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Tingyun said:

I think RCM actually has pretty good balance, and I really appreciate Khamukamu's work in porting it. Base TLD balance isn't bad either, though I wish orcs were stronger to make up for them not really having the hordes one would expect.

However, if you run around gondor with a full party of elite elves, something that never happened in the lord of the rings and doesn't really make sense, then mordor is going to get slaughtered in a pretty trivial way. Hell, with a good mount and some backup arrows (provided we are in one of the maps that has inventory boxes) soloing armies of 100 orcs isn't that difficult anyway, just circle until they run out of arrows, and then shoot the bunched up blob.

But the game is much more fun and balanced if you play with some houserules to constrain yourself. One easy one for good factions is to always use the troops of the area you are in or a neighboring territory, and no elves outside of their own territory. Makes for a more interesting and varied game anyway. Another is only allowed to join every other defensive siege battle (because if the player is there, it becomes pretty trivial), which gives evil a chance to conquor some territory.

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There really isn't a good balance because of Warband, autocalc, more than anything.  I won with the Elves doing just as you said, putzing around Mordor, getting rich and saving Gondor time and time again. 

I played the orcs and the problem is the game gets kinda boring.  Not enough to fight.

I am playing Gondor right now and at day 100 I've keep every Gondor city from being captured, in part gaming the system since sieges are a bit wonky path finding wise in places.  It started out great, I followed the lords and we took our the Corsair forces, then Haradim, but the lords decided to siege the orc sentry post because it seemed like a good idea I guess and they got destroyed 1-1 by Khand.  In the mean time I saved Caire Andros (I know I have spellings wrong here I'm at work), in fact I've saved it three times now.  Gondor is still strong, Mordor is average or strong depending on the time, but the Gondor lords don't do anything now but a few who die without any troop recovery.    I'd love to go North to get enough rep for Glorfindel or take out Moria so the Elves go to Rohan, but Gondor always needs a sitter.

One thing about evil is you kill off an army, and its back full strength or stronger pretty much instantly.  This is lore friendly, but I'd love just to have a day or two to breath and run a few more missions before the next siege.

Playing with rebalancing is difficult in this mod due to the asymmetric nature of the races.  I played the Baldnirs? (I think) and found while it was better in some aspects, giving orcs pierce bows made them extremely OP in the players hand where you could deploy dozens of cheap archers which did good damage and were not easy for the AI to hit with counter fire due to hitbox issues.

It also made playing races like Rohan very hard as you would take mount damage and personal damage pretty easy. 

On the flip side it did nothing to make Elves less powerful vrs the AI, and battles went about the same, archers kill 80%, infantry and cav clean up the stragglers.

So I'm going to do my own project and I'm sure in the end it will be one I like but others won't.

I'm going to experiment by greatly increasing the charge damage of mounts.  While charge was OP for M&B, its been nerfed to a love tap in WB and heavy cavalry just doesn't have any weight when it hits an enemy line.  I'm not sure how its calculated by setting charge damage on the Sinister Warhorse to 99  gives at most about 25 damage running over an infantry unit, which seems honestly about right. 

Wargs too, which were such a PITA (and dangerous) in the M&B version of TLD are just things to waste arrows on now as they themselves don't pose a threat.  I recall in the M&B version a few battles I won/lost that ended up being a warg vrs a unit, and the warg would sometimes win.  Now, never. 

Tingyun said:

khamukkamu: is your warband port of RCM compatible with the latest nightly patch? I'd love to try it out but not sure if there is the possibility of introducing bugs.

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Copy TDL folder, try mod, if its broke, copy old TDL folder back.

Yea, I've been almost 100% crash free here even with a battle size of 500. 

One thing that is annoying me a bit is that it seems that removing the "no capture" bit from the elves doesn't do anything, and you still can't capture them.  Since for some reason good rarely drops metal compared to evil (which doesn't make a lot of sense) and I never agreed with the original TLD on this being the books have examples of elves being captured by orcs, including Elronds wife (which is why his sons hate orcs beyond the norm), I wanted to make them captureable.

Basically using the troop editor, I removed the no capture tick, but it doesn't seem to matter.

