. This isn't a tabletop strategy management game. Your suggestions are not improvements but worse than ever actually lol. The banter can be improved but its not abysmal. Also small armies don't chase you but follow you in case they gather enough support.

3- You expect people to pay you in order to travel through your lands? That also be worst **** ever. Overall the most important thing is gameplay and player experience. What you suggest provides none of those. You are just throwing **** out there for the sake of realism without any thought. Caravans and foreign parties can and should move through your lands unless you are in war with them, that is how things also work in real life. They are also in danger if they go into enemy lands. Even in reality there were no border controls back in medieval times, raiders were looting a lot. If they implement the system you describe it would be insanely suffocating and you literally can't go anywere at the start of the game as well. Also clearing looters and bandit hideouts do have an impact.

4- You literally listed everything you can do in game and said you don't like them so what is even the point.

5- Upgrade your village or castle so that they won't get sieged easily. Upgrading walls have huge impact on sieges. Have you played the game or just watched videos? I am not even gonna describe the other stuff, if you don't manage the cities they can literally starve rofl. What is the point i guess.

6- again fair criticism, AI has issues and can be improved

7- I really don't understand your logic. You improve relations so that they join you later when you form kingdom and stay in your kingdom. They also vote heavily in your favor if they like you. Same logic with king/queen if they like you they literally give you a lot castles.


To me it sounds like you just had huge expectations of this game, was disappointed and literally wanted to complain about every single aspect of it for no reason. I can understand if you are disappointed after waiting a lot of time however most of your criticism doesn't make any sense because you are just criticizing the core concepts of the game, not even the implementation of the devs. From your criticism what I understand is you just don't like this type of game overall. Because most of the **** you say you don't like isn't actually implementation but the core concepts of the game. I guess you should have waited until the end of early access at least.
yes i listed everything you can do cause nothing matters. its fighting for fighting. no story, no progression, no emotional reward, no achievements, no immersion of how the world treats you even if you are the next alexander the great. a sterile system of plus ones on even more meaningless lists of perks.
 

Rorxy

Regular
Another few downgrades imo
-The whole courting system feels cheap and tacky, it feels like they played kingdom come and tried to splice it into warband. I much preferred warband where there was enough roleplay that you actually felt some kind of a connection to the character but not too much where people not in for the roleplay didn’t get bored. Now it’s go to the same person and memorise the correct sequence for just 5 or 6 skill checks.
- The banner editor. I’m not a fan for 2 reasons, in warband if you wanted a banner from the start you could choose the noble line from memory but otherwise you got your banner from joining a kingdom. This way it felt like you had actually earned it and made a name for yourself. My other issue is that whilst you can customise your banner it’s incredibly dull and boring and I don’t like how all the vassals banners look the same. There was a thread where they showed that you can still use faction colours to better identify troops but with a much greater range of variety so you aren’t stuck with the same background and indistinguishable emblem.
- The companions are dull. They all have the same backstory with no real variety and most of them just feel like reskins with no perks, grab a healer for your party and grab one with high leadership for a second party and that’s it.
- No peace time events such as feasts and no dialogue options with any lords. This makes any prolonged period of peace incredibly dull and pointless except to hope that your fellow vassals actually replenish and upgrade their party and garrisons
 

hruza

Knight at Arms
Expanding wb can only get you so far yet here they are making a copy pasta of it.

They are not. Bannerlord runs on completely new graphics.

as for being a sandbox game that doesnt excuse anything.

Yes it does. Because game design contains a balance. If you make game more sandboxy, it will be less unique by definition. And vice versa.

not the lack of depth and lore, nor the lack of interesting gameplay and mechanics.

It have interesting gameplay and mechanics enough for it to be one of the most successful game series ever.

And the lack of a thoughtful, balanced and progressive reward system depending on gravity of actions etc.

You have just demanded that you can just throw money on NPCs to insta improve relations with them. You need to make your mind what it should be, rewarding system or insta system where you get something by clicking the spend button.

Or immersing you with the lively reactions of the npcs in cities etc.

Or with the cutting trees in the woods and watching the squirrels. If you want social game, you need to try sims, or something like that. This game is primarily about Medieval warfare, not about social life in the villages. Game focus is somewhere else.
 

Maximum997

Squire
- The companions are dull. They all have the same backstory with no real variety and most of them just feel like reskins with no perks, grab a healer for your party and grab one with high leadership for a second party and that’s it.
They are just procedure generetad dummies.
 

froggyluv

Grandmaster Knight
NW
Lords personalities should be set in stone so they can build canon around them. Let the 2nd generation lords be rng personalities. The world needs a frame to play off of

Better hire a writing team...lickety splits
 
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