Aurora Cannon? Lion Throne?

[Zhaker]

Just a question about this weapon that Lion Throne that has access too it apparently.

1. I thought Lion Throne has a disdain for Firearm type weapons, a codex report on the Imperial State said that they hated them because of their use of Firearms and their belief of Filaharn (I think).

2. The brigadier troops are all melee oriented, the range are all auxiliary units, unless I am mistaken this signify that they prefer to use their troops as a battering ram rather than a long range siege.

3. This aurora cannon is so awesome its at Lerna? What? That would mean that since it was created at 1500 it was created when the Emperor that got burned alive was around was right?

4. Why hasn't Imperial State, Halmaer Union or even the Ormelli Empire do something similar (even a smaller scope), is it to do with Resources here?

 

[FuryFire]

Resident codex nut here.

1. Brigadiers hate them in the small arms scale, That doesn't mean they don't use ARTILLERY. Yes cannons, bombards, ornate basilisks. The grand cities of the LT have massive walls consisting of catapult and cannon towers all the same. From the batteries of the GP to the blessed basilisks and bombards from the Lion Throne itself.

2. They are not stupid. Think of it as the roman legion. The majority of Lion Throne citizens join the brigade as these rank and file swordsmen. They have range troops, do not be mistaken, but they are not quite fond of it. During the calradian expedition, the LT have found khara-khitans and gunther and piedmontese soldiers as better range units. Thus they instead draw from them.  Brigadiers know that they are heavy infantry and its commanders understand that to be effective and to avoid its weaknesses it needs dedicated range troops and know how to stay put while the walls are being brought down. You can't destroy a wall with swords or brigadier head bashing, no matter how armored their helmets are.

3. The time is wrong. I think that time in MnB is eternally set at 1500 and no one has bothered to change it. The Aurora cannon came after the events before Nikephoros burning. The Ellisian Emperor was burned at the stakes prior to the Chapter II. Chapter III where the Halmarians and Grand Duchy entered the fray, the construction of the Aurora cannon began. And in Chapter 4 it's supposed to be built on the hills outside of the city of Lerna.

Time is a trouble here as no one really made a proper timeline. Toon Knight created one, but it's has some flaws and it focuses on the Ellisian Empire. The best way to look at it is through its chapters.

4. Yup, it's the resources. If you do manage to dig up the map from under the forums you will see that the LT swamps the size of Calradia. Frankly, no one has actually ever thought up of creating a massive cannon whose range can reach vast distances. Maybe someone from Calradia has considered it, but dismissed it because of resources or the plausibility. They may have the things needed to create a cannon like that but its not enough. The LT was the first to do it, and while the spy agencies of the Calradian nations might have picked it up, they might have focused more on how to sabotage or destroy or survive the thing rather than build a smaller replica. The Pope was actually looking for a single weapon that could epitomise Filaharn's wrath. That could inspire the awesome might of the Throne, and strike fear into the hearts of its enemies. That's what an empire does when they have large resources. Just look at the Empire of Star Wars and their Death Star.

 

[Zhaker]

1. So do IS, Halmaer Union and Ormelli forces have these catapults and cannons as well? I'd find it hard to believe that just 'Lion Throne' alone would have everything here.  Just because they got a big land doesn't mean technology wise they would be only ones to field these sorts of things.

2. I didnt say that they dont have their own range units, but on this subject, why cant we select them for starters? and also if they really hate these small arms scale, why didnt they completely terminate the Gunther-Piedmont? Or will the same happen similarly if they take over Imperial State for just subjecation? Arent the Gunther-Piedmont primarily range, or did they have melee troops too? I could be missing some information about GUnther-Piedmont but from what I gather they seem to be primarily a firearm race similar to the Imperial State.

3. I thought Chapter 2 was commence making the cannon at gunther-piedmont, Chapter 3 was to build it at final stages at Lerna, and then finally use it on Chapter 4. What I like to know is how this would affect the game play, being able to wield a cannon like this and use it anywhere on the map sounds excessive :\.
Ok from reading the Timeline thread that makes a little more sense now.

4. The Imperials considered that all other races inferior, why they don't have other races work for them, except bounty hunters I believe.

 

[FuryFire]

1. Actually Zhak, there is no artillery in game. But if we place it in any other RTS game or in a lore or fan fic, we assume that there are artillery. They all have artillery. Its not a matter of them having it exclusively, its a matter of the LT being able to make a monster version of it.

