corona? :(

[Mad Vader]

As far as it's obvious that we are talking to a child, let's try this.

Now YOU read this, @dijiTurk, this is actually IMPORTANT.
MOST of the crap you are posting comes from a few sources and spreads to stupid Turkish doctors and then to stupid people who take them seriously.
Here are the sources, most of them are NOT doctors and they are making money off gullible fools:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jul/17/covid-misinformation-conspiracy-theories-ccdh-report

 

[Lord Brutus]

Oh, the humanity.

Spoiler: 1

 

[eddiemccandless]

@dijiTurk there actually are quite a few red flags with that doctor. You just don't know that they are.

First one: his profile says "Prof. Dr.". That isn't really something that successful people do. I work with MDs in research regularly, most of them are professors too and I have yet to meet one that does pick just one title (Professor or Dr., usually it's Dr). Posting all the titles that you have is a bit pretentious and looks like you are trying to appear more important than you actually are. By itself it wouldn't be enough to make me dismiss this person, but there is more.

These are his listed specialties:

Speciality Fields

Pulmonary Medicine

Sleep Medicine

Critical Care Medicine

Allergy

What do they have in common? Not much I would say. How can a single person be a specialist in all of these? Chances are, he probably isn't.

Let's keep digging. He lists (apparently as a job) that he is a Global Governor for the American College of Chest Physicians. That sounds important doesn't it? He does show up here (under the Committee tab):

Committees | Governance - American College of Chest Physicians

The American College of Chest Physicians is a member organization whose members are empowered to make themselves heard and make a difference in chest medicine.

www.chestnet.org

and this is his role in that position:

The Council of Global Governors serves is a large, inclusive group of individuals, with a goal of building connections and fostering CHEST ambassadors around the global community. The Council reports directly to the Executive Committee of the Council of Global Governors.

Responsibilities

• Assist leadership and staff in encouraging a strong international presence on CHEST social media platforms;
• Reach out to delinquent and dropped members in your region and encourage individuals to renew his/her membership;
• Reach out to welcome new members in your region and encourage them to get involved and take advantage of member benefits; and
• Identify potential partners from local and regional professional societies for relevant educational activities.

Does this sound like it's something based on scientific merit? Not really, it is an outreach position. Moreover, it is a membership in a professional association, and no one would list this as a job (I am an IEEE Fellow, all I did to achieve that is paying the money and being old enough, it's probably the same thing for CHEST).

Then you can go look this person up on Scopus, which is one of the main website of reference for peer reviewed publications. Here is his page:

https://www.scopus.com/authid/detail.uri?authorId=6603469127

41 published documents and 12 h-index, and he has been working since 1999. This is incredibly mediocre for someone who works in medicine (which is a high impact field). As a term of comparison, I do research in Engineering, where it is more difficult to achieve a high impact factor, and I am currently a postdoc. I started in 2012. My h-index is 14 and I have around 500 citations with about 25 papers. And I am kind of average in my field.

This is what a good late career researcher looks like:

https://www.scopus.com/authid/detail.uri?authorId=7102565280

286 papers, 18372 citations and 69 h index (he started in 1992 so they are kind of close in terms of age). This is someone who is a leader in his field, the other is someone who failed at doing relevant research. Note also how Findik has not published anything since 2014, while Silverstri is still extremely active.

You put all of these together, and you come to the conclusion that the person we are talking about is a quack. Unfortunately, in this day and age you need to dig in deep and be able to spot all these red flags. This was my point: you can not take news at face value, you need to make sure that your sources are good. Otherwise you can and will be fooled.

Also:

Btw, i'm not aganist vaccines. I have one dose vaccine that most of the health workers had at turkey. And, i will probably have another dose. However, i'm unhappy that none of the vaccines passed phase3 stage studies, and bad sideeffects are possible.

I am glad that you are not against vaccines, but it is untrue that vaccines did not go through phase 3.

