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Le Roux 说:

Madkat 说:

Some thoughts. I hope they give us better range of movement. There's not a real good way to avoid an attack in mount and blade like there ought to be. Besides blocking. You basically have pretty limited footwork options, especially when fighting one versus one. The acceleration in going from standing still to moving is so slow that it's difficult to do things like dodge attacks or being just out of range of an attack. I always thought that should have been a bigger priority.

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I can't disagree more on this. I agree more footwork options would be cool.

But you can dodge attack and whatnot if you have good footwork in Warband. I'm sorry, but that's just a fact.
Stepping in and out of range, dodging overheads and stabs, jumping over kicks. Warband already has a couple of solid options.

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Well I found footwork is more of an element in Mount and Blade combat when fighting more then one opponent while in single combat it's not big enough of an element. The timing of stepping in and out of range is too narrow to really be viable. You move slow and it's easy for you opponent to follow you when you're back peddling slower then he's moving forward. It's rarely something you even consider doing. And when you do manage to just step outside of range of an attack, the pay off isn't there.

You can do all those things but they aren't balanced in a way that makes for the most rich gameplay I think. Combat is mostly attacking, feinting, blocking, chambering yes? It would be neat if some new element was added to that cycle.

trot888 说:

Le Roux 说:

Madkat 说:

Some thoughts. I hope they give us better range of movement. There's not a real good way to avoid an attack in mount and blade like there ought to be. Besides blocking. You basically have pretty limited footwork options, especially when fighting one versus one. The acceleration in going from standing still to moving is so slow that it's difficult to do things like dodge attacks or being just out of range of an attack. I always thought that should have been a bigger priority.

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I can't disagree more on this. I agree more footwork options would be cool.

But you can dodge attack and whatnot if you have good footwork in Warband. I'm sorry, but that's just a fact.
Stepping in and out of range, dodging overheads and stabs, jumping over kicks. Warband already has a couple of solid options.

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Indeed, I like the fact that war and depends on YOUR OWN skill, inserting mechanics where you can 'dodge' an attack makes everything less challenging, I like finding new ways to combat and move from certain attacks. Instead of inserting more mechanics, insert more player skill 

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Why do you think more movement options wouldn't raise the bar and add more skill?

I like that they made swing speed and thrust speed separate. Opens up for more interesting ways to balance weapons like spears that could have greater thrust speed but slower swing speed.

Do attacks now hit multiple targets? In some of those 2h sword attacks shown it looks like he's hitting several things in one blow. This should be great for fending of multiple opponents. Especially in 2vs1 multiplayer where they sometimes try to take advantage of the fact that you can't hit both of them. Or that you can't take advantage of it yourself

Some thoughts. I hope they give us better range of movement. There's not a real good way to avoid an attack in mount and blade like there ought to be. Besides blocking. You basically have pretty limited footwork options, especially when fighting one versus one. The acceleration in going from standing still to moving is so slow that it's difficult to do things like dodge attacks or being just out of range of an attack. I always thought that should have been a bigger priority.

Oposum 说:

Madkat 说:

Depends on situation. 1 on 1 swords are vastly superior to bayonets, however in group fights swords aren't so useful cause of their low damage and reach, that is where bayonet excel.

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How are they vastly superior in 1 vs 1 though?

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Because they have 4 attack directions and both bayonets attack are **** at close range. Sideswings are always faster than bayo overhead and you can chamber both of the attacks with sword overhead, bayos can only stab which makes them really vulnerable to double attacks if they don't watch their footing really carefully....

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4 poor attack directions doesn't beat one good one. Swords could have 16 attack directions and it wouldn't make them any better in their current state. Take spears in CRPG, they have one attack which is thrust and it's deadly in 1 vs 1 because it has range, can kill in one hit and they just have to wait for you to let go of block. In this mod it's worse, because the musket has 2 thrust attacks.

