In reply to Austupaio <<<Well.. The Russians came a bit earlier then the 7th of May 1945, when Germany still fortified against an allied invasion in Norway, even though the Russians were done taking countries, done taking provinces, done taking towns, and were now taking streets in Berlin, they still built fortifications against invasions that would never happen. And yes, I guess fortifications were built in Germany that were finished later then the one in Norway, but I still find it strange that they would sacrifice so much to defend Norway even though all it's purpose had been long lost (bases for submarines and the navy, airfields (that were basically never used) as well as the iron ore from Kiruna (Sweden) shipped through Narvik)
And I didn't mean that they should have built a wall from the Crimea to Leningrad, because the time would have been too short. But from Danzig to Italy perhaps? In 1939? They would have plenty of time.
To simply say that the Russians came too fast is not answer enough. Remember that Germany had over a year to build a wall from Danzig to Italy with only England to worry about.>>>
In reply to Oberyn <<<If you mean that the allied had plans to invade Norway, then yes, they had. My rant on that part was the fact that Germany still defended and strengthened the defence of an area that was not effected by the war in the end game (apart from skirmishes in the far north of Norway between Germans and Russians. (The Russians kindly withdrew from Norway when Germany capitulated)).
However, I do believe you meant "even before the Russians destroyed a lot of it", as the Russians destroyed basically everything during their scorched earth tactic. And I see what you mean too, but I didn't really mean the Atlantic wall, I meant the Siegfried Line. And the Siegfried Line was designed to defend Germany, not Europe. So why not build one in the east? Perhaps, as I suggested, from Danzig to Italy?
However, I entertain your thought of "We're never going to lose this campaign, so screw the wall" idea, and that's my main hypothesis along with the fact that the infrastructure was bad.>>>
In reply to Ule <<<As mentioned before, I did no intend that Germany should have built a wall of the same scale as the Atlantic wall, but rather the Siegfried line that just defended Germany. And again, as mentioned before, I do believe it would have been possible for Germany to construct a wall between for instance Danzig and Italy.
This wall would not be much grater then the Siegfried Line, and would not hit the worst infrastructure and terrain in the east.
Hitlers obsession with fortress cities was actually not a bad idea. The best place to fight a defensive battle is in your own city. However, one could assume (as you do) that this would have weakened Hitlers ambitions of great fortifications, but again I must point to the insanely vast fortifications in the Siegfried Line and the Atlantic wall (and the Gustav Line).
And yes, the German army was a moving army, but they still did VERY well in static positions, especially with their SS units. But then again, they worked best in cities, so that falls back to the last argument.
When it comes to manpower, the Germans didn't lack anything. They employed (well that's not a very good term, but what else should I say?) millions of Russian prisoners of war to work for them, and (sorry for using Norway as an example yet another time) in Norway all the fortifications were built by prisoners of war.
Manpower and distance was not the problem, and mobility was more a perk then a "must have" with the German forces, so why? Why didn't they construct an "Eastern Siegfried Line"?>>>
In reply to Skot the Sanguine <<<Yes, I know that the Gustav Line was strictly a German effort, but there were still Italians willing to fight for the Germans, so I thought I'd give them some of the "honour".
Though again, as with all the others, I did not mean that Germany should have built a wall from the Crimea to Leningrad, but rather from Danzig to Italy. More like the Siegfried Line.
Apart from that, I am agree fully with your arguments in which WW2 saw a more mobile and spearheaded type of warfare compared to earlier conflicts.>>>
A not to all: I don't think an "Eastern Siegfried Line" would have done any good, I'm just wondering why they didn't build one since they built one against France.
Thank you all for your replies : )