Pfizer and BioNTech Conclude Phase 3 Study of COVID-19 Vaccine Candidate, Meeting All Primary Efficacy Endpoints | Pfizer

Primary efficacy analysis demonstrates BNT162b2 to be 95% effective against COVID-19 beginning 28 days after the first dose; 170 confirmed cases of COVID-19 were evaluated, with 162 observed in the placebo group versus 8 in the vaccine group Efficacy was consistent across age, gender, race and...

www.pfizer.com

Looking beyond COVID-19 vaccine phase 3 trials - Nature Medicine

A comprehensive strategy for the next steps to ensure vaccination of the global population against SARS-CoV-2 is now required, and key steps and challenges are detailed in this Perspective.

www.nature.com

And, side effects are possible with literally everything under the sun. I promise that you are eating regularly something that is much worse for you than the vaccines. I know I am, I am having a bowl of chips right now.

 

[Mad Vader]

And, side effects are possible with literally everything under the sun. I promise that you are eating regularly something that is much worse for you than the vaccines. I know I am, I am having a bowl of chips right now.

One point about vaccine side effects, to rephrase an argument by a real doctor. If there are any, they usually show up 4-5 days after taking the vaccine. There could be more insidious and rare side effects, but they show up a month later at most.
Long term side effects, which are the invented fear of vaccine skeptics, are next to impossible to occur because you don't take the vaccine every day over a long term, you just take it 2 or 3 or 4 times and that's it. The only thing that remains are your trained antibodies. The stress from imaginary fears is worse for you and definitely has long term side effects.
This is very different from long term side effects of other meds which you typically take over a period of time.

Another argument antivaxxers make is that your antibodies may do something to you (like the false claim they will attack a protein responsible for forming a placenta, causing infertility in women).
If this was indeed the case, it would have happened anyway if you got Covid, because antibodies would behave the same way.

@dijiTurk there actually are quite a few red flags with that doctor. You just don't know that they are.

"But even if he's the most stupid follower of pseudoscience, he can be right! Everyone can be right no matter what they say, because there's always a theoretical possibility! Isn't this exciting, not to need knowledge to be right?? Let me show you some more conspiracies that may be right simply because they exist!"

 

[eddiemccandless]

One point about vaccine side effects, to rephrase an argument by a real doctor. If there are any, they usually show up 4-5 days after taking the vaccine. There could be more insidious and rare side effects, but they show up a month later at most.
Long term side effects, which are the invented fear of vaccine skeptics, are next to impossible to occur because you don't take the vaccine every day over a long term, you just take it 2 or 3 or 4 times and that's it. The only thing that remains are your trained antibodies. The stress from imaginary fears is worse for you and definitely has long term side effects.
This is very different from long term side effects of other meds which you typically take over a period of time.

Another excellent point. To add on that, I do not know of a single side effect from ANY vaccine that happens long after the vaccine was administered.

Which is not to say that it is impossible. Nothing is impossible. For all we know pigs can fly and we just haven't caught them in the act yet. But there is no evidence that this is even worth being worried about.

 

[dijiTurk]

[video from a divorced psuedoscientist claiming that black people are subhumans]
"thoughts, guys?????"

I would share that kind of video at a thread like "black lives matter" to point out how wrong the video owner. And i may also ask "thoughts, guys?", yes.
This is covid19 thread, right. And, unlike scientific knowledge(covid19's safety & efficently) that progresses by accumulating and questioning; racisim is directly wrong, there is no place for me at video's side. So, your example here is not fitting.

This is the exact same thing as the Armenian genocide thread. If you consistently post moronic garbage you find between browsing for softcore porn on tiktok, people are going to think you're a moron. Nobody is going to debate whether the claims in the video are valid or not, because they are from bad sources, make bad-faith claims, and have been debunked a million times.

I said; all should show documents, all similar events should be judged at standart approach, and all should focus on future while all criminals being punished. If you take all my statements at Armenian Genocide thread, and make sumarize; you can see that all i say is these that i just write. I'm not at the side of genocide if there is. I said, go international & valuable court, let all talk & let law work for all. Then, if there is a reality that genocide is happened, i won't be at side of rejecting side.
This is not the same thing. While "black people are subhumans" arguments totally garbage(& there is no side for human being), vaccine or genocide discussions has sides, and progresses/law must work. After valuable progresses/court, we can be at the side of truth.

https://www.scopus.com/authid/detail.uri?authorId=7103020137

Above, you see one famous person who has few explanations that cause suspicion. Suspicion is normal, and should be questioned in progress.

