https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLuZ4w8f_02LZOLgrEwJ_9exzj2WURxGSU
Making a playlist that will try to get all the Gamescom footage from this year.
Also gonna post the Sturgian and Vlandian troop trees
I am liking the new Vlandian tree a lot better, and I think Knights may be a totally different troop tree which is nice
Exactly, this is the main concern of mine. I am really afraid that they are not going to fix this and the spears are still working like some hecking laser sabers because they can spin with it like that and it will cause so much damage.
Yay I was right for once in my life, and I hope that they'll add some other incentive to use polearms then
Gab-AG. said:
I'd be rather sad if I had to see again a bunch of spinning, jumping pikemen infesting multiplayer servers on Bannerlord, mostly annoying during groupfights, while quite easy to defeat in a duel scenario.
How do you know this? The heavy infantry can push up to light infantry where their spears are useless and then spam them to death.
Rainbow Dash said:
3. While his soldiers are preoccupied he can either
A. Reinforce his already engaged infantry
- If he does this it leaves him vulnerable to continuous archer fire or cavalry charges both of which will likely turn the fight in your favor
Archers will not shoot into the fight. This is confirmed By Callum, so archers are entirely out of the question.
This is also ignoring spears in the equation. So even if you have infantry and cavalry charging into the fight, they will both be dead by the sheer number of light apearmen.
And sure, you will do damage, but you lost both your infantry and your cavalry.
In other words, this is a 2 for 1 tradeoff. You threw away a squad of infantry and cavalry to take out one unit of light spearmen. Was it worth it?
So archers will not shoot into the rear of a melee where they have a clear view of the backs of the enemy? This seems pretty dumb to me
Yes I am ignoring spears in the equation when they're pointed away from you trying to kill someone else. There is no way for them to stop you if they're attacked by surprise, and if you haven't seen they have really buffed charge damage on horses so you might not kill all that many but they will be severely weakened and thrown into disorder where sword infantry rules
I think a lot of this hinges on you thinking heavy infantry can't take on light spearmen which I think is false because they will simply bypass them using their shields unless they've added shield shattering spears or some sort of fear effect that causes them to stay at spear length
Rainbow Dash said:
B. Hold back to cover their flanks
- If he does this you can probably just carve through his infantry until you get to the last units where you can flank them
With what? Heavy infantry? Cavalry? Archers? I already explained how that is not a viable tactic.
C. Chase after your flanking forces
- Archers are probably faster than infantry with shields and cavalry almost certainly are so you can just run around while your friends kill him and then turn around when he's engaged or possibly charge him while he's out of position
How are they going to use those spears or swords with their backs to you? This seems to assume that they will advance slowly in formation which means you get away from them even faster and possibly kite them around to try and get at their other flank or just wait for them to turn around to reinforce then you can shoot them in their backs.
Im not even sure if I can make a serious reply to this since you make so many blind observations and are assuming alot of things that would mever happen in reality and really are either the stupidest enemies in the world or a strawman. Im not sure if you even understand the situation I am proposing.
In fact, I will draw a picture.
All your arguments that consist of
"Just flank them"
"just charge"
"just distract them ez kills"
just fall flat on practice. Look at the damn picture. Do you seriously think flanking and disruption tactics will work on a group of densely packed sheilded spearmen?
Unless some gameplay change was implemented I did not know, for example let cavalry charges bust through a wall of spearmen, or archers shoot through shields was in the game already and I did not know, every single tactic you mention would never work with a cooperative functioning formation like I showed above.
This is the idea, with your troops sitting back while the heavy infantry kill the spears until the reserves are forced to fight or run both of which should result in their demise.
How do you know this? The heavy infantry can push up to light infantry where their spears are useless and then spam them to death.
Rainbow Dash said:
3. While his soldiers are preoccupied he can either
A. Reinforce his already engaged infantry
- If he does this it leaves him vulnerable to continuous archer fire or cavalry charges both of which will likely turn the fight in your favor
Archers will not shoot into the fight. This is confirmed By Callum, so archers are entirely out of the question.
This is also ignoring spears in the equation. So even if you have infantry and cavalry charging into the fight, they will both be dead by the sheer number of light apearmen.
And sure, you will do damage, but you lost both your infantry and your cavalry.
In other words, this is a 2 for 1 tradeoff. You threw away a squad of infantry and cavalry to take out one unit of light spearmen. Was it worth it?