Chambering bayonets is a gamble. You could also chamber with any other weapon so it's not really a relevant argument for swords

Depends on situation. 1 on 1 swords are vastly superior to bayonets, however in group fights swords aren't so useful cause of their low damage and reach, that is where bayonet excel.

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How are they vastly superior in 1 vs 1 though?

RimShooter 说:

Madkat 说:

I do know how to use a sword, I do know how to use a musket and I'm telling you muskets are more effective then swords in melee.
It's nothing to do with preference. A skilled player with a sword will be beat by a skilled player with a musket in melee most of times. The musket is simply superior. Just because some players are able to do well with swords doesn't change that

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I disagree. You simply can't just say that a skilled musket player can and will beat a skilled sword player. That's not something you can objectively predict or measure.

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Well I'm not simply saying it I did point out reasons why earlier
Like both weapons being just as slow and unresponsive, but the musket does more damage, has more reach and two attacks with subtle differences in animation which makes it harder to block

The direction of sword attacks are easier to tell and they need to get in range before they can use their sword. Meaning blocking at least one attack and then they usually need several hits for a kill

I don't think I'm being unreasonable when suggesting that the sword should be better if you consider that most classes with a sword have inaccurate ranged weapons, or no ranged weapons at all

RimShooter 说:

Madkat 说:

RimShooter 说:

Madkat 说:

The thing I dislike most about the melee system is that swords don't really have anything to offer. They have less range, less damage and they're just as slow, unresponsive and confusing to feint with as muskets are. They should be better at something. But I suppose that's for a different thread

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You may as well compare a 1-handed sword + a shield with a 2-handed sword. The musket has longer range and deals more damage, the sword has four attack direction, so it's really all about what you prefer and whether or not you know how to take advantage of your weapon

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That's what I mean though. The four attack directions doesn't make up for the the low damage, low range and how unresponsive the sword is. Damage and range is way more important in this mod then in Vanilla warband. Since most fights only last seconds the sword isn't really viable

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"it's really all about what you prefer and whether or not you know how to take advantage of your weapon"
If you don't know how to fight properly with a sword, stick to the musket. But the fact that you may be better with a musket than a sword, does not make the sword underpowered. There are plenty of players that fights better with a sword.

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I do know how to use a sword, I do know how to use a musket and I'm telling you muskets are more effective then swords in melee.
It's nothing to do with preference. A skilled player with a sword will be beat by a skilled player with a musket in melee most of times. The musket is simply superior. Just because some players are able to do well with swords doesn't change that

RimShooter 说:

Madkat 说:

The thing I dislike most about the melee system is that swords don't really have anything to offer. They have less range, less damage and they're just as slow, unresponsive and confusing to feint with as muskets are. They should be better at something. But I suppose that's for a different thread

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You may as well compare a 1-handed sword + a shield with a 2-handed sword. The musket has longer range and deals more damage, the sword has four attack direction, so it's really all about what you prefer and whether or not you know how to take advantage of your weapon

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That's what I mean though. The four attack directions doesn't make up for the the low damage, low range and how unresponsive the sword is. Damage and range is way more important in this mod then in Vanilla warband. Since most fights only last seconds the sword isn't really viable

I believe both attacks are survivable without momentum and instant kills with momentum

Coming from warband I really like the subtle visual differences of the overhand and normal stab. It makes it so much harder to block and the fights usually end that much faster. But I agree the overhand stab is the better one and it shouldn't be. They should both have the same range or the one with less range should do the most damage to balance things out

The thing I dislike most about the melee system is that swords don't really have anything to offer. They have less range, less damage and they're just as slow, unresponsive and confusing to feint with as muskets are. They should be better at something. But I suppose that's for a different thread

There's a sprint function, i really don't see why such a important ability doesn't have it's own button.

Right now it's only useful when traveling over big distances. But in reality in combat it was used for the surprise initiative and to close short distances quickly

I'm not positive but.. It seems like if you jump then you may become immune to horizontal swings while airborne, when you clearly see the weapon hitting target.