Nobel Ödüllü profesör: Yeni tip koronavirüs laboratuvarda üretildi

Fransa'da Nobel Ödüllü virolog Profesör Luc Montagnier, Covid-19 hastalığına neden olan SARS-CoV-2 virüsünde AIDS'e sebep olan virüsten parçalar olduğunu iddia etti. Virüsün bu nedenle ancak laboratuvarda üretilmiş olabileceğini öne süren Montagnier'in açıklamaları tartışmalara neden oldu

tr.euronews.com

(i couldn't find same news at english version in website /strange/ , but its an updated news about what Luc Montaigner said[ which censored at facebook if im not wrong], and what another virolog Etienne Simon-Lorière disagreed about his speeches )

The thing is, You never even say that you're looking for someone to verify the validity of a video. You just post it, and then when people say "this is total bullcrap" you get defensive and claim you were just innocently trying to start discussion on something you "randomly" found online.

We are just talking/sharing stuffs about topic. I find it valuable.
And, yes; i found it randomly? I just thought its fine to share unusual thoughts from other field workers.
I'm not collecting all antithesis like contents to here. No deep efforts to do that. I wanted to mention about opposing views and arguments. It's also very agreeably hard to contunie for me to walk in field to reach truth as much as i can. As i said, i just mentioned some, tried to reach their documents & discuss. It looks like i'm done, 'cause its too hard for me to move further at field/check documents. ( i dont move for speculations, but documents if there is in a side)

Ignore Madh'vader. I say go for it. Başarılar. Post every single video you see on tıktok that remotely pertains to Covid-19. Even post the sexualised dance videos and the incest fetish stuff that makes up the rest of tiktok. Post videos of you reacting to all of them, post links to their onlyfans, post videos of rich California girls pretending to be in Auschwitz, post everything.

It is just another social media channel. Channels can be posionous & channels are not where i should look for a clear knowledge. Yes. But, it may also contain clues. One random clue posted politely to talk here. And, being passed on. No more than enough.

(reddit is much more useful overall.. much better with rich content & has quality stuffs in all angels.. it's also same, i need to be careful. and, i dont think i went more interest than needed at tiktok's clue, too )

As far as it's obvious that we are talking to a child

Spoiler:

http://tw.greywool.com/i/jndXl.jpg[/img]

Now YOU read this, @dijiTurk, this is actually IMPORTANT.
MOST of the crap you are posting comes from a few sources and spreads to stupid Turkish doctors and then to stupid people who take them seriously.
Here are the sources, most of them are NOT doctors and they are making money off gullible fools:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jul/17/covid-misinformation-conspiracy-theories-ccdh-report

I'm not walking with speculations. Only sources in field can be listened. And, key authorities should make ie. documantery if there are false informations. I just mentioned about some sources that can be wrong.

I think there are more then 12 people, but the things they say can be also listed & false information can be eliminated with documentary(that has multi-language support) ?

Listening(not accepting, just listening) the field workers shouldn't be wrong. I know speculations are not true.

@dijiTurk there actually are quite a few red flags with that doctor. You just don't know that they are.

First one: his profile says "Prof. Dr.". That isn't really something that successful people do. I work with MDs in research regularly, most of them are professors too and I have yet to meet one that does pick just one title (Professor or Dr., usually it's Dr). Posting all the titles that you have is a bit pretentious and looks like you are trying to appear more important than you actually are. By itself it wouldn't be enough to make me dismiss this person, but there is more.

These are his listed specialties:

What do they have in common? Not much I would say. How can a single person be a specialist in all of these? Chances are, he probably isn't.

Let's keep digging. He lists (apparently as a job) that he is a Global Governor for the American College of Chest Physicians. That sounds important doesn't it? He does show up here (under the Committee tab):

Committees | Governance - American College of Chest Physicians

The American College of Chest Physicians is a member organization whose members are empowered to make themselves heard and make a difference in chest medicine.

www.chestnet.org

and this is his role in that position:



Does this sound like it's something based on scientific merit? Not really, it is an outreach position. Moreover, it is a membership in a professional association, and no one would list this as a job (I am an IEEE Fellow, all I did to achieve that is paying the money and being old enough, it's probably the same thing for CHEST).

