Bannerlord was a grift

[vonbalt]

Details?

They showed the game saying it was very advanced in development in 2016 and that they hoped to release it in some form by the end of the year, that the game only needed polishing touches and improvements to mid-late game.

2016 went by and nothing, they went dark for a while and seemed to start reworking things (map, lighting, features) without an apparent reason (later speculated to have been a bad case of dev-hell) and we only got the game in 2020, 4 years after they "hoped" to release the game and in a complete unfinished state, to make things worse having axed/changed features shown to be implemented and working before in-game (controlling alleys, castle building, smithy commissioning, more detailed dialogues and commands to the AI, world map changed with lots of inconsistencies compared to previous versions as if it had been rushed, no minor-faction bases and so on)

 

[Bjorn The Dead]

I really wonder, will we get any chance to know what happened between those 4 years in some distant future.

 

[Roy1012]

I really wonder, will we get any chance to know what happened between those 4 years in some distant future.

 

[Bjorn The Dead]

 

[bonerstorm]

Sadly, that sounds more realistic nowadays, than it was at the beginning of the EA.

I read many suggestion posts here and there all over the forums and I see what devs reply to them - roughly these are "We are still discussing it" or "We won't make this".

Feasts are being discussed, taking over alleys is being discussed, manhunters are either being discussed or rejected (can't remember well), don't know what are their plans for implementing NPC party orders system (telling a lord/lady to go to a specific town, attack a village, etc. like in Warband) - the list may be continued.

If the game as it is considered to be almost finished - well, that'll be a huge disappointment

Meanwhile clueless saps on Steam are like "I can't wait until feasts are implemented!" or "Please add elephants!" or "Is it just me or does Siege AI not work?"

 

[AndrewArt]

Ah yes, they took 8 years and built an entirely new engine just to scam you... Triple AAA companies rereleasing the same lazy copy-pasted games every year are not scamming people, this is, a game that took 8 years to even start selling.

 

[Aurex]

I wonder who will thinks the title says gift and have a very confusing time trying to understand the topic.
? ?

I misread it as gift and was about to chuckle at the post, then I read it and was like: "Oh."
It's best to just accept the OP is probably right and wait for the few modders who will have stuck with Bannerlord after a couple years to come out with something amazing, like Prophesy of Pendor, Brytenwalda, Last Days of the Third Age and the others wonderful mods out there.

 

[stevehoos]

Meanwhile clueless saps on Steam are like "I can't wait until feasts are implemented!" or "Please add elephants!" or "Is it just me or does Siege AI not work?"

8 years in the making. Just give it time.

 

[Rungsted93]

8 years in the making. Just give it time.

"It's Early Access, can't you read?!"

Usually followed by telling us all we should be nice to TW, and be patient because surely the game will eventually turn out great then!
(Kind of ironic the people who's known about the game for a few days, tells the people waiting for 10+ years to be patient)

 

[Ananda_The_Destroyer]

"It's Early Access, can't you read?!"

Usually followed by telling us all we should be nice to TW, and be patient because surely the game will eventually turn out great then!
(Kind of ironic the people who's known about the game for a few days, tells the people waiting for 10+ years to be patient)

Imagine being a noob coming to read threads about why thier workshops don't make money or how to unlock javelin parts and you find out Santa Clause isn't real and all your dream features have already been NOPE'd by TW. ?
It's just gotta be from all this negativity voodooing all the future features out of existence!

 

[Agroplode]

To much drama here for the amount of money paid and time played!

 

[bonerstorm]

Imagine being a noob coming to read threads about why thier workshops don't make money or how to unlock javelin parts and you find out Santa Clause isn't real and all your dream features have already been NOPE'd by TW. ?
It's just gotta be from all this negativity voodooing all the future features out of existence!

Seriously... just look at the trending topics on the Steam boards if you want a cheap laugh.

"Please add elephants!" "Armour: useless" "Why is killing a lord so punishing?" "Why can't I change my beard?" "Increase companion limits?" "No lords want to join me"

AND THE FUNNIEST:
"When the game will support workshop?"

