Bannerlord... A Few Things Lost While Somethings Gained.

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Cenobite

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After waiting sometime for patches i've started too get back into the game, starting my adventure from scratch in a normal standard singleplayer with zero mods just the base game at it's current patched level and i have noted some good & bad things about Bannerlord compared to the older games which i had played extensively over the years from the start of the Mount & Blade days back when the game was fairly basic with no quests or diplomacy, no smithing or crafting, towns were basic, factions were boring and the game was just a bare structure that over the years updates from Taleworlds & mod creators had changed into something special in gaming, as new things had been added to the base game over the years with the different versions i'm glad to see the new game Bannerlord being produced in a new engine with Direct X 11 and up because direct X 9 had it's limits, the game looks great now on high end machines with good 12gb Vram cards and runs smoothly in most cases, but i have noteced some changes that are good like the implementation of crafting, realistic towns & villages, maps are large enough to get lost in compared to the way the game started out years ago with M&B, everything just feels more realistic with current day graphics & coding but the older games with vast player built worlds still have many benefits this game doesn't while the developers have changed the way the skill system works which was the last thing i thought needed changing and i can't say yet for sure if that was a good move or not because i liked the system from the first 2 games M&B and Warband, i see now many skills have been removed or been replaced by selectable abilities along some new skill tree with some fancy graphics which i think was a step backward for the game, a big loss on how the character developed from older games which i enjoyed. The fact you could choose more of your own skill sets from a vast array of skills instead of having a few basic skill trees with dumbed down abilities, i really miss skills like Ironskin where leveling that up gave you extra hitpoints, i do like the fact skills have more abilities as you increase skill level in the new system but i still find it lacks in so many ways compared to the old skill set, seems in the new system i find myself putting Focus points into area's that i'm not using because i'm limited by being maxed out in focus, this new system bothers me as the old system broke everything down too skill and attribute and as you leveled & used the skills you improved them then unlocked skill caps so you could level them higher with better attributes and proficiencies points, now i have this weird Focus Point system in Bannerlord which i'm not sure if i like, mainly because my stats are limited which wasn't the case for the older game, I used to create mods for the older games so i know a bit about the older games mechanics & you could range stuff in config and other settings, skill cap was 999 with 700 character levels tho the skill numbers may not be practical for game purposes after a certain level but all played a roll in battlefield modifiers so really high skill would make you more immune to negative effects of other skill levels that effect your base range of skills, either way you could level old characters the way you wanted is my point and were not limited the way you developed all those skills, I also don't like the new Tier system for Weapons & Armor, while it gives the game more of a MMO system feel i can't say it was even required it just again limits what you can use when it was only attribute requirements for certain things as they improved in quality, you might require 4 agility to ride a certain horse for example, The addition of Tiers makes somethings clearer but the system wasn't really needed it just clarifies things more but also put's harsher limitations on player progression which makes the game less fun.
Some changes to weapons that i don't like, stuff like Throwing Weapons, having a very low stack amount making them pointless to take on the battlefield because stacks starting at 4 is just set way too low for practical purposes, makes them a useless weapon as they are now because the stack is so limited at low levels, if developers nerfed throwing because of Multiplay then that breaks many units danger level, in Singleplayer you can see units that were quite powerful now much weaker because they lack the throwing spears, Sea Raiders for example run out of ammunition quickly after circling them a few times on horseback with a single character where older games they were much more deadlier because they could throw alot more Axe's & Spears, they just have a better shield skill in Bannerlord and lack the ammo to be any real danger on the map, i do not want my character or any hero companion to waste space on a weapon slot that only stacks 4 or little more ammo in space what could be better used by other weapons like Bows or Crossbows. Weapon slots are valued space so having 4 stack throwable items in this game is pointless when facing possibly hundreds of enemies, the developers could at least raise that stack value to 15 as a base value then any additions stack value to make or quality plus perks from skills being at high level.
Also i don't see the Encyclopedia with all the details of every character & town on map with last known location and there is no LOG for history, sometimes that's good to refer too if too much scrolled up in daily news, you might miss a faction going to war so the history log was useful for that kind of stuff i don't see this in Bannerlord.
There are a few other things but these are my main gripes & likes for now.
 