Then you can go look this person up on Scopus, which is one of the main website of reference for peer reviewed publications. Here is his page:

https://www.scopus.com/authid/detail.uri?authorId=6603469127

41 published documents and 12 h-index, and he has been working since 1999. This is incredibly mediocre for someone who works in medicine (which is a high impact field). As a term of comparison, I do research in Engineering, where it is more difficult to achieve a high impact factor, and I am currently a postdoc. I started in 2012. My h-index is 14 and I have around 500 citations with about 25 papers. And I am kind of average in my field.

This is what a good late career researcher looks like:

https://www.scopus.com/authid/detail.uri?authorId=7102565280

286 papers, 18372 citations and 69 h index (he started in 1992 so they are kind of close in terms of age). This is someone who is a leader in his field, the other is someone who failed at doing relevant research. Note also how Findik has not published anything since 2014, while Silverstri is still extremely active.

You put all of these together, and you come to the conclusion that the person we are talking about is a quack. Unfortunately, in this day and age you need to dig in deep and be able to spot all these red flags. This was my point: you can not take news at face value, you need to make sure that your sources are good. Otherwise you can and will be fooled.

This is a solid approach that i'm looking on the way of truth. Thank you for your kindly effort.
Even i still think i should keep listen/check all expressions/experiments/studies(as much as i can) from field workers(because i believe this makes result valuable), i will be more careful with tags for seeing real experience. This is of course important while checking an information.

Also:



I am glad that you are not against vaccines, but it is untrue that vaccines did not go through phase 3.

Pfizer and BioNTech Conclude Phase 3 Study of COVID-19 Vaccine Candidate, Meeting All Primary Efficacy Endpoints | Pfizer

Primary efficacy analysis demonstrates BNT162b2 to be 95% effective against COVID-19 beginning 28 days after the first dose; 170 confirmed cases of COVID-19 were evaluated, with 162 observed in the placebo group versus 8 in the vaccine group Efficacy was consistent across age, gender, race and...

www.pfizer.com

Looking beyond COVID-19 vaccine phase 3 trials - Nature Medicine

A comprehensive strategy for the next steps to ensure vaccination of the global population against SARS-CoV-2 is now required, and key steps and challenges are detailed in this Perspective.

www.nature.com

Till your sharing, i considered vaccines as phase 2. Because; this* study tells vaccine Biontech/Pfizer at its' phase2/3 (conclutions part) . And, China doesn't share vaccine's studies (with general knowledge of vaccines can be developing in years) .

*https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577

Your one link's content from Nov 2020
Another is from Jan 2021

And, the https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577 is from Dec 2020, right?

Numbers close to each other. Idk if all studies at 3 links same? If same; phase2/3 is accepting as ongoing trial & also named as phase 3. If i don't remember wrong, normal vaccine studies/trials takes years, so in this case, there can be some kind of shortcuts because phase 3 is done in 5 months?

I can't go further. If you say it's phase3 & its done normally. Then okey. I will consider Pfizer/Biontech as done at phase3 from now on.
I only keep sinovac as (non-transparent) phase3 non-complete & sideeffect+ vaccine.

And, side effects are possible with literally everything under the sun. I promise that you are eating regularly something that is much worse for you than the vaccines. I know I am, I am having a bowl of chips right now.

 

[eddiemccandless]

I would share that kind of video at a thread like "black lives matter" to point out how wrong the video owner. And i may also ask "thoughts, guys?", yes.
This is covid19 thread, right. And, unlike scientific knowledge(covid19's safety & efficently) that progresses by accumulating and questioning; racisim is directly wrong, there is no place for me at video's side. So, your example here is not fitting.


