Absolutely amazing... but... frustrating?

[CeZ]

Hey everyone, I recently saw warband advertised on steam (didn't buy it off there because it was cheaper elsewhere) and saw the '64-player medieval battles' feature and my jaw dropped and my hand slowly reached for my wallet

I must say both SP and MP far surpassed my expectations, probably the best £20 ever!

However I do find the SP does have a lot of glitches/bugs and can be very frustrating (put time in, get enjoyment out etc...)

What I don't know is to what extent this can affect people... I mean i've cursed a few times when the AI armies always seem to run past my faction's campaign army pillaging a village straight for me with 20 caravan guard/khergit tribesmen/lower end units.

Got captured... taken into enemy land, escaped, captured, escaped, captured, escaped, captured, swore, turned off my pc - went back on the next day got captured two more times and finally started building myself back up :/

Just to clarify I'm not trashing the difficulty, I know that was just a bit unlucky... what I'm actually wondering is whether my dad would like this game. He's very into (or has been) to Sid Meir's Pirates (which I hear has a lot of map/movement/faction similarities to this) and oblivion/morrowind and his all time favourite Medieval Total War II.

I thought because i'm having such a great time with warband and it's basically (give or take) the above three combined + a bit more awesomeness, he would love it to, but then I'm not sure he'd have the patience to get past the bugs/glitches as easily as I do and it may put him off, and he isn't  into multi-player at all - so my question basically is (to anyone who is relatively far or preferably has completed the WARBAND campaign) it worth introducing him to it yet or should I wait for some more patches?

Things I know might annoy him (so if there is a lot more bugs like this, then I might wait...)

-> Siege Battles, the AI is horrible I'm afraid to say - and the pathing is way out (defenders levitate 2' away from wall).

-> I saw threads regarding bugs with missing wives/companions, that'll get on his nerves.

-> Messages that say: 'Not yet implemented' or notes like: (Possibly reduce this to rumour, for non-player factions), this is quite annoying I mean this is officially released and they imply it's not 'finished' rather than just buggy!

One final thing, I don't want anyone to say 'try the demo' because if he gets a bad first impression he won't ever try it again, but I know if it was bugless he'd love it!

Thanks for any insight, and honestly I love this game easily my favourite pc game ever! It's a shame about the bugs and as I said I don't mind them so much, so please don't flame me 

 

[Maegfaer]

Hehe, I'd suggest you wait a few weeks then. TW releases patches pretty fast at the moment, and here one is hoping for bugfree game at the start of May.

 

[iRIA]

M&B Warband has a lot of bugs, and a lot of work that needs to be put into it to become what the developers want it to be. But, please keep in mind that M&B is an indie game, with only 7(?) developers working on it. I think that, in itself, is quite a feat, in comparison to all these other big name games coming out with game-breaking bugs.

I would give it time to flesh out before introducing it to your father. There are still some bugs, and some of them are really annoying and are possibly game-breaking, but give it time. Taleworlds is absolutely wonderful in releasing patches, and with keeping in touch with the community.

And besides... where else could you find such an awesome game idea and community? 

P.S. I've played Sid Meier's Pirates, and I thought it was a great game. It, however, lacks supremely in customer support and mods. Once the module tools come out, be prepared for a ton of mods and tweak programs for M&B.

 

[CeZ]

Wow  very quick replies thankyou! Thanks for your honesty as well, guess I'll wait.

Yes I did realise it was a small company game but I personally would have preferred it to not have 'not yet implemented messages' even if that meant postboning the release or just removing that option from the conversation... oh well I'm sure after the main bugs are fixed they will try and 'implement' these?

Mod support sounds fantastic! Can't wait..!  Would like to see a lotr mod... because the game conquest was a fail D:

And Romans!

 

[Maegfaer]

Wow  very quick replies thankyou! Thanks for your honesty as well, guess I'll wait.

Yes I did realise it was a small company game but I personally would have preferred it to not have 'not yet implemented messages' even if that meant postboning the release or just removing that option from the conversation... oh well I'm sure after the main bugs are fixed they will try and 'implement' these?

Mod support sounds fantastic! Can't wait..!  Would like to see a lotr mod... because the game conquest was a fail D:

And Romans!

Those are in the making.

 

[iRIA]

Wow  very quick replies thankyou! Thanks for your honesty as well, guess I'll wait.

