300/Battle of Thermopylae MINIMOD

[Servitor]

This debate might be interesting, but this mod is supposed to be movie-based so I think it might be a bit out of place here..

Got to agree with you.

Movie trailers are great, havn't see tha movie myself.

Historical Discussion and book  stuff is to be kept somewhere else. (Spartans had armor, and spartans didn't had armour, this is not some 1 unit type game boys)

Gl Roborob.

 

[Merlkir]

For those who haven't seen it yet, here's a clip showing a battle sequence (shield and sword hacking..)

http://youtube.com/watch?v=1uEQS8fZMbw

 

[morgoth2005]

that was the most historcally clip i've ever seen. though might go see the film ignoring the history just to see the cool fights.

a)did they have bronze shields or leather and wood like the romans?
b)too few persians it's a goddam battle there should be hundreds of men all around.
c)what the guys are saying is so historically poor, that I have a hunch they didn't actually read the script.
d)unrealistic but what the heck.

 

[Aqtai]

While this looks like a great movie, it's also pure fantasy for the most part.

Spartan hoplites in the early 5th century BC Did wear a bronze 'corinthian' helmet, a bronze cuirass (although some may also have worn linen cuirasses), bronze greaves and used the aspis (hoplite shield), dory (spear) and xiphos (sword).  What you have to remember is that only full Spartan citizens were allowed to fight as hoplites and full citizens could afford full armour. The Spartans did eventually abandon heavy armour, but not until the end of the 5th century BC.

This is an Osprey reconstruction:
- Picture removed -


Ancient Greek armour:
 


Statues of Spartan warriors (most of these statues are 6th century BC BTW, Thermopylae was fought in 480 BC):



Late 5th century BC Spartans:
- Picture removed -


And a couple of books worth getting:
http://www.ospreypublishing.com/title_detail.php/title=P6590~ser=ELI~per=40
http://www.ospreypublishing.com/title_detail.php/title=P8674~ser=WAR~per=40
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Greece-Rome-War-Peter-Connolly/dp/185367303X/ref=pd_ka_1/026-1178699-6721265?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1173998803&sr=8-1

 

[morgoth2005]

But was the aspis solid bronze or not?

 

[Aqtai]

But was the aspis solid bronze or not?

No, it was made of wood, covered with bronze outside and leather inside.

Edit
Check out this link:
http://www.larp.com/hoplite/hoplon.html

 

[morgoth2005]

Then it would pretty soon break. Another unhistorical thing in the film that the shields would be pretty battered and broken.

But I saw a picture in a book somewhere that maybe the Early hoplites had pretty big shields up to 1m in diameter?

 

[Aqtai]

The aspis was indeed about 80-100 cm in diameter. It was used from around 600 BC up until the late 4th century BC. Alexander's phalangites abandoned the aspis in a favour of a smaller rimless shield about 60 cm in diameter. However Alexander's hypaspists continued to use the aspis and dory, in fact their name translates as "aspis bearers".

 

[morgoth2005]

another movie fault: had tiny shields probably the phalangites shield. i liked the talibani persians, lawl

 

[(:) Dvd (:)]

Uh, guys, in case you didn't realize this...

300 was based on a *COMIC BOOK* by Frank Miller. Now, the comic book was based on the Battle of Thermopylae. However, also note that the comic book turned the real life battle of Thermopylae into a mythological showdown.

Therefor, 300 is actually NOT based on the historic Battle of Thermopylae, instead it's based on a *fictional* Battle of Thermopylae.

NOTE: Do not take any of the above as facts. I could be wrong about one or two things, but I'm quite sure that Frank Miller's comic book was never intended to portray the reality of the battle.

-Dvd

 

[morgoth2005]

then he should have said that it was fiction and that any coincidence with real persons is a coincidence, or whatever

it was obvious that from now on most of the population of America will now count it as the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Anyway enough of the america bashing. it is based on the real facts so to those who know history it is really painful to watch such crap.

 

[Merlkir]

then he should have said that it was fiction and that any coincidence with real persons is a coincidence, or whatever

it was obvious that from now on most of the population of America will now count it as the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Anyway enough of the america bashing. it is based on the real facts so to those who know history it is really painful to watch such crap.

you are a sad sod. He actually has said it. Many times. Frank Miller has said, the adverts for the movie say it's comics based, the director and all the actor said it in their interviews..what more do you want? And nobody can seriously take the movie for reality. It's too stylized. And if anybody does, he's stupid anyway.

For instance from the questions you asked here you didn't know **** about Thermopylae, so don't play a wise ass...

 

[roborob]

Meh, If you watch closely on some trailers or actually go see the movie then you will understand why it won't be seen as historical.
Anyway, that clip was later in the battle, when they were just cleaning up some stragglers after one (unsuccessful) wave. In my opinion, one of the coolest parts of the battle was that first charge, when like 50 spartans hold and then push back the hundreds of guys pressing against their shield wall.

http://www.mtv.com/overdrive/?name=movies&id=1553704&vid=136403 - another much longer clip of a little non-battle stuff and pleasant spartan conversation while doing boring tasks such as building a wall out of bodies-then alot of battle stuff

EDIT: if your going to go see the movie, you might not want to watch as there might be some spoilers or something
SECOND EDIT: Definetly NOT FOR KIDS! -- or anyone with a weak stomach to be safe....or who could be offended by violence

 

[Chilly5]

Hm, that was something I didnt understand in the movie.
They formed their phalanx at the mouth of a narrow path into a mountain/cliff thing. So where is the wall of bodies?

 

[roborob]

its off to the left cause their was another narrow way through with the ocean on one side and the cliffs on another. There was allready all wall thier they just enlarged it and "spruced it up a bit"

 

[DJNad]

So has this mod actually been worked on at all??

 

[roborob]

a little tiny bit....

 

[morgoth2005]

EDIT: if your going to go see the movie, you might not want to watch as there might be some spoilers or something
SECOND EDIT: Definetly NOT FOR KIDS! -- or anyone with a weak stomach to be safe....or who could be offended by violence

a) i like spoilers they only increase the amticipation
b) i like violence

c)

then he should have said that it was fiction and that any coincidence with real persons is a coincidence, or whatever

it was obvious that from now on most of the population of America will now count it as the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Anyway enough of the america bashing. it is based on the real facts so to those who know history it is really painful to watch such crap.

you are a sad sod. He actually has said it. Many times. Frank Miller has said, the adverts for the movie say it's comics based, the director and all the actor said it in their interviews..what more do you want? And nobody can seriously take the movie for reality. It's too stylized. And if anybody does, he's stupid anyway.

For instance from the questions you asked here you didn't know **** about Thermopylae, so don't play a wise ass...

I don't know a **** about the Greek armour, but i do know a **** about thermopylae, ive read herodotus several times and read many contemporary sources on it.

 

[nihilocrat]

Even though I haven't seen the movie yet (perhaps this weekend?) and I haven't done any M&B modding at all, I might be intersted in helping out with the coding side (I have done tons of Python coding, and apparently that's what M&B modding revolves around). It sounds like a great chance to learn modding since it would be such a small mod.

Also, I think this sort of mod should really be nonrealistic,  and be heavily oriented towards being a coffee break game.

edit: actually, I'm looking at the mod tutorials now and going about implementing the troop types, parties, and such.

 

[The Pope]

I think it should be movie style but with more armor. Armor looks cool.