2. What do you mean select for starters? That you must recruit them from the city and not from the towns(villages)? 

Hmm, maybe I misused the word "hate"  I think it would be better off as "disdain".  Performing genocide with the cause beinrg they use weapons that could negate your strengths is not the best of courses. In the case of the Gunther-Piedmont, these cities states are actually protectorates of the Lion Throne. They took up Filaharnism and thus Pope Saldain gave them protection. During the Calradian Crusade, the Lion Throne has called forth a recruitment order to all its protectorates and subjugated territories near Calradia, this included the city states of Gunther and Piedmont.

There is no official lore of the GP. But in my opinion, they are all musket armed troops. The IS actually copied the army style of GP. But while the GP emphasizes on warrior troopers, the IS further enhanced their version with soldiery and drill. GP troopers have loathed and respected their IS counter parts during the first Calradian Expedition.

3. There is no artillery in game. But lore wise, C4 is supposed to start with the loss of the HSE capital Vienna. How? After the previous 2 sieges have bloodied the LT invaders? With the Aurora Cannon. If you feel like reading lore check out the beginnings of the siege on the canon fan fic: "Fall of Vienna"  It's not over yet, since I pretty much got lazy and lost inspiration, but the ending of it is: Calradia will have its first taste of the might of the Aurora cannon with the destruction of Vienna. Discussions with the other lore masters have decided that the Aurora cannon will just be a tourist attraction after this. Maybe there's malfunction after its bombing of Vienna? Maybe it got sabotaged? Maybe the cost of maintaining and supplying the massive boulder like shot of it is better off spent on equipment and training?

If it does get included in game, I'm pretty sure the player won't get control of it. Its supposed to be used only when besieging cities. And only at the command of the First Deva itself. So I think it's just to advance a plot. But maybe... if the First Deva is besieging a city, prior to the attack, there is a chance that a wall section will be completely destroyed and battle will happen at the streets or a portion of the defenders would be decimated.

4. The Imperials have that policy, err it's actually Darth Sidious's policy of no aliens in its forces or administration, very anti-xenos.
The LT are not racists, nor aryanists. They are (insert term for infidel haters here, I forgot the term).  They would actually accept fellow converts, but for those who do not worship Filaharn they see as infidels and heretics. Filaharnism is not about being one God, its about This God being higher than others. And Filaharnists set out to make it so.

 

[Zhaker]

1. Oh ok, hrmm sounds like something that needs to be added .

2. I meant why cant we get Brigidier Range units, so far its just calvary and heavy infantry. And again I remember a codec that said that from a Recommendation that Imperial State be utterly be destroyed by the Lion Throne, Imperial State I believe DO believe in Filaharn, I just dont think they believe it like Lion Throne as zealotlously.

3. I see, I like to see it'd be useable for one chapter at least .

4. I didnt say 'hate' here either . I meant 'inferior' meaning that if the Empire wanted, they prefer not to have it. Just like female Imperials do not get high rank ( exception is Admiral Daala ), because of 'inferiority'.

5. NEW QUESTION: Holy Swadian Empire, dont they believe in Filaharn, or something else?

 

[Venitius]

1. Nope, it'll be too complicated and artillery is more for RTS unless we get off-map arty.

2. Only the Lion Throne believes in Filaharn. (Hence why we use "Filaharnist" instead of "Lion Thronist" or whatever) And the Brigade is melee based and I presume the Filaharnist scum believe that the sword is the way of converting the heathen. The gun and the bow is just to aid the blessed and most devoted followers of Filaharn.

3. Probably crash a few computers what with the damage blast and smoke and stuff.

4. The IS just doesn't care about any other factions/races, really. Just themselves.

5. See 2. Most of the Calradian states believe in a form of the Calradic Church which is also monotheistic but less.. radical. Haelmar & the IS are secular anyway.

 

[Sir Gawain]

A Swadian Reformation might be an interesting counter to the Filiharnist Crusade no?  That could be the sudden twist Hengest rides over ol' Siggy to the top on.  Just an idea.

 

[Bunduqdari]

Well we have a Swadian inquisition that burns heretics. You never know when they knock on the door.
But adding a reformation would be the straw that broke the camel's back. Swadia is in such a sorry state atm, that I don't think they can handle much more. Not everyone would follow the supposed reformation of Hengest, so we would have split the HSE,which is a big no-no. But also important: lads here have grown quite fond of Sigismund, the poor guy has been in the mod since the mod's stone age. There is something exciting about the fact that one so crazy can hold the throne for so long, that compels me also to keep him on it.

 

[Sir Gawain]

Well good then!

Now back to the Aurora, giant cannon, destroys a city and an army and then...?