I said; all should show documents, all similar events should be judged at standart approach, and all should focus on future while all criminals being punished. If you take all my statements at Armenian Genocide thread, and make sumarize; you can see that all i say is these that i just write. I'm not at the side of genocide if there is. I said, go international & valuable court, let all talk & let law work for all. Then, if there is a reality that genocide is happened, i won't be at side of rejecting side.
This is not the same thing. While "black people are subhumans" arguments totally garbage(& there is no side for human being), vaccine or genocide discussions has sides, and progresses/law must work. After valuable progresses/court, we can be at the side of truth.

https://www.scopus.com/authid/detail.uri?authorId=7103020137

Above, you see one famous person who has few explanations that cause suspicion. Suspicion is normal, and should be questioned in progress.

Nobel Ödüllü profesör: Yeni tip koronavirüs laboratuvarda üretildi

Fransa'da Nobel Ödüllü virolog Profesör Luc Montagnier, Covid-19 hastalığına neden olan SARS-CoV-2 virüsünde AIDS'e sebep olan virüsten parçalar olduğunu iddia etti. Virüsün bu nedenle ancak laboratuvarda üretilmiş olabileceğini öne süren Montagnier'in açıklamaları tartışmalara neden oldu

tr.euronews.com

(i couldn't find same news at english version in website /strange/ , but its an updated news about what Luc Montaigner said[ which censored at facebook if im not wrong], and what another virolog Etienne Simon-Lorière disagreed about his speeches )


We are just talking/sharing stuffs about topic. I find it valuable.
And, yes; i found it randomly? I just thought its fine to share unusual thoughts from other field workers.
I'm not collecting all antithesis like contents to here. No deep efforts to do that. I wanted to mention about opposing views and arguments. It's also very agreeably hard to contunie for me to walk in field to reach truth as much as i can. As i said, i just mentioned some, tried to reach their documents & discuss. It looks like i'm done, 'cause its too hard for me to move further at field/check documents. ( i dont move for speculations, but documents if there is in a side)


It is just another social media channel. Channels can be posionous & channels are not where i should look for a clear knowledge. Yes. But, it may also contain clues. One random clue posted politely to talk here. And, being passed on. No more than enough.

(reddit is much more useful overall.. much better with rich content & has quality stuffs in all angels.. it's also same, i need to be careful. and, i dont think i went more interest than needed at tiktok's clue, too )

Spoiler:

http://tw.greywool.com/i/jndXl.jpg[/img]

I'm not walking with speculations. Only sources in field can be listened. And, key authorities should make ie. documantery if there are false informations. I just mentioned about some sources that can be wrong.

I think there are more then 12 people, but the things they say can be also listed & false information can be eliminated with documentary(that has multi-language support) ?

Listening(not accepting, just listening) the field workers shouldn't be wrong. I know speculations are not true.






This is a solid approach that i'm looking on the way of truth. Thank you for your kindly effort.
Even i still think i should keep listen/check all expressions/experiments/studies(as much as i can) from field workers(because i believe this makes result valuable), i will be more careful with tags for seeing real experience. This is of course important while checking an information.

Till your sharing, i considered vaccines as phase 2. Because; this* study tells vaccine Biontech/Pfizer at its' phase2/3 (conclutions part) . And, China doesn't share vaccine's studies (with general knowledge of vaccines can be developing in years) .

*https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577

Your one link's content from Nov 2020
Another is from Jan 2021

And, the https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577 is from Dec 2020, right?

Numbers close to each other. Idk if all studies at 3 links same? If same; phase2/3 is accepting as ongoing trial & also named as phase 3. If i don't remember wrong, normal vaccine studies/trials takes years, so in this case, there can be some kind of shortcuts because phase 3 is done in 5 months?

I can't go further. If you say it's phase3 & its done normally. Then okey. I will consider Pfizer/Biontech as done at phase3 from now on.
I only keep sinovac as (non-transparent) phase3 non-complete & sideeffect+ vaccine.

You posted the same link twice so I can't answer your question about the 2021 study. I will say though: millions of people were injected Pfizer by now. Don't you think we would know if it was unsafe?