So archers will not shoot into the rear of a melee where they have a clear view of the backs of the enemy? This seems pretty dumb to me
Yes I am ignoring spears in the equation when they're pointed away from you trying to kill someone else. There is no way for them to stop you if they're attacked by surprise, and if you haven't seen they have really buffed charge damage on horses so you might not kill all that many but they will be severely weakened and thrown into disorder where sword infantry rules
I think a lot of this hinges on you thinking heavy infantry can't take on light spearmen which I think is false because they will simply bypass them using their shields unless they've added shield shattering spears or some sort of fear effect that causes them to stay at spear length
Rainbow Dash said:
B. Hold back to cover their flanks
- If he does this you can probably just carve through his infantry until you get to the last units where you can flank them
With what? Heavy infantry? Cavalry? Archers? I already explained how that is not a viable tactic.
C. Chase after your flanking forces
- Archers are probably faster than infantry with shields and cavalry almost certainly are so you can just run around while your friends kill him and then turn around when he's engaged or possibly charge him while he's out of position
How are they going to use those spears or swords with their backs to you? This seems to assume that they will advance slowly in formation which means you get away from them even faster and possibly kite them around to try and get at their other flank or just wait for them to turn around to reinforce then you can shoot them in their backs.
The entire enemy team has picked light infantry spearmen.
They are moving and capturing flags one at a time.
Now lets see what each unit can do.
Cavalry is terrible and will not win this fight. Charging into a group of spearmen gets you killed. Even with Vlandian Knights who have the best horse armor and damage output in the game they will maybe get a couple units before dying because of the massive amount of spears.
Archers will not win. If you go archers and try to shoot these spearmen their shields will block all the arrows. If you pick the lower tier archers you can maybe shoot enough arrows to break shields or something and kill 1 or 2 people, but not an entire enemy squad.
Horse archers will not work. As I said, charging into a group of spearmen will kill your cavalry unit so the only option is to circle the enemy team and shoot them. But like the archer problem, the shields will just soak up all the arrows.
Heavy Infantry is horrible idea. If you pick Heavy infantry, you are sacrificing troop numbers for better armor, but with the massive amount of spears the enemy has, your heavy infantry can maybe kill 1 unit befors being poked to death by spears.
So, the only other option left is to pick light spearmen infantry. That is the only choice you have.
Is this **** **** fun gameplay to you? Being only allowed to pick light infantry spearmen or else intentionally lose the game? Because I don't see how playing as only light infantry spearman and hoping to win is fun, at all.
So the only counter for this is Bezerkers. Bezerkers will charge into light infantry formation, and maybe lose half of their units being poked by spears, but once they get pat the spearmen, they can use AOE attacks and easily remove 2 players from the game.
Without AOE attacks, the Bannerlord multiplayer meta will become light nfantry spearmen.
This is what I think Taleworlds have realized in their playtesting and implemented in the game.
1. Take your cavalry or archers around the flanks and be ready to attack him
2. I'm going to assume you've taken heavy infantry to fight theirs so take your infantry and attack his.
3. While his soldiers are preoccupied he can either
A. Reinforce his already engaged infantry
- If he does this it leaves him vulnerable to continuous archer fire or cavalry charges both of which will likely turn the fight in your favor
B. Hold back to cover their flanks
- If he does this you can probably just carve through his infantry until you get to the last units where you can flank them
C. Chase after your flanking forces
- Archers are probably faster than infantry with shields and cavalry almost certainly are so you can just run around while your friends kill him and then turn around when he's engaged or possibly charge him while he's out of position
There's probably more that I am not thinking of but oh well.
I'm quite confused how you think berserkers with no shields or armor will fare better against a spearwall than heavily armed and armored infantry though.
I guess I should clarify. My main problem with the vaegir infantry is how their equipment can drastically change from battle to battle. It's the same reason I used swadian knights and not mamelukes. Simply put, vaegir infantry cannot be counted on to have a shield, or to not have a shield, 100% of the time. That bugs me. It's not that Battanian infantry will necessarily be much better stastically, but based on the gameplay I have seen their equipment and higher tiers is at least consistent, so I can expect their units to perform more consistently as a result. They may not always win, but at least if they lose, I can't blame RNG for giving everyone two handed axes instead of shields.
Fair enough, just seemed like Battania would be the least consistent faction out of all of them seeing as they're basically higher tier forest bandits. You sure that you don't want to play Sturgia seeing as they're the descendants of the Vaegirs?
BlazingScribe said:
Follow-up. I liked playing Rhodoks in Warband. But I would like to try more combined arms tactics, get creative in bannerlord. Besides which, I would need to see how effective Vlandian crossbows actually are. Archers have so far proven deadly.
I imagine that means that crossbows will be even more deadly, and Vlandians are almost definitely going to have more variety than literally spearmen and crossbows. They also have archers themselves I think and are probably the most varied faction out of them all except the Imperials perhaps.
AmateurHetman said:
I've changed my mind to Vlandians, I think they'll be a lot of fun. But I still want to get involved with the imperial minor faction that sounded like Cossacks or something.
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