 

[Bunduqdari]

Semi-destroys Vienna, after which the remains of the city serve as a castle you mean? In who's hands it will fall is not yet clear. Depends on final expanded map of C4.

After this event. the humongous Aurora Cannon needs repairs and is simply too heavy to be carried to a different location within the lifespan of a normal person. Imagine the radius of its bore being at least the height of a person. t' weighs more tons than you can count.
NOT easy to  move around. If they would wish to reuse it to besiege another city, let's say Marienburg, they need to move it down the hills of Laria and to a similar elevation somewhere near the mountains north-west of Vienna to be able to reach  Marienburg. I'd say it would take at least 40 years, 10.000 people working on it, and continuous supply  of slaves and horses for pulling(they all die eventually)

Not worth it, so I expect it to be left near the hills of Lerna as a monument and for myth-making purposes for Filaharnists, so later popes can claim Filaharn sent it from the sky or something.

 

[Venitius]

I think Swadia might notice that occuring.

And you forgot the elephants to lug around the shells.

 

[Untitled.]

Q: Wouldn't a mortar that size break after the shot? I mean, it's new technology, they don't know what **** could go wrong, right?

 

[Venitius]

D'Sparil's explanation was that it was designed by the best and most experienced gunsmiths and metallurgists in Calradia, Filaharnist or captured. And its first test is during the year-long? Siege of Vienna and it's only used once.

 

[FuryFire]

Semi-destroys Vienna, after which the remains of the city serve as a castle you mean? In who's hands it will fall is not yet clear. Depends on final expanded map of C4.

After this event. the humongous Aurora Cannon needs repairs and is simply too heavy to be carried to a different location within the lifespan of a normal person. Imagine the radius of its bore being at least the height of a person. t' weighs more tons than you can count.
NOT easy to  move around. If they would wish to reuse it to besiege another city, let's say Marienburg, they need to move it down the hills of Laria and to a similar elevation somewhere near the mountains north-west of Vienna to be able to reach  Marienburg. I'd say it would take at least 40 years, 10.000 people working on it, and continuous supply  of slaves and horses for pulling(they all die eventually)

Not worth it, so I expect it to be left near the hills of Lerna as a monument and for myth-making purposes for Filaharnists, so later popes can claim Filaharn sent it from the sky or something.

The aurora cannon could actually be swiveled and it could reach as far as Nibelheim at its position at Lerna. The problem that "will" occur why it "will" be only fired at one siege is still being disputed. Since I'm pretty much stalled at writing The Fall of Vienna I'll spoiler here what I have planned to write: (read at your own risk, it's pretty much for Venitius and Bunduqdari)

Spoiler

As winter approaches, Mondo could not risk a protracted siege. The second wall proved more stubborn than the first wall. And the Swadians have collapsed and set fire on the buildings surrounding the inner city wall, creating an effective killing field. He has also received reports that the Swadian Grand Marshall is marching with his victorious army from Nibelheim along with reinfocements from Ulm and Zollern, just half a week away. The City must be taken. Thus he urged his engineers to fire the Aurora once more, just a day after it fired.

Now the aurora was supposed to cool down its massive barrel for at least five days in order to fire properly. Mondo rushed it. The cannon fired and struck a direct hit on a city gatehouse on the third day after it initiated the siege. The consequence being that cracks appeared around the hull of the Aurora, the master engineer deemed it unable to fire until repaired... Which requires its barrel to be replaced and filling in the cracks is too risky.. Thus the Aurora has turned into a derelict relic... Only the high command know why it's not being used anymore.

 

[Zhaker]

1. Nope, it'll be too complicated and artillery is more for RTS unless we get off-map arty.

2. Only the Lion Throne believes in Filaharn. (Hence why we use "Filaharnist" instead of "Lion Thronist" or whatever) And the Brigade is melee based and I presume the Filaharnist scum believe that the sword is the way of converting the heathen. The gun and the bow is just to aid the blessed and most devoted followers of Filaharn.

3. Probably crash a few computers what with the damage blast and smoke and stuff.

4. The IS just doesn't care about any other factions/races, really. Just themselves.

5. See 2. Most of the Calradian states believe in a form of the Calradic Church which is also monotheistic but less.. radical. Haelmar & the IS are secular anyway.

1. I'd figure that when you automatically calculate the autofight you can use the cannon strength like +10000 or something, but can only be used every 30 days if not more. I'd think if you get that you prolly kill about half if not 2/3 of a 1000 troops fortifying it.

2 and 5. Really? Cause I had to pledge to Filaharn when I was Rebel IS, and also I believe that I had to pledge to Filaharn, to Kaizer and to glory of the Imperial State for Wilhem, maybe its just a false pretense but I was unsure of this. Also isnt Filaharn 'god'? Or am I viewing this incorrectly?