Phase 3 trials do take longer usually, but this time you had the whole world focused on trying to take down COVID-19, plus years of research on coronaviruses to build on. In the end it doesn't matter how long it took, what matters is the result. The Pfizer vaccine works and has a very, very low chance of causing severe side effects, which when they occur happen shortly after its administration. I am less familiar with the others but I have not heard of any vaccine causing side effects worth worrying about, with the exception of blood cloths from AstraZeneca, which are also rare enough that I would take the vaccine in a heart beat (and it is honestly proof of how well the machine works that we picked up on those, since they are a one in a million chance).

Regarding the Turkish physician, the problem is that he is not a "worker on the field". Not anymore. He is someone who failed at his career and is trying to exploit a crisis to stay relevant. And I find it infuriating that he is doing that, because he has enough medical training that he is probably well aware that he is misleading people, but still does it for notoriety and economic gain.

As far as Montagner goes, all I can say is "fake quotes" https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-health-coronavirus-idUSL2N2ND0WS

And that is probably why you couldn't find news elsewhere.

Edit: you might also want to read this on Montagner

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luc_Montagnier

He did win a Nobel prize, but he has also been criticized more than once for promoting pseudoscience.

Also, here are some long term effects to worry about:

 

[dijiTurk]

You posted the same link twice so I can't answer your question about the 2021 study.

Sorry, at first i wanted to put same link as word form for better view while using it again ,but then i left it there as full link.

I will say though: millions of people were injected Pfizer by now. Don't you think we would know if it was unsafe? (MERGED) Phase 3 trials do take longer usually, but this time you had the whole world focused on trying to take down COVID-19, plus years of research on coronaviruses to build on. In the end it doesn't matter how long it took, what matters is the result. The Pfizer vaccine works and has a very, very low chance of causing severe side effects, which when they occur happen shortly after its administration. I am less familiar with the others but I have not heard of any vaccine causing side effects worth worrying about, with the exception of blood cloths from AstraZeneca, which are also rare enough that I would take the vaccine in a heart beat (and it is honestly proof of how well the machine works that we picked up on those, since they are a one in a million chance).

I heard some people around that felt sick for a couple days just after second dose of Biontech. And, few "possible link with .... side efect" news for other vaccines at past. Nothing more for now as i see. Just... -covid19 related- any unclear thing makes the worry, like long-term effects of cov19/possible side effects of vaccines etc.

Regarding the Turkish physician, the problem is that he is not a "worker on the field". Not anymore. He is someone who failed at his career and is trying to exploit a crisis to stay relevant. And I find it infuriating that he is doing that, because he has enough medical training that he is probably well aware that he is misleading people, but still does it for notoriety and economic gain.

You mean that he's not released any document since 2014, therefore he's not working on field, right? His stop at 2014's reason is unknown for us, so can we directly say he's failed? There may be acceptable reasons for stop.
My personal opinions(as listened his expressions at mother language) : I didn't find him as an unreliable charlatan. It looks like he's trying to do what can be do while searching clear improvement & looks like he came across to suspicious things, and doing his reasonable action.. I found his tongue/approach quite scientific as i see. Doubt, research and criticism - scientific progress etc.

What i want is that more research on unclear things & health aganist covid19. As i can see, he's still in the framework with his experiments/aproach/role in helping progress.

As far as Montagner goes, all I can say is "fake quotes" https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-health-coronavirus-idUSL2N2ND0WS

And that is probably why you couldn't find news elsewhere.

Well those looks fake, indeed. (nice fact check system btw) .
I just couldnt see claims about Montagnier's HIV related words. No fact-checks there. That turkish news in euronews website (that i shared previous post) was also showing Montagner's words related with HIV particuls at covid19**.
(
**2008'de Nobel Tıp Ödülü alan araştırmacı, "Araştırmalarımızda bu virüsün değiştirildiği sonuçlarına vardık. Yarasadan gelen klasik bir virüs modeli var. Bu modelin üzerine VIH kesitleri eklenmiş" şeklinde konuştu.
Kimin bu değişikliği yaptığını bilmediğini ama Vuhan'daki laboratuvarda üretilmiş olabileceğini söyleyen Montagnier, amacın "belki de yeni virüsü AIDS'e karşı aşı çalışmalarında kullanmak" olduğunu belirtti.
)

And, i was trying to say that turkish news at euronews( about Luc M. ) is unique. Original-english form of that news is not available. Like, its only for turkish audience. Why would you make an important news just for turkish audience? That came strange to me. Anyways.

