Armour is stupid expensive, why does a tough dress costs 1/6 the price of a city??

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cadadr

Recruit
Armour in this game, both horse armour and normal armour, is way too pricy. Similarly weapons, like a menavlion or romphalia is a knife on a stick.

This makes for a very boring game, you either get armour from cheats or play for years as a faction leader with armour inferior to 4th tier soldiers under their rule.
 

Antaeus

Sergeant at Arms
I think armour/weapons are priced based on their impact on the game, rather than the actual value to make, or it's demand.

Therefore glaives, romphalias and menavlions are expensive, because they are the most deadly weapons in the game - they instantly make the player a death machine. To price them too low makes the game too easy from the outset.

Same is true (although controversial) with regard to high tier armour.

You can save yourself the bother and pay a 5k bride/husband price and get them as dowry.
 

anoddhermit

Sergeant
I think armour/weapons are priced based on their impact on the game, rather than the actual value to make, or it's demand.

Therefore glaives, romphalias and menavlions are expensive, because they are the most deadly weapons in the game - they instantly make the player a death machine. To price them too low makes the game too easy from the outset.

Same is true (although controversial) with regard to high tier armour.

You can save yourself the bother and pay a 5k bride/husband price and get them as dowry.

But we have smithing and can make even more deadly ones practically free.

I'm not sure we can infer with much certainty what they have in mind with economy balance yet...
 

Antaeus

Sergeant at Arms
But we have smithing and can make even more deadly ones practically free.

I'm not sure we can infer with much certainty what they have in mind with economy balance yet...

Glaives cost less than 1000 to buy 2 updates ago, and have since been rebalanced to what seems more appropriate given their damage. The update to their price only recently occurred, so I think any further changes to the value of weapons will be similarly inspired by how they are used, rather than the forces of supply and demand.

You're right about smithing, but I believe smithing as it currently exists, is also on the chopping block.
 

Nogand

Recruit
Armour in this game, both horse armour and normal armour, is way too pricy. Similarly weapons, like a menavlion or romphalia is a knife on a stick.

This makes for a very boring game, you either get armour from cheats or play for years as a faction leader with armour inferior to 4th tier soldiers under their rule.
I think armour/weapons are priced based on their impact on the game, rather than the actual value to make, or it's demand.

Therefore glaives, romphalias and menavlions are expensive, because they are the most deadly weapons in the game - they instantly make the player a death machine. To price them too low makes the game too easy from the outset.

Same is true (although controversial) with regard to high tier armour.

You can save yourself the bother and pay a 5k bride/husband price and get them as dowry.
IMO this is a symptom of this game trying to be an RPG and a grand strategy game at the same time. You get weird **** like armour worn by your T5 troops being an endgame goal for the player character, almost as grindy to acquire as getting BiS gear in vanilla WoW. I play with Levelling Rebalance Plus to smooth this out a bit, but that's because I play paradox games so my idea of progression is acquiring better fiefs and painting the map my colour. But my character has the same armour from the first quarter of the game onwards which would be monotonous for the more RPG focused.

There should be more lord/player exclusive gear that is stupidly expensive and OP, and make the gear worn by standard troops less than 10k. So there's still something to work towards that's visible on the character without it being too immersion-breaking. Or lean into the strategy aspect more fully and have all the endgame gold sinks be on things like espionage, diplomacy, hiring tutors for your heirs, training troops &c.
 
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Antaeus

Sergeant at Arms
There should be more lord/player exclusive gear that is stupidly expensive and OP, and make the gear worn by standard troops less than 10k.

I do agree with this point. I find that I am in my finished state as a character, before I even take my first fief.

The new crowns and noble helmets are a good start in this direction, as are the gifts you get on joining a faction. But they're distinctly mid-tier at the moment. It would be nice to see a couple of levels of player only gear to allow for upgrades past what we have now.
 

Ananda_The_Destroyer

Master Knight
Therefore glaives, romphalias and menavlions are expensive, because they are the most deadly weapons in the game - they instantly make the player a death machine. To price them too low makes the game too easy from the outset.
Glaives cost less than 1000 to buy 2 updates ago, and have since been rebalanced to what seems more appropriate given their damage. The update to their price only recently occurred, so I think any further changes to the value of weapons will be similarly inspired by how they are used, rather than the forces of supply and demand.

You're right about smithing, but I believe smithing as it currently exists, is also on the chopping block.
That may be true, they may have adjusted it for it's power but what's also true is in older version the price only looked at the 1 handed power of the glaives, which is modest, ignoring the much more powerful 2 handed swing damage. By contrast the rhompai which had no 1 handed option, was calculated by it's 2 handed swing and was always expensive, so much so it couldn't spawn in stores in most older versions. SO, I think unless a Dev can attest otherwise, it's a little too much credit to think they made them expensive for balance as I'm pretty sure it's just removal of a oversight in how they were valued.
 
It is obvious that the economy of the game is not based on economic laws, which in turn are linked to compliance with physical laws.
Someone has set some arbitrary constant or function as a coefficient to make sure that depending on the impact that the equipment has on the game it has a higher cost.

I had proposed a solution that made prices "normal", that changed the loot system (hideous and unrealistic), that gave greater importance to skill smithing through its use in relation to "maintaining the equipment" and that introduced different mechanics that would have been useful to outline a gameplay that took logistics into consideration.

I insert the link related to these threads, if you are interested read it and support it.

ECONOMY , LOGISTICS and WARFARE SUGGESTION LIST
 
I'd rather troops and kingdom management to be the expensive 'endgame' thing. Fielding that massive mob of Fian Champs should be what drains you, not trying to dress like one.
 

eddiemccandless

Knight at Arms
WBNWVC
Same is true (although controversial) with regard to high tier armour.
This doesn't seem very controversial to me. Armor just does not have enough of an impact to justify its cost, so what you say might be true (to a point) for weapons, but it is just plainly false for armors.

The price of equipment is bad game design. You seem to be trying really hard to defend it, and I don't really understand why.
 

Ser Jon

Squire
M&BWBWF&SNWVC
Almost everything about the game's economy and market system needs serious reworking. Making attire cost a cut of the cost of a city, or about the same as an expensive piece of weaponry, is ridiculous. It doesn't make the game challenging, it just makes it annoying as hell.
 

cadadr

Recruit
SO, I think unless a Dev can attest otherwise, it's a little too much credit to think they made them expensive for balance as I'm pretty sure it's just removal of a oversight in how they were valued.
That's my guess as well. I spent a lot of time with smithing playthrus and I doubt much of the underlying mechanism changed.

I'd rather troops and kingdom management to be the expensive 'endgame' thing. Fielding that massive mob of Fian Champs should be what drains you, not trying to dress like one.
++++++

The price of equipment is bad game design. You seem to be trying really hard to defend it, and I don't really understand why.
Gotta agree.

I thing difficulty itself is good enough to limit a magical OP player killing everyone gameplay. Logically a menavlion or a big ass hammer are cheap stuff that's also very deadly.

To me, what seems to me is that TW is compensating for simplistic AI of troops. Even at top difficulty and combat AI settings, AI troops do not have any form of self preservation. E.g., they do not really use their shields much, they do not have any dynamics of staying out of danger, or teamwork.

If AI had the ability to stay away from danger, and do just a wee bit more sopisticated attacks, romphalias or two handed swords would not be as effective. As it is, I can do a solo massacre even at Bannerlord difficulty, exploiting very predictable movements of AI troops which always tend to put them in disadvantage, and I tend to suck at precise combat in games in general, so no doubt to more precise players among you even Bannerlord feels like Freebooter...
 
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