2016 U.S. Presidential Elections: The Circus Is In Full Swing
- Thread starter Anthropoid
- Start date
Users who are viewing this thread
I don't know if this because of the right-wing **** we are fed and need to deal with every day in Poland or the world has become the more hostile and stupid place to live in general.
1. Win a majority through gerrymandering
2. Be racist and try to make it hard for non-whites to vote
3. Make fun of people who don't want that
moof
Regular
“Whether it's the unauthorized expansion of mail-in ballots or the unauthorized expansion of drive-thru voting, we must pass laws to prevent election officials from jeopardizing the election process,” Abbott said on Monday.
"**** black people had an easier time voting in the 2020 election, we must pass laws to prevent election officials from jeopardizing the election process," Abbot said on monday.
Same energy
moof
Regular
It is a fact that the voting changes put in place as a result of Covid allowed more people to vote. Tell me why the logical response is to scrap it, rather than embracing that it brought about a net positive change and allowed more people to vote. Scrapping it would then make it more difficult for those people to vote again.
You wanna talk logic? That is very simple logic right there, your mind is probably blown though. Quick, google a new ben shapiro take for your counter.
"Christian satire", just when I thought I had seen everything, the Internet finds a way to surprise me once more, as usual. Net be Praised.
BB is fairly known on right-wing sites, because they think The Onion is liberal. During the Trump era it only made light fun of Trump, while savaging Hilary (a common right-wing obsession, although politically irrelevant since her loss), Pelosi, AOC... They know their audience.
Are we going to pretend Republican suppression of non-white voters is something imaginary now? You could write a history book about it.
Are you going to pretend the changes are there to prevent voter fraud?
Or you simply like the racists more.
I have an uneasy feeling about the fact that half of the country thinks the election was rigged, and changing some of the voting laws, even if it doesn't really do anything, might ease some of that madness. The problem of course is that any attempt to change voting laws by Republicans will automatically be viewed as restricting the minority vote, and given all the history there, it's not a ridiculous assumption. I haven't read the laws myself so I can't say if it really is about restricting the minority vote, but it's likely. That said, I still think some voting laws should be changed, every right-winger thinking the election was rigged is not good at all, and who's to say that Republicans won't pull that card in another election, sowing more chaos? Change would have to be bipartisan, yet we all know that's not likely to happen.
moof
Regular
It's not an assumption at this point, it's pretty much established that republicans are making changes that disenfranchise voters. And of course as per usual with republicans, their changes disproportionately effect minorities.
For example, during the election Texas republicans made extremely slimey last minute changes like setting a limit on the number of ballot boxes per county. They set that limit to one. This brings us back to minorities being disenfranchised. In Texas there are counties with millions of people, who is more likely to be living in extremely dense counties? Generally people of lower class, which is disproportionately black in Texas. Who is more likely to be living in sparsely populated counties? The sub urban and wealthier people of course. So naturally you'll see people of colour having a tougher time to vote, cause they are now statistically more likely to experience insanely long wait lines to vote as well as having a much harder time submitting a mail in ballot in Texas. In other states there were several ballot boxes per county, and everyone was able to submit a mail in ballot hassle free, and yet there is no increased rate of voting fraud occurring to justify republicans limiting it further.
It really is a black and white and beyond any doubt that republicans are strategically trying to suppress particular voting demographics, because statistically the more people that are able to vote the less likely republicans are to win. They know that, and they're trying to do something about it. All that and there are still people who will argue in their favour somehow and have the audacity to call us sheep lol.
the funniest part about it is that they openly admit as much what feels like every other month, with statements along the lines of "if those people could vote regularly we'd never win again" and such. it's not like it's a secret.
I don't really disagree at all, I just think that the voting process should be changed somehow to calm down the hysteria over "election fraud". Not the way the Republicans are doing it, but I think there could be a standardized, federal Voter ID card required to vote, overriding other requirements and simple enough to acquire for everyone, rather than leaving the rules up to the states. Simplify it. The US could benefit from standardizing some of its systems.
You are naive if you think any measure would stop claims of voter fraud by the likes of Trump and other populists. They'll just invent something else, like Venezuelan voting machines.
If people want to believe there was a fraud, because they live in an info bubble where all kinds of claims about fraud are being made, there's no way to change their minds, as the last US election showed when Trump's lawsuits about fraud were dismissed by every judge, yet people kept believing there was fraud and still do.
You have to cure the cause - take away the ability of media and politicians to spread disinformation about elections with impunity.
It most certainly won't just stop claims for sure, but I view the lack of belief in the election process as a massive issue that needs to be addressed in multiple different ways. Simply doing nothing isn't better. Trump and populists will claim anything, the real issue is how we can make people less believing in these lies, although that is no easy task. Far-right info bubbles and a complete disregard of things like established facts and truths keep the ball rolling.
Sure, but that's not an easy thing to draw lines with. What qualifies as disinformation and whether it's an illegal action is hard to define, and we certainly don't want straight-up censorship, because remember, what the government can do to Republicans, Republicans can do to you once they're in power. Politicians and media making massive lies should not have complete impunity though, but it can be kind of a gray area, especially when much of Conservative media is from random YouTubers and the like. It would probably violate the First Amendment to fine or imprison some guntuber for making wild claims about election fraud or some maniac shouting "fraud" on the side of the road, while it would probably be more reasonable to get something like Fox News in legal trouble for making defaming statements about voting machine companies.
