In Progress [1.4.2e] "Cheering" at the end of a battle prevents attacking routing enemies

[Sheepify]

Basically once you win the battle, most of the troops (including companions) go into "cheering" animation which prevents them from using (melee, at least) weapons. It ends with a somewhat ridiculous spectacle of mounted troops charging at routing enemies, only to horse-bump or ride past while doing a cheer. Amusing the first time, annoying when you're trying to kill off as many enemies as possible. Especially true of bandit groups, since if you want to clear them, you need to re-engage a smaller - and far less rewarding, both from in-game and entertainment factor perspective - group.

Unmounted units mostly stop altogether, which has another drawback that if you are chasing kills to level up your troops, as soon as enemy morale break registers with the game, most of them won't get kills at all regardless of the situation.

Would be nice if issuing another "Charge!" command cancelled the cheering, and made all your troops, mounted and on foot, run down the escaping enemies like the dogs they are. They can cheer when they get their daily wages. *+10 Cruelty points*

 

[uçanbiblo]

Hello, have you tried charging your troops after the battle is won? Some cheering units(not all) will stop cheering and press the charge. try selecting all units (default = 0 ) and give the charge command (default f1>f3). Please let me know this method won't work.

 

[Sheepify]

Hello, have you tried charging your troops after the battle is won? Some cheering units(not all) will stop cheering and press the charge. try selecting all units (default = 0 ) and give the charge command (default f1>f3). Please let me know this method won't work.

I'll double-check again, but I generally do that, and still have troops (companions are particularly prone to that) keep at cheering.

Infantry/archers that already stopped won't continue the pursuit, either, but again - will check once more right now just in case.

Do I need to craft that horse whip to be obeyed by all my troops, or should I go straight for chop-choppy method of teaching them obedience, won battle or not?

On a more serious note, I could understand if "Merciful" companions would not want to run down escaping enemies after a won battle (but then - they should just stop, not prance around on horseback cheering and obstructing the targets for others, less inclined to mercy!), but basic troops should really just do what told.

In this case, cut them all down like it's a harvesting season.

 

[Sheepify]

Had to hunt down lords' parties since, in the usual contrarines of things, looters kept getting killed off without a chance of running away, but can confirm this still happens on current revision of 1.4.2e.

In two separate battles that I paid extra attention to troop behavior at that point, as soon as the "battle won" condition triggered most infantry stopped, and a significant portion of cavalry (and most of my companions, but perhaps it is trait driven behavior), while remaining mobile, started cheering.

Horse archers are mostly unaffected, since for whatever reason they still shoot while cheering, but melee calvalry just won't get a hit.

Issued Charge (0, F1, F3) twice in both cases, did not seem to get even a single trooper to either move in case of infantry, or stop cheering for mounted ones.

 

[Bloc]

It is, actually, historically correct. Hence I personally don't think it's a bug. Even though I'm sure Taleworlds didn't do that intentionally.

For example, I think this can be also counted as a bug:

• When you charge your troops to an enemy, after a few seconds of a clash, some of them (a sometimes big portion of your army ) chases the already running away soldiers, even though the battle is far from being over and a few meters away there are lots of enemies still waiting for them to attack. This breaks your formation and makes you more exposed to remaining soldiers.

But this, also cannot be classified as bug because it is something happened quite often in history. So frequently that some historians say that Athenians won the Battle of Marathon because rookies/recruits -surprisingly- didn't chase the running away soldiers and kept their formation. And pushed back the enemy as a single block of force. But I'm pretty sure Taleworlds didn't consider this human-behavioural case specially.

 

[Sheepify]

I agree that troops running after fleeing enemies when there are active threats nearby is also an issue, and something that will hopefully also get addressed, but if we get into "autonomous behavior" for individual troopers on the field, you might want to consider that quite a few battles were also lost because part of the force was busy looting bodies or taking captives to fight unbroken enemy formations.

Frankly, I could do without either examples of such behavior in Bannerlord altogether.

If not, at the very least, the higher troop tier, the more they should be responsive to the situation and orders, rather than doing their own things (though units like Falxmen or Ulfwhatnots might be examples of where this is not desirable, if only to keep their identity as "raaw keeel!" fighters).

 

[Ignorance]

It is, actually, historically correct. Hence I personally don't think it's a bug. Even though I'm sure Taleworlds didn't do that intentionally.

For example, I think this can be also counted as a bug:

• When you charge your troops to an enemy, after a few seconds of a clash, some of them (a sometimes big portion of your army ) chases the already running away soldiers, even though the battle is far from being over and a few meters away there are lots of enemies still waiting for them to attack. This breaks your formation and makes you more exposed to remaining soldiers.

But this, also cannot be classified as bug because it is something happened quite often in history. So frequently that some historians say that Athenians won the Battle of Marathon because rookies/recruits -surprisingly- didn't chase the running away soldiers and kept their formation. And pushed back the enemy as a single block of force. But I'm pretty sure Taleworlds didn't consider this human-behavioural case specially.

but when the cavalery are charging fleeing opponents and fail to hit them because they are cheering with their weapons in the air si that historical correct also?

 

[Bloc]

when the cavalery are charging fleeing opponents and fail to hit them because they are cheering with their weapons in the air si that historical correct also?

When cavalry cheers, they are stopping chasing enemy, no? So there is no "fail to hit them" Some might not stop right away because of the horse's momentum, which is something else.

By the way, this exact same mechanism is in Total War series as well..

 

[TheWigglyTapeworm]

When cavalry cheers, they are stopping chasing enemy, no? So there is no "fail to hit them" Some might not stop right away because of the horse's momentum, which is something else.