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Cenobite

Recruit
Couldn't be bothered breaking it all down. But go ahead lets troll over how i wrote the thread post instead of talk about stuff that now has limits or is missing from Bannerlord where older versions skills where better as you leveled up.

Limits on Companions now where it wasn't as limited in previous games to have as many in the party you just had to match personalities for the best results.
Low Stack amount for throwing items like spears. I mean it's a game not fun to have low stack limits not going for super realistic can only carry 4 throwing spears.
Bad Companion A.I. Horse archers just spin around and rarely take a shot or draw melee weapons at closer range. N.P.C's using polearms are useless at low levels and without a group just charge into battle lucky to hit once because the A.I is stupid as they get killed by a stack of ground troops because they fail to move away then charge again. Mounted knights are not infantry why is the A.I treating them like that instead of building to good A.I tactics for horsemen using different weapons.

Companions don't change weapons based on battlefield needs. Rarely do they change weapons as needed or have any smart tactics.

Cost of Companion henchmen is a joke considering they spend more time being healed after battles because they are wounded on simple units like looters after you pay good money for equipment to skill them up. You should have a tough party of hero's not a weak band of local peasant scum. If your like me and only have a band of companions for the early stages of the game running round the map doing quests before you start a faction then raise an army then you'll notice how bad the companions are in battles until they are well armored and have good enough skills, even then i find the lacking A.I totally lets all companion henchmen down it's still as dumb as the first game M&B..

Having some kind of Injury factor for critical low hit points, if a character or NPC's hitpoints are reduced to only a few percent then some kind of Injury animation should replace the standard running and walking to slow down the character and reduce speed at critical health levels to show they are wounded badly.

Where are the LADIES, i miss seeing the female looters, older games you could make horseback knights from them when upgrading as troops, Killing only Men seems spiteful, says only MAN is a criminal when the girls get upto more no good in most cases, they just don't get busted so much. I seen plenty of females looting in America on news broadcasts why are they no longer looters in Bannerlord?
 

AxiosXiphos

Sergeant Knight
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
There's too much here to really break down...

But I will say the missing Sword Sister line is a huge shame - especially as it's in the game!

If you check the in-game encyclopaedia; Sword Sisters exist in there - they are just not available from any location to find/capture/hire.
 

black_bulldog

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SVC
Couldn't be bothered breaking it all down. But go ahead lets troll over how i wrote the thread post instead of talk about stuff that now has limits or is missing from Bannerlord where older versions skills where better as you leveled up.
It's not trolling. There's a reason people use periods, commas and paragraphs. If you can't figure it out then that's your problem.
Limits on Companions now where it wasn't as limited in previous games to have as many in the party you just had to match personalities for the best results.
Low Stack amount for throwing items like spears. I mean it's a game not fun to have low stack limits not going for super realistic can only carry 4 throwing spears.
Bad Companion A.I. Horse archers just spin around and rarely take a shot or draw melee weapons at closer range. N.P.C's using polearms are useless at low levels and without a group just charge into battle lucky to hit once because the A.I is stupid as they get killed by a stack of ground troops because they fail to move away then charge again. Mounted knights are not infantry why is the A.I treating them like that instead of building to good A.I tactics for horsemen using different weapons.
While I would like more companions they limit you because only companions and family members can be governors, party leaders, and head up caravans.
Limited spears has always been a thing in M&B. They do a crap ton of damage and if you had a stack of 50 of them you'd be a near unstoppable killing machine and if npcs could have that many they'd be damn near unstoppable killing machines and would be better than almost anyone. Besides carrying around 20+ spears would be unrealistic not only because of the weight but because where the hell would you put them?
Yes HA ai was nerf some time ago because a lot of people *****ed about how op they were so instead of improving other units they just made HA bad. Taleworlds has a knack for going for the easiest solution.
People on these forums have been complaining about how bad pikes are and they have been improved with bracing but it still needs work.
Cavalry is horrible in this game and many people have complained about swing arcs and how hard it is to connect a swing or lance while on horse but at the same time a looter with a stick can easily hit you while you're running at them at 30+ mph.


