Bannerlord disease/plague idea

Hello everyone,
A thought have just crossed my mind regarding diseases and stuff like that. I was thinking that it would be really cool feature that would add diseases.
Basically, there would be some centers from which it would spread, every country having bigger chance for a disease spawning and it would be carried trough caravans, peasants, lords, everyone. There would be a chance of it spawning in sieges and if it did so you would be able to fire the bodies over the wall to the enemy to get him infected, which would give a point to sieging for long preiods of time. But be aware, if you would attack too soon with the plague still in the city it could just as easily spread onto your people, this would also give more buildings to build which apart from sanitation could give you some income.

I don´t like alchemy in games for any potions that would cure it as it wouldn´t make much sense but there should be things defending you from it, like buying vegetables and fruit, setting some sliders if you want your soldiers to be clean a lot but on the other had it would decrease morale a bit (there could also be some wage slider, maybe a set of them).

After the disease is is out you could scortch earth to get rid of it and maybe even get money off of it? In medieval times lord sometimes bought these devasted villages as most of the population was dead and then they build industry (so you would have to own the village just part of it) and made some good cash, increasing thier strenght.

The plage could also kill your main charcter if not carefull which would add you more reasons to run from it as fast as you can, this would asco cripple the nation/land it touched and so no money for anyone and a great drop in army numbers, this could be devastating for a nation and in turn help others.

Lastly you could pay money to bring settlers from other villages to your to increase its population back again (this would need a population count which you would have to manage which for me I would enjoy managing population to grow as I like strategy but for most people it would be more conviniet to just get the settlers out of thin air, you pay money and boom, they are there)

What do you think?

They said that the player gets sick before they die but it doesn't sound related to this idea.

This idea would be a good addition to sandbox however it might make the game somewhat daunting or slow players as they don't want to die; yet another impact could be that a large number of lords/your favorite lord dies. If correctly explained and not present at the start it could work. Plagues would need to be controlled from a game play point of view. Mid or late early game there should be the possibility for the player to stumble upon lightly diseased villages. During the mid game they should begin to see more impacts with a potential national or international plague occurring; this is also when they learn about diseases to do with castles or armies. In general very few lords should die because of plague and the player only if they are old and in somewhat of a weakened state already; non-fatal diseases could lead to debuffs. In plague swept villages/ towns notables should die to stop recruitment etc.

However I feel that this is too much to be added in at this "stage"(the idea they are working on the late game), this means it will likely be a mod.

Yeah, get ready as this is the favorite argument of the fun/gameplay>realism crowd.

All in all, while it could be an interesting mechanic to have to deal with, it also has the potential to be a cause of unbalance, possibly game-breakingly so. I'd say this should stay firmly in the realm of mods.

That being said, it seems you have a few ideas on how it would
Play out. Maybe you should think about moddin it in yourself, if you're willing to put in the time/effort.

I personally don't like negative random events without some reward potential for skillful play and can't see it here. If your only choice is to quarantine and wait it out (and hope your enemies are hurt more), then there's no scope for skillful play.

Random events are not liked universally by players unless they lean on the positive side and don't influence the game balance too much.
Even a massive event like a NORD INVASION DLC RELEASE DATE ANNOUNCED THIS WEEK would be better off if it introduces Vikings into the game one by one.

Rodrigo Ribaldo said:

I personally don't like negative random events without some reward potential for skillful play and can't see it here. If your only choice is to quarantine and wait it out (and hope your enemies are hurt more), then there's no scope for skillful play.

Random events are not liked universally by players unless they lean on the positive side and don't influence the game balance too much.
Even a massive event like a NORD INVASION DLC RELEASE DATE ANNOUNCED THIS WEEK would be better off if it introduces Vikings into the game one by one.

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There's a DLC for CK2 that introduces plagues, and you know what? It's among the most hated DLC for that game for a reason... Plague simulator does not bode well in a game like Warband/BL at all, if even in a pure RTS game perspective it's annoying, here it would be worse (except for those who like WTF randomness into their game) Now, bare with me, if they've intentionally removed ambushes, which are not as annoying as something like plagues, this one would have even less of a chance of making into the game.