Yes I did realise it was a small company game but I personally would have preferred it to not have 'not yet implemented messages' even if that meant postboning the release or just removing that option from the conversation... oh well I'm sure after the main bugs are fixed they will try and 'implement' these?

Mod support sounds fantastic! Can't wait..!  Would like to see a lotr mod... because the game conquest was a fail D:

And Romans!

I also was surprised about the "not yet implemented" parts. I was wondering if I was playing the beta still

They did have a LOTR mod for the original M&B, so I wouldn't be surprised if it got ported to Warband. And yes, LOTR Conquest was absolute junk. xD

 

[CeZ]

I was... lol version 0.8### when I PAYED and downloaded it from www.game.co.uk's metaboli/download partnership site...

But eventually downloaded v1.104 and now v1.105 from taleworlds and am still seeing the afore mentioned messages D: and what's with the merchant in taverns, starts the conversation as if you've been chatting for half-an-hour.. what happens if I agree? :S

 

[iRIA]

I was... lol version 0.8### when I PAYED and downloaded it from www.game.co.uk's metaboli/download partnership site...

But eventually downloaded v1.104 and now v1.105 from taleworlds and am still seeing the afore mentioned messages D: and what's with the merchant in taverns, starts the conversation as if you've been chatting for half-an-hour.. what happens if I agree? :S

Oh, the merchant is the "tutorial" of Warband. When you start a new game in Warband and pick a town to start in, you get attacked by a lone bandit. He runs up to talk to you afterward. You pretty much go through a very short tutorial of recruiting seven recruits, attacking a small band of looters, raiding a bandit camp, then fighting in a town to capture a "corrupt official" or something... It's not a requirement to do, you can just ignore him and refuse the quest.

 

[Nachoz]

Actually you are wasting his time.... ive loved all the games your dad loves (starting with sid meier's Pirates! on C64) and if he can accept the dumb AI of the TW series or its poor strategic campaign, my guess is that he will oversees the glitches and bugs and embrace the freedom and possiblities of M&B... sure sometimes i turned off my PC  but in the end its totally worth for me...

My 2 cents...

And even if it doesnt sound like that... Its My Humble Opinion...

 

[CeZ]

Makes sense now... he never came to me though another bug?

 

[CeZ]

Actually you are wasting his time.... ive loved all the games your dad loves (starting with sid meier's Pirates! on C64) and if he can accept the dumb AI of the TW series or its poor strategic campaign, my guess is that he will oversees the glitches and bugs and embrace the freedom and possiblities of M&B... sure sometimes i turned off my PC  but in the end its totally worth for me...

My 2 cents...

And even if it doesnt sound like that... Its My Humble Opinion...

lol yeh I know what you mean... he mentioned something the other day about infantry just standing their letting his archers shoot them!?


I'm also wondering if I'm there while he plays it whether I could steer him past/through the bugs/glitches I mean they are avoidable as far as I've seen it's just whether you can get into the good bits before your overwhelmed by the bugs

I started really enjoying it when I was invited to my first feast... lame I know but heh it kept me going! >.< hehe 


EDIT: I guess at the end of the day he's not an idiot I'll just tell him: before you boot this up you have to realise it's still very buggy and may be frustrating at first but patches are coming out rapidly for it, he'll like that 

 

[Yoshi Murasaki]

Got captured... taken into enemy land, escaped, captured, escaped, captured, escaped, captured, swore, turned off my pc

Simple advice: STAY OUT OF KHERGIT LAND Oh, and Sarranid one too. I would be very surprised if that sequence you mentioned happened elsewhere.
They have lots of bandit cavalry and will outrun you. Yes, it's frustrating, but adds more challenge for those who want it. Otherwise, stay out.

so my question basically is (to anyone who is relatively far or preferably has completed the WARBAND campaign) it worth introducing him to it yet or should I wait for some more patches?

You can give him demo, for start.

And to be honest, there are so many things to do in the game that if something is bugged you can do other things in the meantime. Patches come fast. Example: you don't like siege AI... ok, until it gets fixed just fight bandits and lord armies and caravans, and increase your renown. That will take a while. Unless you took "noble" when creating a character, at 100 renown you get nice banner of your choice. Go to marker, buy and try out various weapons. And I mean, various. Bow, xbow, throwing weapons, 1H or 2H weapons, polearms like glaive or poleaxe, lance stabbing, couching, on foot, mounted.

-> Siege Battles, the AI is horrible I'm afraid to say - and the pathing is way out (defenders levitate 2' away from wall).