I understand a part of the law is a ban on 24-hour polling places. Why is that a problem to Republicans?
My guess is that they (Republican voters) think that 24-hour polling places mean that election fraud will happen due to the quieter hours of the night.
moof
Regular
Yeah I completely agree, there is no reason someone in Califorina should have a different voting experience and criteria than someone in Alabama or Texas. It should be simplified and standardized for sure to minimize states ability to interfere the way they are now.
The idea of not requiring identification to vote is, to me, utterly baffling(I'm not American). Especially in a country like the United States that has such a high number of non-citizen residents. My understanding of the history of American voter suppression is very poor, so I don't understand the culture, but it is still baffling to me why proving that you are who you are and that you are eligible to vote is somehow considered bad. I dunno(i'm not sure if this is relevant to the law you guys are talking about).
I guess the go-to standard now when your candidate loses is to try and de-legitimize the election by saying that it was rigged/hacked/whatever. It's almost certainly going to get worse from here.
I learned this morning about a speech Trump gave at something called "CPAC" a few days ago. He's 100% running in 2024, mark my words, lmao(this is my opinion not a statement of fact, he didn't actually say that he was running).
So are we going to see Cheeto Narcissist vs. Dementia Invertebrate - Round 2? Or will Biden have lost too many of his marbles by then, and who will the Democrats send up against Trump this time?
The ironic thing about the whole "election was rigged" Republican/etc. narrative is that it is essentially just the same bull**** that I saw getting screeched for 4 years by Democrats/etc. with the whole "Russians hacked the election!" meme.
I guess the go-to standard now when your candidate loses is to try and de-legitimize the election by saying that it was rigged/hacked/whatever. It's almost certainly going to get worse from here.
I learned this morning about a speech Trump gave at something called "CPAC" a few days ago. He's 100% running in 2024, mark my words, lmao(this is my opinion not a statement of fact, he didn't actually say that he was running).
So are we going to see Cheeto Narcissist vs. Dementia Invertebrate - Round 2? Or will Biden have lost too many of his marbles by then, and who will the Democrats send up against Trump this time?
moof
Regular
There's nothing wrong with requiring identification to vote, nobody is taking issue with that. The republicans are just trying to boil down the lefts problems with them by saying "Hey all we're doing is requiring ID to vote", the problem runs much deeper than that. Since we're talking about the whole Texas situation right now i'll give you some examples of what Texas republicans have done, which prompted the Texas democratic congress members to leave the state to block the bill.
In the 2020 election the ways in which you could vote were expanded since of course they had to minimize the amount of people in one area. So voting by mail was expanded by giving more time to send your vote in, and allowing you to send it in much earlier than previous years. They also added drive-thru voting in a county with 4 million people living in it. This allowed a lot more people who otherwise would've avoided voting due to the extremely long wait times as a result of Republicans only allowing one ballot box in a county of 4 million people. No exaggeration there lol, one ballot box for 4 million people to physically visit and vote in (which is blatant voter suppression since most people in the area lean democrat). So of course, mail in plus drive-thru voting allowed waaaay more people to vote since they now didnt have as much hassle to deal with. Covid voting measures also included allowing voting drop off locations to be open 24/7, allowing people to vote at any time they wanted to, any day of the week. Covid measures also allowed for mail in ballots to be sent to everyone even without them requesting it, so they don't have to visit any physical location to collect their ballot to vote (obviously identity is still verified when they send the ballot in), which is a very normal practice in other first world countries like Canada for example. Everyone is mailed their voting registration even if they dont ask for it.
So, all of those measures put in place for Covid turned out to have a very positive impact on citizens who otherwise would've had more hassle to deal with when voting. Despite there being no evidence of these specific measures causing an increase in voter fraud, Texas Republicans decided to ban all of those new voting measures under the claim that they're protecting voter integrity. So they straight up just yoinked really good changes that allowed more people to vote, and of course it's no surprise that there was a spike in democratic voters since more people voting in an area that leans democratic will mean republicans lose by a larger margin if more people start to vote. Texas Republicans have a congress majority, so the bill was going to 100% pass and as a result the Texas Democrats decided to leave the state which would effectively prevent the bill from passing.
TLDR; Despite republicans pushing the narrative that they just innocently want to have people identify themselves before voting and aren't causing any harm beyond that, the problem runs much deeper. The main problem is access to voting like I laid out, and how different groups of people may have an easier or harder time voting depending on where they live. Republicans across the states take advantage of densely populated areas by limiting their voting options in blatant ways like allowing only one ballot box in a county of 4 million people. This is what everyone is talking about when they say "disenfranchising voters".
Oh, ok. Nah I've seen dozens of people (it's not a large sample size, but at the same time I don't spend heaps of time looking at people's opinions on wierd issues like this) have a problem with the ID issue. I never thought it was the whole problem, but it seems to be most of what people were talking about over the last 6 months, but I admit my perspective on this specific topic is a surface take.
Thanks for the rundown.