Tingyun said:

Oh certainly I can fix it for myself, but I do think the mod is still being worked on (last patch was only a few months ago). Even if development is a little slow, I assume when they get back to it in a few months/a year or whatever, they will probably check the back messages here for bug reports, and that way it can be fixed for everyone. I always feel like if I play an amazing mod like this, the least I can do is contribute bug reports to help the developers.

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I hear you, I only found out this was ported to warband a couple of weeks ago and it made me so happy.

Tingyun said:

Another bug:

Rivendell Elven Cavalry and Elven Knights units both have riding skill=1, athletics skills=5. Makes them pretty poor mounted units and seems likely to be a typo.

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While I don't think anyone is currently working on the mod, those are easy enough to fix with the troop editor.  I have tinkered with troops quite a bit to make the game feel more right to me without resorting to RCM which can throw some things out of wack in my opinion.

For example warg riders are orcs, and given orc weapons, which is fine but they lack the reach to hit anything using them,  I've watched them swinging repeatedly trying to hit a stationary target right next to them, and they simply can't.  As such I've switched them to Harad sabers which still look they they belong (its a curved white sabre, with a crook in it, looks like bone) while giving them some ability to function as light cav once their darts are gone.

There are a lot of little things like that, but all of them are playable. 

Its really an all encompassing mod thats quite awesome. 

My only complaint is that once the War starts, evil is boring.  There is almost nothing to kill around Gondor and Rohan.  The AI lords there tend to sally forth with like 11 guys.  There are dozens and dozens of evil parties in the area.  No caravans no patrols to kill.  My orc army is starving because feeding them gets too pricey with nothing to kill (and can't slaughter men for it either, since they are not there).  What I end up doing is just waiting for the lazy commanders to siege something, and hope to join in. 

It was quite challenging prior being the evil companions are mostly trash, the evil equipment is mostly trash, and the evil troops are mostly trash.  I was having fun with it even if I was getting a bit grindy on rep missions to get all the companions,  but now its just dull. 

My elf on the other hand has more money than it knows what to do with, in just about all factions, has tons of targets to hunt, and has destroyed moria and now Isenguard.  The huge enemy lord armies (which stick together better than the good side for some reason) keeps the big fights interesting, and the large number of warparties keeps any new troops trained and entertained. 

I saw someone addressed a lot of this in a sub mod but from what I gather it won't work with the warband version.  I'm wondering if I could hand copy the text files from the party info and get that to work. 

I do have one question I can't find a good answer to, with the WB nightly patches.  Some say you need to install them all, one after the other.  I assumed that they were all additive and just used the last one, which has been fine so far.

DL histories of them have numbers all over the place.  So are they all needed or just the last one?  I've only had one script bug just using the last one in like 200 play days.

I forgot how painful it was to start out orc side.  Inferior troops even with the increased numbers.  I can have fun if I cheat leadership up to 10, but thats not really a satisfying solution.  Its just extremely grindy and 90% of the gear/weapons are trash.  Elf is a breeze, even with the hitbox issue.

I personally tweeked orcs a bit by giving all the warg riders shields, and the great warg riders helms.  They also get a haradim sabre which looks right for them and gives them some reach.  It makes no sense for orcs on a huge warg to be using weapons with a 50ish reach.  They literally can't hit anything.  Spears might make more sense too now that I'm thinking about it. 

Bobtheheros said:

It's an issue in every mods with shorter hitboxes,  I am afraid

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Yea so I figured out, apparently there is a way to do it but its time consuming if what I found is true.  I'm wondering if slightly lowering bow accuracy might actually help by increasing the randomness.

Edit: After several tests setting bows accuracy to about 65 seems to be the sweet spot for effectiveness. 

I've only discovered that the mod was enabled for WB a few days ago and I got all giddy since I loved TLD but the M&B engine just couldn't handle it very well it seemed.  My only disappointment is the hitbox issue is still there with orcs and bows.  I just watched 20 elven arches miss one single orc scout until they were out of arrows since every arrow was RIGHT over its head, which would have been a dead center shot on a human sized mesh.  When orcs are massed this doesn't show up as much as near misses tend to hit others, but when there are only a few orc archers left it really gets painful to watch.  I'm assuming there is no real fix since this as been around since the first release.