Have anyone noticed this? Or can confirm or disclose?

z_David 说:

If the physics system allows, say, make the bamboo spear breakable.

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It would be cool if wooden weapons, or especially ones made of bamboo were breakable. Like you can only block so many times or something

Its harder to use arrow keys for attack now. I can't do a thrust and keep my forward motion like I could before

Hmph.. I just looked at that player list and think I am not good enough. Can you move me to extra?

Will players get to start with full health each round?

KuroiNekouPL 说:

I disagree. Instead of that I think that shields we have currently in game should be a bit heavier while devs could add few small for archers(and cavalry) which would be pretty light. It's not fair that archers cannot buy shields in MP. Small and light shield were very frequently used by archers all around the world

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True. It's not fair. But what is the bigger issue? Currently there is a lot of infantry with bows and Archers with swords and shield.
Some crossbow men or archers had swords and shields. Most archers however were mainly equipped with a bow, a dagger or a longsword

Mulek 说:

To see what is the difference in weapon proficiency, join cRPG mod with a new character. Compared to native, it feels like special Olympics in Jello.
I still don't agree with you that the difference between archers and infantry isn't noticeable. Just join any battle server and see what happens when the infantry group gets to the archers. I agree that 1v1 isn't always in favor of infantry, but I think that the current emphasis on teamplay is better.

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Well infantry usually win against Archers but there are a lot of reasons for that. I don't think it is all because of character statistics. Archers are ranged and don't focus solely on melee or at all, they could have inferior equipment, it's easy to get caught off guard when you are playing ranged. If you play a archer class, pick a up shield from the ground, a weapon, some heavy armor then I don't think either of them has an advantage

It's actually playing Crpg that has made me think about this. In that mod I noticed that character stats is not half as important as equipment and weapons. I'm not suggesting someone with a butchers knife with 10 in all stats should be able to stop an army. But someone with poor stats and the best armor and best weapon shouldn't be able to stop an army either.

Edit: typo

Alex_C 说:

Firstly, the BD Clan don't have a server, they frequent Nditions server.
Secondly, a mod would go against its being a public server as people would have to download it to get on there.
Thirdly, it is quite possible that there'll be a new Nditions server at some point in the future which may run a mod, although it's looking most likely that it'll be Hunt Mod at the moment.

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Oh.. I was not thinking
And I see

AoC 说:

In fact, most current 2h weapons should be polearms

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I wish pole arms would handle differently then 2h weapons

The only horses that bother me are the full chain mailed one with what feels like 500hp (less i'm sure)

Mulek 说:

Erm, no? I like it the way it is. You don't have super humans with 150 hp running around.
Besides, Power Strike gives what, 8% damage a point? With a difference of eight points the increase is equal to 64% of the base value. Say, you have a weapon with 30 damage, PS2 gives you ~35 dmg, whereas PS10 give you 54...
Iron skin gives 2 hp IIRC.
There is a noticeable difference between an archer and infantry in melee combat. Ofc a skilled archer will kill an inf noob in hth, but this is not a case of balancing stats.

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I'm not sure what stats the classes have in multiplayer.
Soldiers have maybe 5 in power strike, archers have 2? I don't know, I haven't found information anything about that. Is there any? But I doubt any of them have 10 in any of the traits.
The difference between 1 in power strike and 10 should be bigger then what it is now. That doesn't mean that giving a soldier 10 powerstrike, 10 ironskin and a archer 1 powerstrike is good balancing for multiplayer. But it would go a great way to make one class unique to another, and not a clone with different weapons.

I don't agree that the difference of stats in classes now is noticeable. And if you consider how much difference weapons and armor make compared to what difference stats make, then it should be more evenly distributed. And weapon proficiency? This skill definitely needs a bigger effect


Edit: I say stats, but I mean most stats(or traits). There are many stats that work alright. Like athletic, agility or riding to name a few.