Companions don't change weapons based on battlefield needs. Rarely do they change weapons as needed or have any smart tactics.
The ai is bad in this game. I suppose this is part of Taleworlds idea that they want a "fast paced" game, because if the ai was smart battles would take much longer.
Cost of Companion henchmen is a joke considering they spend more time being healed after battles because they are wounded on simple units like looters after you pay good money for equipment to skill them up. You should have a tough party of hero's not a weak band of local peasant scum. If your like me and only have a band of companions for the early stages of the game running round the map doing quests before you start a faction then raise an army then you'll notice how bad the companions are in battles until they are well armored and have good enough skills, even then i find the lacking A.I totally lets all companion henchmen down it's still as dumb as the first game M&B..
Ok well if you're not running a full party then that's on you, but afaik companions who are skilled at fighting are not better or worse than regular soldiers. I suspect you just notice more when it's companions because you pay attention to them.
Having some kind of Injury factor for critical low hit points, if a character or NPC's hitpoints are reduced to only a few percent then some kind of Injury animation should replace the standard running and walking to slow down the character and reduce speed at critical health levels to show they are wounded badly.
Holy hell if they had animations when someone takes a critical hit that would completely **** up the flow of battle. This may be a single player game but it's a battle simulator so that kind of thing doesn't belong here. On a side not I always hate that crap and disable it in any game I can just because it's "gamey".
Where are the LADIES, i miss seeing the female looters, older games you could make horseback knights from them when upgrading as troops, Killing only Men seems spiteful, says only MAN is a criminal when the girls get upto more no good in most cases, they just don't get busted so much. I seen plenty of females looting in America on news broadcasts why are they no longer looters in Bannerlord?
So social justice should apply to the middle ages huh,or do you just enjoy beating up women? Whatever your reason there are plenty of mods that add women to the game.
 

Ananda_The_Destroyer

Grandmaster Knight
Companions don't change weapons based on battlefield needs. Rarely do they change weapons as needed or have any smart tactics.
Not with a xbow and 3 stacks of bolts they don't.
Low Stack amount for throwing items like spears.
Yeah it's a bit stingy and removal of seconds stacks for skirmish troops and the nerf to thier accuracy (but not looters lol) has hurt a lot.
Limits on Companions now where it wasn't as limited in previous games to have as many in the party you just had to match personalities for the best results.
You can get 10 or 11 in bannerlord. You could keep about 10 mostly happy ones in warband. I think the poor quality and customization (high level) of wanderers is a problem though. There's a few good ones but low chance they spawn.
Cost of Companion henchmen is a joke considering they spend more time being healed after battles because they are wounded
ngl I shoot them in head at the end of battle if they survive, I need the med skills from healing them
There's too much here to really break down...

But I will say the missing Sword Sister line is a huge shame - especially as it's in the game!

If you check the in-game encyclopaedia; Sword Sisters exist in there - they are just not available from any location to find/capture/hire.
Yeah I want em too! The ones in the files are just SS in name, they a generic infantry troops, not a awesome light cav with max body armor and xbow like warband SS. They're so good! I hope someday we get a mod that adds female peasant and cultural SS, like one for each faction from thier peasants. I would say TW should do it, but I have and they didn't!
Couldn't be bothered breaking it all down.
It's not too late to discover the edit button! My brain stops recognizing what you posted as readable language if it's a block like that and I'm not the only one.
 

Hans 77

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SVC
But go ahead lets troll over how i wrote the thread post instead of talk about stuff

Yes but it's much easier to get others to understand your points when using proper grammatical syntax.
You dropped a straight block of words
1621112683749209.png
and now it's hard for me to discern where one idea ends and another begins.
 

Cenobite

Recruit
There's too much here to really break down...

But I will say the missing Sword Sister line is a huge shame - especially as it's in the game!

If you check the in-game encyclopaedia; Sword Sisters exist in there - they are just not available from any location to find/capture/hire.
Yeah after i noted the key was N Encyclopedia after i checked the key bind settings out in options which i totally forgot about just being so used to M&B, the last games had the encyclopedia in the GUI not just a key accessed directory for that menu system.