3. Awww, would be fun to use Halmaer Union, capture it, swing it to everyone else and win :p. I want my I win button plz.

4. I thought most if not all factions in the game dont care about each other, just want to conquer them and place their culture as their own. Halmaer Union sorta does, and Grand Duchy, but the former's prince is using aggressive tactics to bring in the union thats not in line with the queen, and the Grand Duchy is using the Nirdamese as the reason to conquer Calradia.

 

[FuryFire]

5. The only real expansionists out there are the LT, Lauria, and HU
To some extent, the Vaegirs and GD too.

The HSE is on the defensive beset on all sides from the LT, Lauria, occasional Ormeli and Vaegirs and even brigands and other factions that roam their land (e.i. Bohemians).

The Ormeli is new and expansion isn't their first thing in mind. Their main problem are the newly risen Khergits from the south and the occasional border wars with the Vaegirs and the HSE.

HU and Lauria are just land hungry, not really wanting to enforce their culture, but to gain land and of course profit. Maybe HU wants to spread their cheesy cult but not in a fanatical sense.

The IS wish to share their new goverment type, proclaiming it as superior. But expansion isn't in their original list either. They are the ones being attacked by a sore HSE. They also have to fend off the Laurians who conquered Tihr from them (which, while not originally an IS land, the Kaiser feels that he has heredity over it). Also they want in on the profitable sea lanes of the Obello, thus they wage naval wars with Lauria and HU.

The Vaegirs, have that old hatred with the Swadians and Ormeli, and occasional border skirmishes happen. But they are more focused on holding back the tide of the Laurians and HU and trying to fend off the new players: GD.

The GD, more precisely Prince Istvaan wants to prove himself of his rise to the throne be doing something worthy: which is conquering some land. With the atrocities of the non-vaegir genocide during the last days of the Dual Monarchy, the prince found a just cause and thus proceeded with waging war and punishing the Tsar Feodor.

The only one that really wants to conquer and enforce their belief unto others is the Lion Throne.


However, the inherent instinct of conquering Calradia might still be ingrained on the deepest subconscious of every Calradian noble. Calradia has always been in eternal war, what else would they want to do?

 

[Venitius]

2. The "God, Volk und Kaiser" refers to the God of the Calradian Church. The Filaharnists probably think calling Filaharn "God" is blasphemy or something.

@ FuryFire: Good stuff.

 

[Sir Gawain]

Are not the Swadians and Kaiserlichers on slightly less hostile terms?  From what I've seen, there hasn't been any actual fighting between Citerior and Ulterior since the schism, and I think there have been correspondences between individuals within both parties discussing financial and armament matters in the lore.  Maybe more like a cold war of sorts?

 

[Venitius]

Well those correspondences aren't really official (despite them coming from important Swadians) and they're a last attempt by the clearer-minded Swadians who aren't bonkers or incredibly arrogant, to get a hand in this losing war. I would have expected a truce would have been arranged by 1503 by Hengest (or someone) with the IS though.

 

[Bunduqdari]

The aurora cannon could actually be swiveled and it could reach as far as Nibelheim at its position at Lerna. The problem that "will" occur why it "will" be only fired at one siege is still being disputed. Since I'm pretty much stalled at writing The Fall of Vienna I'll spoiler here what I have planned to write: (read at your own risk, it's pretty much for Venitius and Bunduqdari)

I'd say it's a tad too enthusiastic to think its cannonballs would reach Nibelheim. The kazillion-ton balls would have to fly OVER the mountains as if they had wings.

Spoiler

As winter approaches, Mondo could not risk a protracted siege. The second wall proved more stubborn than the first wall. And the Swadians have collapsed and set fire on the buildings surrounding the inner city wall, creating an effective killing field. He has also received reports that the Swadian Grand Marshall is marching with his victorious army from Nibelheim along with reinfocements from Ulm and Zollern, just half a week away. The City must be taken. Thus he urged his engineers to fire the Aurora once more, just a day after it fired.

Now the aurora was supposed to cool down its massive barrel for at least five days in order to fire properly. Mondo rushed it. The cannon fired and struck a direct hit on a city gatehouse on the third day after it initiated the siege. The consequence being that cracks appeared around the hull of the Aurora, the master engineer deemed it unable to fire until repaired... Which requires its barrel to be replaced and filling in the cracks is too risky.. Thus the Aurora has turned into a derelict relic... Only the high command know why it's not being used anymore.

contents of the spoiler:  approved imho