Ok I got it working and decided to put how I fixed it since most people never did over the last 3 years 

What MaHuD suggested is what I had to do too.  You need to run a dedicated server, and that server will show up on the LAN tab.  Hosting a game directly won't work as far as I can tell.  It was made a little more confusing because I had older files for the dedicated server, and of course had a filter on for only modules I could use, which meant it didn't show up on the list. 

Ok I pinged taleworlds and its a 21ms ping with no loss so thats not a problem (I'm an old school telnet guy so I understand that part )

I wasn't using a server package as I was hoping to just use the lan, port forwarding can be an issue for me since the router software was on a bricked PC. 

I can't but help making a sniper style CKO.  I have have a thing for archers.

It's Duskfall 

As for the rest... I mostly disagree about both the ability to one-shot knights and the amount of long-distance kills, which makes the accuracy of the Ruby a deal breaker.

And btw, the vast majority of kills are not against Immortals and the likes, simply because they are a minority of troops you encounter.

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Yea I got the name wrong, I rarely read full names, a negative side effect of being a natural speed reader don't hate me

Being I don't cheat while playing and won't see PD 10 until basically the game is over, I normally stop with PD 8.  As a long time twitch style FPS player I find the accuracy of the ruby adequate for all but the very longest shots, and the need to almost never hit twice except for the toughest of troop types (and only more than twice on demons) makes the ruby fit my play style best. 

While not every battle is vrs huge high level enemies, the ones I might straight up lose tend to be and as such I'd rather dispatch the high end enemy's faster, even if its somewhat inferior on mid and low tier enemies.  So for me the ruby is the most useful in general, though I'll always keep a more accurate one for siege assaults. 

Argeus the Paladin said:

There are more options for second-bests though. Unicorn Steed (42 Speed, 52 Armor), Jatu Warbeast (37 Speed, 65 Armor, 50 Charge) comes to mind for 5 Riding. For 4, the Larian Gelding is none too shabby.

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Until I get the Spirit horse, I really like the Netherworld charger.  The horse is basically immortal and in those first couple of 100 days I often find myself having to win the battle single handed due to small army sizes, and 9-10 times if I fail its because my horse was killed, leaving me on foot. 

Lets talk bows....

The general consensus from past threads was the Duskhill is the "best" bow, and if you could ONLY use one bow, I'd agree.

Being you can switch out equipment, I'd argue that the Ruby Bow is the best in all but for siege assault (or in the rare case you want to weaken a unit to capture it).

The Ruby is slower, its not nearly as accurate, but it will one hit kill all but the VERY toughest units.  Duskhill will routinely take two on high tear armored units. 

You won't max distance sniper with the ruby, but thats not where most of your kills come from.  On the other hand you will tear through knights of the lion and the like in a way that will feel like cheating, and in siege defense where you get them coming up a ladder or a tower, its just insane.  My record was 273 kills vrs that Immortal army spawn trying to sack Ethos.  Being able to one shot most of the units (and large stacks of arrows, plus a few... er "accidents" by my bow men) made that a lot easier than trying for only head shots or double shooting them.

Edit: I want to add, whoever did the model for the Duskhill did a fantastic job, its gorgeous.  It just looks and feels right, and I'll find myself sometimes just using it for the esthetics of it.

Yea...

My army was like 50k a week with 7 leadership or so 

Once I became king, gave myself a bunch of fiefs in my last game, I saw how huge a difference some towns/villages were to others (10k vrs 700) but then you hit the tax issue and I was loosing 17k a month to tax inefficiency 

I did some searching and others had this issue before.

The phantom kingdom, you wipe out, has no lords, has no centers, but won't die.

In my game this kingdom was Empire, and I wonder if this is the cause..

I rebelled, and was in a great spot to just steamroll empire.  Half the lords loved me and started to join.  The last lord to join me happened to own the last two castles and I had "bring centers over" set, so suddenly empire was gone.  I also got a message to randsom lords (which I took, including the Marius), and then they never spawned again but were in limbo.

I'm not sure if my big mistake was getting the centers via the lord defecting OR ransoming Marius without them having a place for him to spawn.  Either way I got hosed with a ghost Empire faction.