Edit: you might also want to read this on Montagner

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luc_Montagnier

He did win a Nobel prize, but he has also been criticized more than once for promoting pseudoscience.

Yes, i saw those few days ago while i was reading his wiki. Fact check needed for all as always.

Also, here are some long term effects to worry about:

Uncertainities..
&
Delta(for now):

50% of U.S. population is fully vaccinated, White House says

SAN FRANCISCO (KRON) — The United States has reached a vaccination milestone on Friday: 50% of the population, all ages, are now fully vaccinated, the White House COVID-19 data director confi…

www.abc27.com

Alarm as US Covid cases above 100,000 a day for first time since February

Seven-day hospital admissions average up 40% from week before as Mississippi health official says Delta surging ‘like a tsunami’

www.theguardian.com

 

[Orion]

Continuing to post misinformation regarding Covid-19 and vaccines while pushing fringe theories will result in your access to this thread being restricted. This is a globe-spanning public health issue, and the longer it takes people to get vaccinated the more likely it becomes that resistant variants will develop. Second-guessing the consensus on vaccines does nothing but undermine the world-wide vaccination effort.

 

[Lord Brutus]

Down goes Turk.

Spoiler: 1

What is this fascination with BS theories about the COVID vaccine? Without vaccines we'd still be plagued with smallpox and polio.

 

[dijiTurk]

@Orion when i shared the news that about AZ's "possible link with blood clot ", i called as spreader of misinformation those days. But, today, much more people say that there is link, but its very very low percentance. Which means, those "possible link" news wasn't misinformation. They were just news. (JJ can be considered same)

Now, i'm talking about COVID-19 related things again with a doc's data-based critiques of scientific methodology, and i'm again sharing misinformation? Some parts seems misinformative( Luc M.'s some of the claimed "expressions" that went into fact-check systems with - result as i see). However, there are more things that needs fact-check, and they carry news value. Scientific researhes/criticism does interesting for me. And i thought it is good to share/talk about them.

Beyond these, i can stop my sharings for sure. For months, i'll be monitoring news, but not sharing here. I hope vaccines will be successful, and world get rid of covid19/any variants.

Down goes Turk.

Spoiler: 1

What is this fascination with BS theories about the COVID vaccine? Without vaccines we'd still be plagued with smallpox and polio.

If you really read i said that i'm not aganist vaccine, and i didn't talk as aganist for covid19 vaccines, but shared scientific concerns about uncertainities/sideffects etc.

Spoiler:

That's not a fitting illustration. Neither in topic. It's bad behavior to compare someone to the wrong thing..

 

[Mad Vader]

@Orion when i shared the news that about AZ's "possible link with blood clot ", i called as spreader of misinformation those days. But, today, much more people say that there is link, but its very very low percentance. Which means, those "possible link" news wasn't misinformation. They were just news. (JJ can be considered same)

You were not criticized when these were reality-based Reuters articles, but you were criticized when you shared tabloid clickbait and brilliant personal observations like this.

Vaccines're prepared too fast. And, some heavy dose drugs make heart attack. These two => Real.

So.. Seems like that best solution for corona is long common curfew with support of governments(all over the world). But.. Not easy.

Beyond these, i can stop my sharings for sure. For months, i'll be monitoring news, but not sharing here. I hope vaccines will be successful, and world get rid of covid19/any variants.

Thank you. No, really.

If you really read i said that i'm not aganist vaccine, and i didn't talk as aganist for covid19 vaccines, but shared scientific concerns about uncertainities/sideffects etc.

Yeah, no, you keep sharing misinformation about vaccines and going out of your way to find it (="you do your own research"). There are millions of people like you that do the same because they are afraid of new things and paranoid towards the "establishment".
People who are not against vaccines don't do this, they share real information from reputable sources.