Lol TW isn't even supporting modders on the official forums. Steam Workshop support is just delusional.

 

[RalliX]

I’m posting this from my phone, so forgive the readability if it sucks. I’m also moving it to this thread as it seems more relevant than where I first put it.

The history of the game is the rags to riches dream of any new game developer. In this case starting from nothing, then making a basic working concept medieval fighting game. WarRider.

Then expanding and building an engine with a small development team into a real marketable game. Mount & Blade.

Then they expand just a little more on that rock-solid foundation of tried and true software and expand the features and improve the quality with the standalone expansion. They document the simplicity of modifying the code so that the game’s life is extensible even by amateur developers and modders FAR past its release replayability.

Warband, a beautiful game I spent probably over ten thousand hours playing. I’ve played it more than any other game.

Then they decided to take the next logical step.
They’re not Indie anymore, they’re ready to be the biggest video game development studio in Turkey.

A true sequel successor is what makes sense.
Bannerlord.
What could go wrong?

Well if you’re starting from scratch creatively on a brand new software engine with a large development team and you’ve never done that before...

Anything, everything can absolutely go wrong and if you do not know the way, with something like software development, it is virtually guaranteed to go wrong.

I’ve been absolutely saddened by the state of BannerLord. I’ve sort of moved on.
I’ve also lately been absolutely intrigued by learning about software development as a discipline.

My favourite channel to listen to about this subject is Continuous Delivery.

He posted a video today describing in some detail his understanding of the efficient production of software.



I think what has happened is that much of the early development time was lost. This is really a very ambitious and complex project. They probably had to scrap much of their progress due to an inefficient development cycle. Hence the need for an even now incomplete refactoring of the code.

I don’t think it’s anybody’s fault really. The fact is that the game is too large of a project for certain development strategies.

If the development strategy is not correct from the beginning there is potential for massive amounts of time and work to be wasted.

I get the feeling that this may be what has happened. It’s an honest mistake, I think.

Whether the game’s development can be saved at this point remains to be seen. At this point TW has got to be feeling the heat. I want badly for them to succeed, but the state of the game is improving too slowly. It’s just not fun enough, and it won’t be until some point after the refactoring is satisfactory to TW and the modding community can finally get their teeth into the gameplay side of things.

 

[eddiemccandless]

I’m posting this from my phone, so forgive the readability if it sucks. I’m also moving it to this thread as it seems more relevant than where I first put it.

The history of the game is the rags to riches dream of any new game developer. In this case starting from nothing, then making a basic working concept medieval fighting game. WarRider.

Then expanding and building an engine with a small development team into a real marketable game. Mount & Blade.

Then they expand just a little more on that rock-solid foundation of tried and true software and expand the features and improve the quality with the standalone expansion. They document the simplicity of modifying the code so that the game’s life is extensible even by amateur developers and modders FAR past its release replayability.

Warband, a beautiful game I spent probably over ten thousand hours playing. I’ve played it more than any other game.

Then they decided to take the next logical step.
They’re not Indie anymore, they’re ready to be the biggest video game development studio in Turkey.

A true sequel successor is what makes sense.
Bannerlord.
What could go wrong?

Well if you’re starting from scratch creatively on a brand new software engine with a large development team and you’ve never done that before...

Anything, everything can absolutely go wrong and if you do not know the way, with something like software development, it is virtually guaranteed to go wrong.

I’ve been absolutely saddened by the state of BannerLord. I’ve sort of moved on.
I’ve also lately been absolutely intrigued by learning about software development as a discipline.

My favourite channel to listen to about this subject is Continuous Delivery.

He posted a video today describing in some detail his understanding of the efficient production of software.



I think what has happened is that much of the early development time was lost. This is really a very ambitious and complex project. They probably had to scrap much of their progress due to an inefficient development cycle. Hence the need for an even now incomplete refactoring of the code.

I don’t think it’s anybody’s fault really. The fact is that the game is too large of a project for certain development strategies.

