Armenian Genocide (?)
- 主题发起人 Janissary1453
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RecursiveHarmony
I interpret this as "you change people's quotes under some circumstances".
His way is this exactly.
This makes you look like you said those words precisely. That's why i think that's against rules.
I wonder why. You posted some pretty controversial posts defending the legality of genociding people and saying some parts of the armenian genocide aren't true. I don't believe you when you say you're surprised people are confronting you on that. Btw, judging by the history of this thread, you got away with it pretty much scott free. Mostly because those with the hard bites have yet to manifest themselves.
Not according to the 6 dictionaries I went through.
The wiktionary article even comes with a usage note which doesn't mention anything about punishment or moral judgment.
Definition of GENOCIDE
the deliberate and systematic destruction of a racial, political, or cultural group… See the full definition
www.merriam-webster.com
genocide
Definition, Synonyms, Translations of genocide by The Free Dictionary
www.thefreedictionary.com
Genocide Definition & Meaning | Dictionary.com
Genocide definition, the deliberate and systematic extermination of a national, racial, political, or cultural group. See more.
www.dictionary.com
genocide
1. the crime of intentionally destroying part or all of a national, ethnic…
dictionary.cambridge.org
In this thread, people against the notion of the armenian genocide often say that turkey would have to compensate the victims in some way. I don't know where that is coming from. All the world wants is for turkey to say "Yes, we acknowledge it happened and we apologize in the name of our forefathers", then the world would swiftly move on to the next hot controversy and we'd all forget about it.
I'm sorry, but you're not an established expert on that topic.
You're openly admitting to patronizing people and I'm the bad one?
I would call a history of slaughtering armenians since the middle ages and organizing progroms because of different religious beliefs to be very open discrimination, but I'm not sure, what do the others think?
I wonder why the ottomans faced resistance from the people they were trying to eradicate. It's very strange. As if people don't like to be massacred. Oh, yeah, right! Because self defence now counts as rebellion.
That is simply untrue. The nazis "hunted" the jewish population that was in their conquered territories and in nations where they held a strong influence like Italy. Which is what the Ottoman empire was doing. There was no global nazi hunt, it was confined to their area of influence. Off course, whether or not it happened one could say that the nazi would have wanted to do that to which one can reply the ottomans would have wanted to hunt the armenians in that same way as well.
Edit: also, if you look up the definitions provided, you'll see words like "attempt", which doesn't always scale up since it's an attempt.
Some even say "or parts of".
Then by your logic, no other genocide ever happened in history because they didn't have their own Josef Mengele to do even more wicked stuff than plain old murder.
I see you've taken a liking to threaten people who disagree with reports. Ever heard of the story of the boy who cried wolf? Or the man who abused the court system so much he no longer has the right to sue? Also, that's not how debates work. You can't just ask people to censor their posts because their arguments are in opposition to your position.
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Ok, and you can just click the quotes to see the very original post with the very original words. Same page, even. Non issue, back to the topic of the Armenian genocide.
Oh, before I forget,
Abusing the report system is indeed against the rules.
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RecursiveHarmony
I'm talking about people assuming me (and Turkish people in general) acting in bad faith. I'm don't go and talk to Armenians in that way especially in the first words.
I stand for both reports. I explained second one to the moderator.
I explained it multiple times. No need to reiterate again.
SOAD - PLUCK. If you listen carefully, you can hear "Recognition, Restoration, Reparation".
No patronizing. It just means simple and common words used by other people related to that topic.
This is Armenian narrative. Turkish side is quite the opposite. Pick whatever you want.
I tried to explain it simply. I'm not gonna explain it for pages. It doesn't help with anything here.
I'm just smiling at this post and leaving this thread. This place started started to sound like the Armenia subreddit rather than a game forum.
I'm tired of writing.
If it helps, I don't assume that you are talking in bad faith because you are Turkish. I do it based on what you write, the semi pro nazi attitude, the unapologetic whataboutism and the fact that you resort to reporting people when you are called out on all of that (and you tell them that you did, which is honestly just weird and definitely looks like an attempt at deflection and distraction from the topic at hand).
I admire your patience and calm logic in debating a subject that's emotionally difficult for the other side, and especially pointing out the rhetorical fallacies. Not that it changed hearts and minds, but it's the right way to do this and few people can pull it off.
What is the best way to debate Turks about their favorite genocide? A confrontational approach doesn't do anything. I suspect it's the same as talking to conspiracy believers - you have to make them question their sources of information, in this case, Turkish indoctrination with national myths through schooling or nationalist historians presenting denial arguments, that are used as a playbook for online denial.
I admire your patience and calm logic in debating a subject that's emotionally difficult for the other side, and especially pointing out the rhetorical fallacies. Not that it changed hearts and minds, but it's the right way to do this and few people can pull it off.
What is the best way to debate Turks about their favorite genocide? A confrontational approach doesn't do anything. I suspect it's the same as talking to conspiracy believers - you have to make them question their sources of information, in this case, Turkish indoctrination with national myths through schooling or nationalist historians presenting denial arguments, that are used as a playbook for online denial.
??? I actually did lol at this one (as opposed to the mildly amused expression one usually has when writing lol).
Thank you, the conspiracy theory angle is exactly where I am coming from. And in general I feel that there's too many angry people in this world. Now don't get me wrong, I lose it just like everyone else does every now and then, but I try not to. And I guess I have been on the internet long enough to know better than to get ragey.
