Dabos37
Sergeant Knight at Arms
Summary: AI does not know how to react against the player's archers - Infantry disorganized.
How to Reproduce: Just check any custom or campaign battle where the player has a big number of archers.
Have you used cheats and if so which: no.
Scene Name (if related): All field battles.
Media (Screenshots & Video):
First, I want to clarify that this is not something new in 1.6.2 version, and I am just reporting this now after figuring out that main of complaints about archers OP, are related to a wrong AI.
@MArdA TaleWorlds if you think that this is not a bug and should be moved to general/singleplayer forum, please delete this thread instead of moving it, because there is a thread in general forum where people complain about Archers OP, and I have posted there this issue (I am giving much more information in this thread though, compared to the post I wrote in the following thread): https://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php?threads/just-nerf-ranged-damage-by-30.444895/
Keep in mind that I am using custom battles as an example, but the same happens in campaign battles.
Now talking about the issue, there are a lot of complaints about how OP/Broken archers and crossbowmen are, and how ranged units are making the game extremely easy. I have been making some tests and figured out that part of the problem is that the AI is giving wrong orders to the infantry, and for this reason the player's archers/crossbowmen are excessively overperforming.
* Below you can check a battle where the player has tons of archers:
As you can see, the AI use shieldwall pretty late, plus infantry is disorganized and when trying to advance in shieldwall, a lot of unshielded units are already dead or in first line. This is happening because it looks like the AI is giving the charge order at the beginning, so its units are disorganized and unshielded units are not behind shielded ones.
* Below you can check a similar battle where the player has just infantry, and face AI having tons of archers:
As you can see, the player is giving the move to position order instead of charge, so unshielded units rapidly go behind shielded units and get protected. The player is also advancing in shieldwall formation as soon as enemy archers start firing, and the result is infinitely better in this battle.
Please check the video below and how effectively shielded units form in front and unshielded units behind hielded ones, when the player order to advance instead of charge:
As you can see, units get deployed in a disorganized way but after giving the advance order, units get organized pretty fast and unshielded units are perfectly protected. This is sadly not happening when the AI is controlling the units because the AI charge at the beginning and infantry formation is a mess.
I think that you could easily fix this by avoiding the AI giving the charge order at the beginning, and instead of giving the move to position order to organize the infantry formation before moving forward. Plus the AI could advance in shieldwall formation at a grater distance. I hope you find this helpfully to try to make ranged units to feel more balanced. Thank you.
How to Reproduce: Just check any custom or campaign battle where the player has a big number of archers.
Have you used cheats and if so which: no.
Scene Name (if related): All field battles.
Media (Screenshots & Video):
First, I want to clarify that this is not something new in 1.6.2 version, and I am just reporting this now after figuring out that main of complaints about archers OP, are related to a wrong AI.
@MArdA TaleWorlds if you think that this is not a bug and should be moved to general/singleplayer forum, please delete this thread instead of moving it, because there is a thread in general forum where people complain about Archers OP, and I have posted there this issue (I am giving much more information in this thread though, compared to the post I wrote in the following thread): https://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php?threads/just-nerf-ranged-damage-by-30.444895/
Keep in mind that I am using custom battles as an example, but the same happens in campaign battles.
Now talking about the issue, there are a lot of complaints about how OP/Broken archers and crossbowmen are, and how ranged units are making the game extremely easy. I have been making some tests and figured out that part of the problem is that the AI is giving wrong orders to the infantry, and for this reason the player's archers/crossbowmen are excessively overperforming.
* Below you can check a battle where the player has tons of archers:
As you can see, the AI use shieldwall pretty late, plus infantry is disorganized and when trying to advance in shieldwall, a lot of unshielded units are already dead or in first line. This is happening because it looks like the AI is giving the charge order at the beginning, so its units are disorganized and unshielded units are not behind shielded ones.
* Below you can check a similar battle where the player has just infantry, and face AI having tons of archers:
As you can see, the player is giving the move to position order instead of charge, so unshielded units rapidly go behind shielded units and get protected. The player is also advancing in shieldwall formation as soon as enemy archers start firing, and the result is infinitely better in this battle.
Please check the video below and how effectively shielded units form in front and unshielded units behind hielded ones, when the player order to advance instead of charge:
As you can see, units get deployed in a disorganized way but after giving the advance order, units get organized pretty fast and unshielded units are perfectly protected. This is sadly not happening when the AI is controlling the units because the AI charge at the beginning and infantry formation is a mess.
I think that you could easily fix this by avoiding the AI giving the charge order at the beginning, and instead of giving the move to position order to organize the infantry formation before moving forward. Plus the AI could advance in shieldwall formation at a grater distance. I hope you find this helpfully to try to make ranged units to feel more balanced. Thank you.