If the development strategy is not correct from the beginning there is potential for massive amounts of time and work to be wasted.

I get the feeling that this may be what has happened. It’s an honest mistake, I think.

Whether the game’s development can be saved at this point remains to be seen. At this point TW has got to be feeling the heat. I want badly for them to succeed, but the state of the game is improving too slowly. It’s just not fun enough, and it won’t be until some point after the refactoring is satisfactory to TW and the modding community can finally get their teeth into the gameplay side of things.

Your phone writing skills are definitely better than mine!

I think that the reason why many, myself included, are starting to lose their patience, is not just the fact that the game is so far sub par. That can happen. The real issue is that TW is showing no sign of actually wanting to improve the game. Every time one of the main flaws are pointed out by players we either get ignored or they flat out tell us that it is an intended design choice and they will not change it. At this point I have completely lost my faith that they want to fix things, and I was a somewhat outspoken proponent of the "let them work" line of thinking right after release.

 

[SOku]

I’m posting this from my phone, so forgive the readability if it sucks. I’m also moving it to this thread as it seems more relevant than where I first put it.

The history of the game is the rags to riches dream of any new game developer. In this case starting from nothing, then making a basic working concept medieval fighting game. WarRider.

Then expanding and building an engine with a small development team into a real marketable game. Mount & Blade.

Then they expand just a little more on that rock-solid foundation of tried and true software and expand the features and improve the quality with the standalone expansion. They document the simplicity of modifying the code so that the game’s life is extensible even by amateur developers and modders FAR past its release replayability.

Warband, a beautiful game I spent probably over ten thousand hours playing. I’ve played it more than any other game.

Then they decided to take the next logical step.
They’re not Indie anymore, they’re ready to be the biggest video game development studio in Turkey.

A true sequel successor is what makes sense.
Bannerlord.
What could go wrong?

Well if you’re starting from scratch creatively on a brand new software engine with a large development team and you’ve never done that before...

Anything, everything can absolutely go wrong and if you do not know the way, with something like software development, it is virtually guaranteed to go wrong.

I’ve been absolutely saddened by the state of BannerLord. I’ve sort of moved on.
I’ve also lately been absolutely intrigued by learning about software development as a discipline.

My favourite channel to listen to about this subject is Continuous Delivery.

He posted a video today describing in some detail his understanding of the efficient production of software.



I think what has happened is that much of the early development time was lost. This is really a very ambitious and complex project. They probably had to scrap much of their progress due to an inefficient development cycle. Hence the need for an even now incomplete refactoring of the code.

I don’t think it’s anybody’s fault really. The fact is that the game is too large of a project for certain development strategies.

If the development strategy is not correct from the beginning there is potential for massive amounts of time and work to be wasted.

I get the feeling that this may be what has happened. It’s an honest mistake, I think.

Whether the game’s development can be saved at this point remains to be seen. At this point TW has got to be feeling the heat. I want badly for them to succeed, but the state of the game is improving too slowly. It’s just not fun enough, and it won’t be until some point after the refactoring is satisfactory to TW and the modding community can finally get their teeth into the gameplay side of things.

I definitely agree, same goes for @eddiemccandless
That's pretty neat to link Continuous Delivery, I've enjoyed his content a lot wether the subject is linked to my job or not it's still a good source of informations, I didn't listen his last video yet though, I might launch it this week-end

 

[Rungsted93]

Yes the problem is not the slow development nor the current state of the game, but TW's unwillingness to make Bannerlord the absolute best it can be even if that meant another 5 years of development. Instead it appears they just want to wrap things up in a hurry and move on..

 

[danEN]

Seriously... just look at the trending topics on the Steam boards if you want a cheap laugh.

"Please add elephants!" "Armour: useless" "Why is killing a lord so punishing?" "Why can't I change my beard?" "Increase companion limits?" "No lords want to join me"

AND THE FUNNIEST:
"When the game will support workshop?"