I always love it when this comes up. Also System of a Down. If you listen closely, you can hear Daron describe his scheme for financial restitution following the Armenian Genocide. Maybe it's best not to take one band as the mouthpiece of an entire nation?
Just waiting for someone to bring up the Kardashian Armenian Media Conspiracy again.
Of course not, you also have to ask
Edit: had to edit because of your ninja editI had literally just made that edit.
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I had literally just made that edit.
RecursiveHarmony
Let's clarify a couple things.
I reported this post. I specified added the parts that i found as 'flamebaiting'.
The moderator rejected the report, and i haven't objected to his decision. You may not consider those words as 'insulting remarks' or simply think they're in the limits of freedom of speech. I don't have to agree, but i can play under those flexible rules as long as they are fairly applied to me as well.
Also i answered the post i reported.
Eddie's case is different.
You can see i explained in the original post after editing it while preserving my post's original content. You can point whatever you want, but can't misquote people in that way. I explained it to the moderator. I also sent a message to a global moderator too. Eddie's way is unacceptable. It can't be considered under the freedom of speech. It's related to how forum's quoting mechanism works. It makes me look like i said that German and Jew rebels quote. It's his words not mine. I said the one with the Turks and the Armenian Rebels.
Also i didn't said i resort to report people. I said this.
Also Hitler was some random soldier in the German army in the World War 1. You know the rest of his story.
I reported this post. I specified added the parts that i found as 'flamebaiting'.
Definitions of flamebaiting and flaming.
Those look like they match the definition of the flamebaiting, especially the second one. Considering we don't know each other and never argued before, i think you shouldn't talk like that to a stranger in your first post.
The moderator rejected the report, and i haven't objected to his decision. You may not consider those words as 'insulting remarks' or simply think they're in the limits of freedom of speech. I don't have to agree, but i can play under those flexible rules as long as they are fairly applied to me as well.
Also i answered the post i reported.
Eddie's case is different.
I also missed to answer this part as well.
I didn't ask him to censor his post. I asked him to fix his mistake.
You can see i explained in the original post after editing it while preserving my post's original content. You can point whatever you want, but can't misquote people in that way. I explained it to the moderator. I also sent a message to a global moderator too. Eddie's way is unacceptable. It can't be considered under the freedom of speech. It's related to how forum's quoting mechanism works. It makes me look like i said that German and Jew rebels quote. It's his words not mine. I said the one with the Turks and the Armenian Rebels.
Also i didn't said i resort to report people. I said this.
Which means my reasons were justifiable. I explained my reasons before. I explained them above more explicitly. I can answer that post after the situation is resolved.
Vocal minorities are important. They can kickstart good or evil movements. SOAD raised more than a quarter million for the Aid For Artsakh Campaign. That's a good amount of charity money.
Also Hitler was some random soldier in the German army in the World War 1. You know the rest of his story.
@RecursiveHarmony I think you're mistaking disgreement and arguments for 'flaming'. But back on topic:
A book
A book (this one has a shorter chapter summarizing the genocide)
www.goodreads.com
Overview from Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
A book
A book (this one has a shorter chapter summarizing the genocide)
The Fall of the Ottomans: The Great War in the Middle E…
In 1914 the Ottoman Empire was depleted of men and reso…
Overview from Wikipedia
Armenian genocide - Wikipedia
RecursiveHarmony
@Zombie Warrior sent me a message about those words and what he didn't mean anything malignant by them. I believe in his sincerity and close that case. Sorry for any misunderstandings.
That was actually my first time reporting someone. Eddie's one was rejected without even pushing the report button by the moderator comment. I don't really go and report people a lot.
Please go ahead and report me if you think I did something wrong, I absolutely encourage it.
On the other hand, I refuse to believe that you really don't get the point I was making. So I guess now you have a few choices. You can keep flailing around about things that have nothing to do with the topic, or you can try and have a honest conversation with people who might have views that are very different from yours, but are nonetheless trying to talk to you. Or I guess you could leave, but I think that at this point you are too fond of us to do that ?.
Edit: also, I love how you completely ignored @Adorno's post.
On the other hand, I refuse to believe that you really don't get the point I was making. So I guess now you have a few choices. You can keep flailing around about things that have nothing to do with the topic, or you can try and have a honest conversation with people who might have views that are very different from yours, but are nonetheless trying to talk to you. Or I guess you could leave, but I think that at this point you are too fond of us to do that ?.
Edit: also, I love how you completely ignored @Adorno's post.
Your words, not mine.
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RecursiveHarmony
I got your point. You were trying to make a point. I refuse to believe that you really don't get the point i was doing too.
@Adorno Thanks for the sources. I read wiki from time to time. I'll try to read the other one sometime. About disagreements and arguments, as i said i believe in his sincerity of his message. If he didn't send a message me, i would answer your post differently.
@MadVader Maddie, I don't even understand what you're trying to do with that quote omission games, but if you like that, keep doing. I think i should let the children play games.
So if you get my point, what was it?
RecursiveHarmony
@eddiemccandless
The problematic quote. I can't quote it properly cause you put it into my quote box.
What you do here is called playing the Nazi card. You're basically trying to create a variation of my quote to prove your point,but it's a false analogy. Armenian rebels are closely related to the Armenian National Movement. There is even some sort of small, short-lived state-like thing in the occupied Ottoman lands. There is also the Wilsonian Armenia stuff. As far as i know, there were no Jew rebels in that manner. Jews wanted the current Israel and British helped them. They haven't wanted any Jewish state in the German lands. So i consider any Jew revolt as a result of the Nazi's inhuman policies.