Turkey is among the countries that likes conspiracy theories, so you are under influence of your country's mentality. Belief in random conspiracy theories may appear normal to you because you live in Turkey, but it's not that normal elsewhere. Or as wiki says:

Conspiracy theories are a prevalent feature of culture and politics in Turkey. Conspiracism is an important phenomenon in understanding Turkish politics. This is explained by a desire to "make up for our lost Ottoman grandeur", the humiliation of perceiving Turkey as part of "the malfunctioning half" of the world, and a low level of media literacy among the Turkish population

 

[Adorno]

Speaking of silly theories, on Facebook there's a growing number of people refuting germ theory.

Deep dive into stupid: Meet the growing group that rejects germ theory

Germ theory denialist Facebook group went from 147 members in April 2020 to 18.4K now.

arstechnica.com

Germ theory denialists—also known as people who don't believe that pathogenic viruses and bacteria can cause disease.

... there is only one disease in existence: toxemia. This disease is caused by toxic exposures that occur by leading a dirty, unnatural lifestyle, which causes damage to your terrain. All disease symptoms are merely a sign that your body is trying to "detox." If your body isn't able to detox, the disease will progress through seven levels, the last one being cancer.

"It's not good business to tell a client that they have caused their own miseries, so the medical profession has blamed suffering on everything but the individual's own failure in the game of living."

 

[Mad Vader]

Another take on "medical experts, including doctors are all corrupt and bribed [by some vague, sinister elite], is a conspiracy", the same claim of those that already deny corona exists or claim it's just a flu. This is depressing, we are losing common assumptions with these people.

 

[Lord Brutus]

Evolution is being reversed. Humans are turning back into primeval primates.

 

[eddiemccandless]

It appears that Facebook now has a way to report groups for health misinformation. I just reported this group and I encourage everyone who has a Facebook account to do the same.

 

[Mad Vader]

It appears that Facebook now has a way to report groups for health misinformation. I just reported this group and I encourage everyone who has a Facebook account to do the same.

You can't stop the truth, science thug!
Seriously, this looks like some New Age pseudomedicine crap, updated for Corona fears and drawing middle-aged women with ailments looking for a miracle cure (and there are so many of these! all potential recruits for this and other pseudomedicine and nutrition sites). The medical profession needs an outreach program for these lost souls, they don't care if you have facts and numbers, they only care about salvation.

 

[Adorno]

There's a funny correlation to classic religious/superstitious beliefs where you must do the right things to avoid god's punishment, but if it strikes anyway, it's because something still wasn't done right. If you do a raindance and it still doesn't rain, it's not because there's no relation between the dance and rain. Instead it's because something wasn't done right.
The idea is if you eat healthy, and live correctly, you will not get sick. But obviously people still get sick.

So how do you avoid toxic exposures and failing at life? Basically, you just eat a lot of fruit and cut out all things "not fit for man." That includes meat, dairy, eggs, breads, pasta, soy, nut and seed oils, potatoes, garlic, onions, cereals, salt, fermented foods, coffee, supplements, alcohol, tobacco, and any other intoxicating substances. Oh, and all evidence-based drugs, medical treatments, and vaccines—obviously.

Close to no one can avoid all of that* - and hopefully not vaccines - so it's easy to scrutinize a person's habits and find a reason if they should get sick.

* Sounds like you'd struggle to avoid malnutrition on such a diet.

 

[eddiemccandless]

You can't stop the truth, science thug!
Seriously, this looks like some New Age pseudomedicine crap, updated for Corona fears and drawing middle-aged women with ailments looking for a miracle cure (and there are so many of these! all potential recruits for this and other pseudomedicine and nutrition sites). The medical profession needs an outreach program for these lost souls, they don't care if you have facts and numbers, they only care about salvation.

They really do, but Facebook and other large corporations are monetizing these people too and they need to stop and take responsibility for the monsters they are creating. This is a relatively fringe group, but so was QAnon. I regularly receive ads from Google on one of the silly games I like to play about a magical pill that will burn fats through a Keto diet (I am not even sure how that makes sense). Highly recommended by the doctors on TV!

 

[Antoine de Saint-Exupéry]

they need to stop and take responsibility for the monsters they are creating.

this is facebook you're talking about. they refuse to take real responsibility for the genocides they're complicit in, this won't be different.