Lol TW isn't even supporting modders on the official forums. Steam Workshop support is just delusional.

reddit retards are just as bad

 

[folko1]

Yes the problem is not the slow development nor the current state of the game, but TW's unwillingness to make Bannerlord the absolute best it can be even if that meant another 5 years of development. Instead it appears they just want to wrap things up in a hurry and move on..

I deadass don't understand this smoothbrained and short sighted mentality of companies like... You have a game... With beyond immense potential... And rather than capitalize on the potential and making a quality game that will sell like toilet paper during a pandemic or gas during a gas shortage and people genuinely enjoying the game and recommending it to their friends, and bringing even more potential customers... They just think that the playerbase won't do literally everything in it's power to deter people from getting anywhere near this game...

<snip>

Like is this so difficult to understand? Why do people keep applying short term solutions to long term problems? I'll never understand this. It's like your arm is hurting so you shoot yourself in the foot out of anger to distract yourself from the pain in your arm by creating more pain in the foot, like... why?! Who gives a damn if the game takes another year or two so long as it releases as an actual game and not a 50$ demo. It's gonna be Cyberpunk 2077 all over again.

 

[Lesbosisles]

reddit retards are just as bad

Yet still some of the game defenders call them 'A positive audience', while the forum people are toxic.

 

[folko1]

I’m posting this from my phone, so forgive the readability if it sucks. I’m also moving it to this thread as it seems more relevant than where I first put it.

The history of the game is the rags to riches dream of any new game developer. In this case starting from nothing, then making a basic working concept medieval fighting game. WarRider.

Then expanding and building an engine with a small development team into a real marketable game. Mount & Blade.

Then they expand just a little more on that rock-solid foundation of tried and true software and expand the features and improve the quality with the standalone expansion. They document the simplicity of modifying the code so that the game’s life is extensible even by amateur developers and modders FAR past its release replayability.

Warband, a beautiful game I spent probably over ten thousand hours playing. I’ve played it more than any other game.

Then they decided to take the next logical step.
They’re not Indie anymore, they’re ready to be the biggest video game development studio in Turkey.

A true sequel successor is what makes sense.
Bannerlord.
What could go wrong?

Well if you’re starting from scratch creatively on a brand new software engine with a large development team and you’ve never done that before...

Anything, everything can absolutely go wrong and if you do not know the way, with something like software development, it is virtually guaranteed to go wrong.

I’ve been absolutely saddened by the state of BannerLord. I’ve sort of moved on.
I’ve also lately been absolutely intrigued by learning about software development as a discipline.

My favourite channel to listen to about this subject is Continuous Delivery.

He posted a video today describing in some detail his understanding of the efficient production of software.



I think what has happened is that much of the early development time was lost. This is really a very ambitious and complex project. They probably had to scrap much of their progress due to an inefficient development cycle. Hence the need for an even now incomplete refactoring of the code.

I don’t think it’s anybody’s fault really. The fact is that the game is too large of a project for certain development strategies.

If the development strategy is not correct from the beginning there is potential for massive amounts of time and work to be wasted.

I get the feeling that this may be what has happened. It’s an honest mistake, I think.

Whether the game’s development can be saved at this point remains to be seen. At this point TW has got to be feeling the heat. I want badly for them to succeed, but the state of the game is improving too slowly. It’s just not fun enough, and it won’t be until some point after the refactoring is satisfactory to TW and the modding community can finally get their teeth into the gameplay side of things.

Honestly all we ask is for some transparency at this point. If they're really just having that much hard time with it, they can just outright bloody tell us. I certainly won't witchhunt a company that actually admits it's having difficulties with development and it would make sense as to why so many features were scrapped during development, so long as they actually start developing the rest of the features everyone wanted upon release or sometime before release. I'd be fine if they first developed a game, then refined the basic features, then add some more beef on the bones and add the features the players wanted and just implement them by order of least to most difficult, then release and then update the game with more features that couldn't be added during development, and maybe, just maybe update the players on the developmental progress? I'm starting to think they're basically just trying to stop Sauron, kill Alduin, stop Molag Bal, kill the Ender Dragon and beat Getting Over It all at once.