Also where is the statistics now in Bannerlord you could see just how many kills you had before, your Renown amount and other statistics, i don't see them in the new menu system.
 

Cenobite

Recruit
Yes but it's much easier to get others to understand your points when using proper grammatical syntax.
You dropped a straight block of words
1621112683749209.png
and now it's hard for me to discern where one idea ends and another begins.
Yeah Sorry about that, i was a bit stoned and just did a full stat page like an old BLOCK style panel on a train back in my graffiti days.
SOmetimes when i'm real wacked i spew a bit of crap about games and forget Grammar because i'm real lazy to bother at that part of the STONE.
 

Cenobite

Recruit
It's not trolling. There's a reason people use periods, commas and paragraphs. If you can't figure it out then that's your problem.

While I would like more companions they limit you because only companions and family members can be governors, party leaders, and head up caravans.
Limited spears has always been a thing in M&B. They do a crap ton of damage and if you had a stack of 50 of them you'd be a near unstoppable killing machine and if npcs could have that many they'd be damn near unstoppable killing machines and would be better than almost anyone. Besides carrying around 20+ spears would be unrealistic not only because of the weight but because where the hell would you put them?
Yes HA ai was nerf some time ago because a lot of people *****ed about how op they were so instead of improving other units they just made HA bad. Taleworlds has a knack for going for the easiest solution.
People on these forums have been complaining about how bad pikes are and they have been improved with bracing but it still needs work.
Cavalry is horrible in this game and many people have complained about swing arcs and how hard it is to connect a swing or lance while on horse but at the same time a looter with a stick can easily hit you while you're running at them at 30+ mph.



The ai is bad in this game. I suppose this is part of Taleworlds idea that they want a "fast paced" game, because if the ai was smart battles would take much longer.

Ok well if you're not running a full party then that's on you, but afaik companions who are skilled at fighting are not better or worse than regular soldiers. I suspect you just notice more when it's companions because you pay attention to them.

Holy hell if they had animations when someone takes a critical hit that would completely **** up the flow of battle. This may be a single player game but it's a battle simulator so that kind of thing doesn't belong here. On a side not I always hate that crap and disable it in any game I can just because it's "gamey".

So social justice should apply to the middle ages huh,or do you just enjoy beating up women? Whatever your reason there are plenty of mods that add women to the game.
The wounded animations would only be for very low hitpoints remaining on unit like 5 or 10 hit points left, units could stagger drag a leg or hold a chest wound, maybe it has other effects like if the arm is critical you lose the loss of that arm for that battle, so in game terms the same arm has taken majority of the damage hence it's near cut off or broken to the point it's not usable because your on like 6 hit points left and that's the primary area you've taken damage.
A system where animations would be tied to wounds inflicted in the same area of the body, for 80 or 90 percent of damage taken to that area you could then trigger in and animation with some negatives. I think it would be more realistic rather then units just continuing to run with some blood spatter on clothes and face.
Since you can be targeted in different areas of the body when using BOWS or other missile weapons i often hit shield carriers in the legs or feet as it's too hard to get head shots on more advanced units due to high block ability and shield size, i would like to see some effect taken to badly wounded legs & feet.
 

Brano

Regular
I always dreamed about putting a limping looter out of his misery by some cruel coup de grace. Like in Kingdom Come: Deliverance. Yeah, Im a sadist ??‍♂️?
 

black_bulldog

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SVC
The wounded animations would only be for very low hitpoints remaining on unit like 5 or 10 hit points left, units could stagger drag a leg or hold a chest wound, maybe it has other effects like if the arm is critical you lose the loss of that arm for that battle, so in game terms the same arm has taken majority of the damage hence it's near cut off or broken to the point it's not usable because your on like 6 hit points left and that's the primary area you've taken damage.
A system where animations would be tied to wounds inflicted in the same area of the body, for 80 or 90 percent of damage taken to that area you could then trigger in and animation with some negatives. I think it would be more realistic rather then units just continuing to run with some blood spatter on clothes and face.
Since you can be targeted in different areas of the body when using BOWS or other missile weapons i often hit shield carriers in the legs or feet as it's too hard to get head shots on more advanced units due to high block ability and shield size, i would like to see some effect taken to badly wounded legs & feet.
That's all fine and good, but think about a 2000v2000 battle, if that happes 100's of times that's going to require more cpu resources and this game is already a system hog as is.
 