Original game had fine AI in siege (not perfect, but it was ok). Warband has just been released and I'm sure this will get fixed soon here.

One final thing, I don't want anyone to say 'try the demo' because if he gets a bad first impression he won't ever try it again, but I know if it was bugless he'd love it!

Demo is fine.

 

[iRIA]

Makes sense now... he never came to me though another bug?

When you start a new game in Warband, you're supposed to start in the town you picked, and the little incident where the lone bandit is supposed to attack you, followed by the merchant running up to you to ask if you're okay. If that didn't happen in the beginning, then that may be a bug. 

Simple advice: STAY OUT OF KHERGIT LAND Oh, and Sarranid one too. I would be very surprised if that sequence you mentioned happened elsewhere.
They have lots of bandit cavalry and will outrun you. Yes, it's frustrating, but adds more challenge for those who want it. Otherwise, stay out.

Yes! When starting out, stay out of Khergit and Sarranid land! Those horsemen are really difficult to fight in the beginning if you don't know how to.

EDIT: Removed the 2nd post in a row. -_-;;

 

[CeZ]

Yeh I started as a noble so I already have my banner: I'm actually on day 197 and think I'm (now) doing ok for myself... just using mercenary troops primarily as I find it hard work to start with tribesman again and still cross swords with those damn sarranids (were always at war with them...)


Surprisingly I am a Khergit and it was those damn Rhodoks! >.< A count (or several) of theirs... lost 6k value in gear/money and that early on it really , really ticked me off ¬.¬ I'm so glad I stuck with it though! 

I will definitely have to let him have a whirl and just watch him while he's playing and jump in if I notice any bugs hehe 


Yeh I think their all cavalry armies really give them an advantage early on, wasn't so bad for me being khergit and having mainly cavalry myself (until I went really heavy on mercenaries) but I totally disagree with people saying cavalry is OPED or rather I think it is, but it should be... I mean that's the whole basis of medieval warfare, that's why nobles were knights!!! Because they were the best!!!  Mamlukes aren't either there nasty but look very similar to kataphraktoi from total war... and they should be nigh invincible there literally medieval tanks! I do think there should be less of them though and it doesn't suit the sarranids - hot weather/heavy armour !?

 

[Yoshi Murasaki]

but I totally disagree with people saying cavalry is OPED or rather I think it is, but it should be... I mean that's the whole basis of medieval warfare, that's why nobles were knights!!! Because they were the best!!!  Mamlukes aren't either there nasty but look very similar to kataphraktoi from total war... and they should be nigh invincible there literally medieval tanks! I do think there should be less of them though and it doesn't suit the sarranids - hot weather/heavy armour !?

Ahem, you have very movie-like impression of medieval warfare   Nobles had horses because of decor and mobility.

"The heavy cavalry charge, while it could be effective, was not a common occurrence.[126]  Battles were rarely fought on land suitable for heavy cavalry. While mounted riders remained effective for initial attacks,[127]  by the end of the 14th century, it was common for knights to dismount to fight,[128]  while their horses were sent to the rear, kept ready for pursuit.[129]  Pitched battles were avoided if possible, with most offensive warfare in the early Middle Ages taking the form of sieges,[130]  and in the later Middle Ages as swift mounted raids called chevauchées, with lightly armed warriors on swift horses."


And yes you're right, hot weather and heavy armor don't go hand in hand, which is why Sarranid Mamlukes are silly in this game, especially since Sarranid troops don't even use Sarranid/Desert horses.

 

[CeZ]

Hmm yeh the sarranids are wierd... like persian/byzantine/egyptians 

I don't about the film thing since I barely watch any ^.^ just read a lot!

What I meant was... if a horse charged at you in full armour with a massive plate mail guy with a lance on top - your ****ed. Probably hurt more than a car. It's not that cavalry is oped in this game it's that infantry (spearman) aren't good enough against them, you need some kind of couching while on foot, or the ability to plant spears/stakes in the ground/auto kill/stop horses when they come into contact! 

Or pikemen! Like with sarrissas! :O

 

[AssociateHospitaller]

About the siege bugs... I saw the SAME THING in the original M&B when I had the M&B battle sizer set to 150! I think it's just that they're being pushed off as there are too many people on the parapets

 

[CeZ]

Oh? Maybe I should take the slider down at sieges 

Thanks! 

 

[Jack_Merchantson]

...especially since Sarranid troops don't even use Sarranid/Desert horses.

Which makes it even funnier that desert bandits do.