Americans a broken people?

[Magorian Aximand]

The tax dodge(s) were just the excuse. When I talk about founding ideals, I mean the things that built the character of the country; the things that separated us from England ideally, rather than literally.

Such as?

The dividing factor in our society became race, rather than class. Because of the ability to move up in class and make your own wealth (and therefore power), the American man felt like more of a man than an English man. Our ability to govern locally along with the taxation of trade between the colonies and England gave a sense of separation already. The divide happened gradually, and the British actions of the time (logical as many of them were) simply fueled the action.

 

[Taimat396]

So when did not having to spell properly come into it? 

 

[Magorian Aximand]

When we realized that ya'll spell like retards.

 

[FrisianDude]

When we realized that ya'll spell like retards.

  That should be y'all. Else it's even more stupid.

 

[Mage246]

Yes, that would be my point. Latin America isn't usually considered "the West" under some definitions.

And that would be my point, since "the West" wasn't mentioned.

 

[Taimat396]

When we realized that ya'll spell like retards.

隐藏: Pshh, bet you couldn't even find America on this map!

 

[FrisianDude]

[me=FrisianDude]points to the left; it's thataway, dude! [/me]

8^)

 

[Archonsod]

Because of the ability to move up in class and make your own wealth (and therefore power), the American man felt like more of a man than an English man.

The English man had been doing that for almost three hundred years at that point. The Civil War arose in part because the Middle Class parliament decided they weren't going to hand over money just because some inbred upper class twit happened to need a loan. By the time of the revolt you had middle class industrialists rising to power on the back of the industrial revolution, and tories decrying the Whigs as being a peasants party.
Interestingly, one of the main fears of the government at the time was that the discord in the colonies would spark a rebellion at home. They actually rounded up and imprisoned those they thought may agitate in favour of a revolution, most notably the nascent trade union movement. Would have been a sensible plan if they didn't then commute many of them to service in the armed forces.

 

[Sir Lulzalot]

When we realized that ya'll spell like retards.

隐藏: Pshh, bet you couldn't even find America on this map!

Don't be stupid, everywhere belongs to America.

 

[ealabor]

My point is not that seeking religious freedom was non existent, but rather that it played a smaller part than people tend to think and was not a founding ideal in the creation of the country.

It's undeniable that religion, or specifically religious freedom was a major factor in the founding of the country.

Arguments can be made for other colonists which were absorbed into the infant states, Germans, Spanish, French, etc that perhaps their driving factor for leaving Europe wasn't religious freedom, but when the main proprietor responsible for the country; English colonists are the factor, there's no denying that religious freedom was in fact a major base for the founding ideals.


As previously covered, taxes were major proponent for the initial cause of revolution, but when the dust settled and pensmiths went to work on putting the character of the country into words, religious freedom was a major proponent.

It's scattered all over our founding documents.

 

[Mage246]

Taxation without representation. Strange how all of you seem to be leaving that out.

 

[Archonsod]

I always had the impression that they cried "No Taxation!" and then kinda mumbled the "without representation" part under their breath. I mean, fighting to be free of taxes is something everyone can get behind. Fighting to put an MP in parliament not so much.

 

[Ebin]

Wait... Ealabor... Is your.... are you.... Were you just seriously saying that the U.S constitution doesn't want us to pay taxes to our government? I would say that's rather ridiculous, but it's become quite trite as of late.

I may or may not just be exaggerating when I say that though. As I think you are meaning to say "Unjust Taxes". You might want to expound on it.

 

[ealabor]

Wait... Ealabor... Is your.... are you.... Were you just seriously saying that the U.S constitution doesn't want us to pay taxes to our government? I would say that's rather ridiculous, but it's become quite trite as of late.

I may or may not just be exaggerating when I say that though. As I think you are meaning to say "Unjust Taxes". You might want to expound on it.

The hell...

 

[Austupaio]

The fact is, Taxation is a vital part of all archaic and modern systems of government, short of perfect, state-property, marxism with no existing currency, and nothing will change that any time soon.

People need to get their heads out of their asses and get their complaints straight. If the U.S. Government stopped taking taxes, the country would break down almost immediately but all the idiot masses would complain about schools shutting down and a lack of police.

 

[Heafodban]

People in the United States want to abolish taxes? I haven't heard any talk of that.

 

[Austupaio]

Um, where have you been? Plenty of Americans want to abolish taxes.

 

[Heafodban]

Where have I been? The North. Abolish taxes, that's ridiculous.

 

[Austupaio]

Well of course it's ridiculous, I'm just saying a large portion of Americans protesting about taxes aren't at a full understanding of what they're protesting and think they're just putting down taxes.

Both contemporary and past Americans at that.

 

[Heafodban]

You sure they're not just protesting high taxes?