Cenobite

Recruit
That's all fine and good, but think about a 2000v2000 battle, if that happes 100's of times that's going to require more cpu resources and this game is already a system hog as is.
Well i have the system resources since i built a new pc, this one has a full 256GB ram on mainboard with an i9 Xcore extreme 4.5GHZ each core when turbos, that's ten physical cores with 20 logical so processing power is all good, then when it comes down to video cards i have a Nvidia 2080TI which has 12GB DDR6 Vram for graphics, it's all liquid cooled on SSD super fast HD's, Resources for me shouldn't be an issue, unless i'm developing using editors and high end polygon mesh's which cost a bomb performance.
Sometimes it comes down to how some editors use resources and if those resources have been built specifically for that editor with reduced poly counts but high detail, moving models from editor to editor then converting items then resetting bones of any skeletal mesh to fit any animation sequences the game may be using is costly in some cases. so what i mean is certain types of bodies for example from other editors need calibration to use in say the game editor that comes with Bannerlord or any other game and the editor it's using...

Games i have zero issue running on this super high end system because most games are built for 8GB video cards with16GB or 32GB systems, i have more issues with rendering picture like scenes using light then performance issues. Using the right light in editors makes all the difference in performance but certain meshes have a huge impact on resources a game uses, something like grass & trees for example the high resolution textures & poly count on the mesh will drag down system performance no matter how powerful the system is because it's drawing a massive amount of polys in the scene and slower computers will feel the crunch and probably crash.

The developers of this game need to use the editors light better and light up interiors because as it is seems there are no spot lights being used and it's super dark in some areas, sometimes i use things like spot lights to increase other lights in the scene like flames when they don't produce enough illumination by themselves if placed right they just enhance the area light. Models that use furniture for example should have a spot light in that area, throne rooms for example NPC's are sitting in the dark because candle lights produce little light in that scene.

Use some spot lights and color them to the same flame tone to increase the area light given off torches or candles.
 

black_bulldog

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SVC
Well i have the system resources since i built a new pc, this one has a full 256GB ram on mainboard with an i9 Xcore extreme 4.5GHZ each core when turbos, that's ten physical cores with 20 logical so processing power is all good, then when it comes down to video cards i have a Nvidia 2080TI which has 12GB DDR6 Vram for graphics, it's all liquid cooled on SSD super fast HD's, Resources for me shouldn't be an issue, unless i'm developing using editors and high end polygon mesh's which cost a bomb performance.
Sometimes it comes down to how some editors use resources and if those resources have been built specifically for that editor with reduced poly counts but high detail, moving models from editor to editor then converting items then resetting bones of any skeletal mesh to fit any animation sequences the game may be using is costly in some cases. so what i mean is certain types of bodies for example from other editors need calibration to use in say the game editor that comes with Bannerlord or any other game and the editor it's using...

Games i have zero issue running on this super high end system because most games are built for 8GB video cards with16GB or 32GB systems, i have more issues with rendering picture like scenes using light then performance issues. Using the right light in editors makes all the difference in performance but certain meshes have a huge impact on resources a game uses, something like grass & trees for example the high resolution textures & poly count on the mesh will drag down system performance no matter how powerful the system is because it's drawing a massive amount of polys in the scene and slower computers will feel the crunch and probably crash.

The developers of this game need to use the editors light better and light up interiors because as it is seems there are no spot lights being used and it's super dark in some areas, sometimes i use things like spot lights to increase other lights in the scene like flames when they don't produce enough illumination by themselves if placed right they just enhance the area light. Models that use furniture for example should have a spot light in that area, throne rooms for example NPC's are sitting in the dark because candle lights produce little light in that scene.