No, they do cheer and just ram into the routing enemy with no attempt to hit them with their weapon... It's been bugging me since the start lol

 

[ste636]

I found this to be a problem since day 1, not only in experimental.

And sorry, but I doubt in the past they were cheering to routing enemies, the route was a slaughter or at least they should all be captured.

 

[TheGrainMan]

It is, actually, historically correct. Hence I personally don't think it's a bug. Even though I'm sure Taleworlds didn't do that intentionally.

For example, I think this can be also counted as a bug:

• When you charge your troops to an enemy, after a few seconds of a clash, some of them (a sometimes big portion of your army ) chases the already running away soldiers, even though the battle is far from being over and a few meters away there are lots of enemies still waiting for them to attack. This breaks your formation and makes you more exposed to remaining soldiers.

But this, also cannot be classified as bug because it is something happened quite often in history. So frequently that some historians say that Athenians won the Battle of Marathon because rookies/recruits -surprisingly- didn't chase the running away soldiers and kept their formation. And pushed back the enemy as a single block of force. But I'm pretty sure Taleworlds didn't consider this human-behavioural case specially.

What nonsense. Getting really annoying every time you report a bug some neckbeard appears to say "WELL ACKTUALLY...". Bannerlord is not a historical simulator but more importantly you weren't alive in ~800AD so you have NO IDEA what happened then.

 

[uçanbiblo]

Hello, i have notified the devs about the issue. If this is out of the game design i am sure it will be balanced accordingly.

What nonsense. Getting really annoying every time you report a bug some neckbeard appears to say "WELL ACKTUALLY...". Bannerlord is not a historical simulator but more importantly you weren't alive in ~800AD so you have NO IDEA what happened then.

You can check out these blogs(blog1, blog2)to learn about our Combat AI, i am sure you will find it interesting.

 

[Bloc]

What nonsense. Getting really annoying every time you report a bug some neckbeard appears to say "WELL ACKTUALLY...". Bannerlord is not a historical simulator but more importantly you weren't alive in ~800AD so you have NO IDEA what happened then.

Calling what I said "nonsense" without having any viable argument... that's the spirit kid. Well done!

Let's stop playing any game that is not centred around the Gulf War or Syrian war since we weren't alive in those times. Heck, perhaps entire WW1-WW2 didn't happen man, damn, who knows? We weren't alive at all. Perhaps Germans and Russians were just playing snowball. Sharing grenade shaped beers and having the time of their lives.

Perhaps you should just play Minecraft if you don't like historical/behavioural accuracy. I would advise you to read Herodotus or Machiavelli but apparently it's not in your skillset so I won't bother.

 

[TheGrainMan]

Calling what I said "nonsense" without having any viable argument... that's the spirit kid. Well done!

Let's stop playing any game that is not centred around the Gulf War or Syrian war since we weren't alive in those times. Heck, perhaps entire WW1-WW2 didn't happen man, damn, who knows? We weren't alive at all. Perhaps Germans and Russians were just playing snowball. Sharing grenade shaped beers and having the time of their lives.

Perhaps you should just play Minecraft if you don't like historical/behavioural accuracy. I would advise you to read Herodotus or Machiavelli but apparently it's not in your skillset so I won't bother.

Sorry bud. There's nothing historical about cheering so hard you forget to fight the battle. Maybe you should interact with people a bit more if you think they behave like that.

 

[TheWigglyTapeworm]

Boys boys, no need to get personal over a game.
I feel that Bloc just didn't understand what we mean by cheering and moving along side the enemy.
I quickly made a video trying to show what we mean.. It's not the best but if you replay it abit you will see the knight riding pass cheering without trying to stab with his spear.

 

[Bloc]

I feel that Bloc just didn't understand what we mean by cheering and moving along side the enemy.
I quickly made a video trying to show what we mean..

I did get what you mean actually. And I understand why you would like it otherwise.
But for example in this, they are not stopping right away because of the horse, which is still moving, but they are "done" with killing already surrendered/fleeing units because they have won. Just because you are in battle it doesn't necessarily mean that every person will be bloodthirsty maniacs that are eager to kill everyone.

I personally don't think that this is breaking the feel of the game. Not especially while there are hundreds of stuff is missing in the game. But if they decide to change it, sure why not - I can live with that. Perhaps they can tweak that based on unit tier.

 

[TheWigglyTapeworm]

they are "done" with killing already surrendered/fleeing units because they have won.

Ok, so this one might show better. If they are done with killing, then they should stop and not ride around getting in the way of those who are not done with killing.

they are not stopping right away because of the horse, which is still moving

Why is it that when all the enemies are off the map, the horse are able to come to a complete stop so quickly like at the end of the video, what's stopping the cheering chasers from stopping? Why and how are they turning their horses and accelerating them if they are done

Just because you are in battle it doesn't necessarily mean that every person will be bloodthirsty maniacs that are eager to kill everyone.

But this is a game after all, not real life, there are no personal personality for the soldiers, maybe for lords there will be. They should either stop or chase, not chase and cheer and getting in the way

I personally don't think that this is breaking the feel of the game. Not especially while there are hundreds of stuff is missing in the game

It breaks the immersion for me and obviously all the others here, when you are watching some of your soldiers chase down enemy to prevent them from fleeing and then there are those who are just riding into each other cheering. But you are right, there are many other things in the game to focus on, but small stuff like this should get fixed.

 

[TheGrainMan]

A toggle for these things would be nice too. I can understand the devs made an effort to add realism with cheering and such but it stops being funny after about the 235th time you see it. It just gets annoying. Especially when your troops let lords escape.