Use some spot lights and color them to the same flame tone to increase the area light given off torches or candles.
Not everyone has a system like yours and Taleworlds is going to build a game designed for low to mid range computers and consoles not top end machines.
 

Lord Grindelvald

Sergeant at Arms
WB
Not everyone has a system like yours and Taleworlds is going to build a game designed for low to mid range computers and consoles not top end machines.
Which makes sense if you look at where Warband came from. The game looked like it could run on the LCD screen of my printer.

Warbands low graphics ask was one of the reasons I played it so much, I always had pisspoor laptops in college so I was limited to playing Warband, CS 1.6 or CS:Source (on small fy_ maps with 10fps, bigger ones would crash my game).

Warband was a niche within a niche. It had unique gameplay and looked like ass. Which I believe is one of the reasons it is still so well received and often played.
 

black_bulldog

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SVC
Which makes sense if you look at where Warband came from. The game looked like it could run on the LCD screen of my printer.

Warbands low graphics ask was one of the reasons I played it so much, I always had pisspoor laptops in college so I was limited to playing Warband, CS 1.6 or CS:Source (on small fy_ maps with 10fps, bigger ones would crash my game).

Warband was a niche within a niche. It had unique gameplay and looked like ass. Which I believe is one of the reasons it is still so well received and often played.
Warband coming to a refrigerator near you. :iamamoron:
 

Hans 77

Knight at Arms
WBWF&SVC
Which makes sense if you look at where Warband came from. The game looked like it could run on the LCD screen of my printer.

Warbands low graphics ask was one of the reasons I played it so much, I always had pisspoor laptops in college so I was limited to playing Warband, CS 1.6 or CS:Source (on small fy_ maps with 10fps, bigger ones would crash my game).

Warband was a niche within a niche. It had unique gameplay and looked like ass. Which I believe is one of the reasons it is still so well received and often played.

I can relate. Warband came out right before my first year at university. I had a very cheap laptop and Warband was literally the only game I had that it could run ?. No regrets though, Warband became my favorite game of all time and I'm still playing it to this day.
 

Brano

Regular
I remember those times in 2010-11 when I used to launch warband from the usb stick to bypass administrator restrictions on my company laptop. Favourite free time activity at hotel during long business trips when I was fed up with drinking and parties ??
 

Cenobite

Recruit
Warband coming to a refrigerator near you. :iamamoron:
Warband how about the first Mount & Blade, before Warband... It had zero multiplayer, zero quests, no diplomacy, no Siege stuff well not any good things that worked
Animations were poor but still good for it's time.
Mesh's & generation models were old... if you notice with the newer models & outfits they look more realistic because they are a more advanced mesh with better dynamics when used correctly, Another issue i noticed in Bannerlord was the cape needs fixing while weapons are on character, it clips through the back, can be fixed in editor in with cloth simulations and animation sequencing.

Once the first game M&B was modified by the community the game become something else, i created a few mods back then around 12 or so years back, things like diplomacy & expanded cities, towns and villages were all add in's by the community over years, even my favorite M&B mod The Wedding Dance had so much of it's idea's implemented into the fabric of what is now the base vanilla game of Bannerlord.

So most of what Bannerlord is comes from the mod making community and it's most popular mods, The old website the M&Brepository which still runs and has old files still has my old mods there and alot of basic editing programs for opening BRF files and other assets for modification or changing values for troops or new weapon models or other meshes one might add into the game then associate to a category like sword or armor then add it into a number of items the game will register in config.ini. The old M&B was fun to mod.

M&B was one of my first games on Steam 12 years ago. Bannerlord is by far the better game now that the game has been patched a fair bit things work better but i find the new tournament system is way to easy now even tho it's better to run through you can now watch others fight and gain items from wins, i gain less cash from them due to my character having low rouge skill and parties don't seem to share skill like they used too in older games, so if your running around with a party of companions only the old game would combine all skills to benefit the party.

NPC with the highest skill in party tended to be recognized which doesn't seem to be the case in Bannerlord unless you give them a position which is limited by a few choices like Quarter Master or Surgeon.
 
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