Rodrigo Ribaldo said:

I personally don't like negative random events without some reward potential for skillful play and can't see it here. If your only choice is to quarantine and wait it out (and hope your enemies are hurt more), then there's no scope for skillful play.

Random events are not liked universally by players unless they lean on the positive side and don't influence the game balance too much.
Even a massive event like a NORD INVASION DLC RELEASE DATE ANNOUNCED THIS WEEK would be better off if it introduces Vikings into the game one by one.

Click to expand...

Yeah I see from where you coming from and mod like this (or a button to turn the event off would be a nice solution) would solve it, I think the rewarding thing is that if it goes right the enemy nation could be crippled and you would be able to take over it easily, bigger factions having bigger chance of plague spawning to try to stop them (nothing horrible so it doesen´t stop you from destroying anything), on the other hand those are plagues, they aren´t supposed to be good more like "keep away from them and you won´t die kinda thing", in medieval times it really had an impact and could totall change the course of history, yes this would go much better with more strategy oriented games but neverless.

Other way could be a debuff on your city like production and building time and some of your people would die in your party which wouldn´t be as harsh as my previous thought and wouldn´t need much new things, apart from plague debuff there could be ones for a good harvesting season or a bad one, raiders in the area etc. which would in turn incomporate this mechanic nicely into the game.

But then again I see from where you are coming from and so a debuff that could be turned off would be much more convinient

If you could spin it into interesting plague-fighting gameplay, it might work. Just getting random beatings from a game sucks.
Random events in general suck too, as they encourage save scumming.

The best implementation of random events (from what I've seen) are those of King of Dragon Pass, when there's often an underlying cause for their triggering (which you may strive to prevent if you know the dangers), and then they branch beautifully into follow-up events over time, making save scumming impractical. The outcomes vary too, based on your choices and your situation.
But the important thing is that you can try to do something about it, and the more you know about the game's world, the better are your chances to get a good outcome. And they are used as the prime source of storytelling, which is the main point of the game.

Neat idea, nigh impossible to add in and make it fun at this point.
I personally really like the death plague DLC for ck2, but i know how infuriating it can be for people who dont cheat, mod or keep 89 save slots. Since i do all 3, i dont mind.

Now try and translate that into MB... its really a cool idea, but would it blend? I doubt it.

It sounds like a cool mod idea for people who likes challenge but too annoying for base game.

But i liked the plague idea, is there a game where you fight the plague as a doctor etc?

monoolho said:

Neat idea, nigh impossible to add in and make it fun at this point.
I personally really like the death plague DLC for ck2, but i know how infuriating it can be for people who dont cheat, mod or keep 89 save slots. Since i do all 3, i dont mind.

Now try and translate that into MB... its really a cool idea, but would it blend? I doubt it.

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Exactly what I think, I personally do not hate Rippers Due in CK2, but I can't see how this would add to vanilla BL. A mod might be able to bring it into a full scale fun factor, but if it solely focus on this, then it'll also be kind of boring...

Anyway, I love to read people's ideas, don't ask me why, if the OP decides to bring a team and actually create this mod it could work like Diplomacy for Warband, in which it is sort of used as an OSP and not a mod itself... I can see this working well with mods that try to go for historical accuracy, yeah, it'd do good in a BL version of 1257ad (not 1257 per se, but you know what I mean)

I see these kinds of ideas as something to try to spice up your game after you become somewhat bored with it, so exactly like mods and DLCs.
Ideally, if all kinds of random events are already in the game, you'll have the option to switch them off, enjoy the base game on its non-arbitrary merits and switch random events on when it becomes stale.

Breezy Tee said:

monoolho said:

Neat idea, nigh impossible to add in and make it fun at this point.
I personally really like the death plague DLC for ck2, but i know how infuriating it can be for people who dont cheat, mod or keep 89 save slots. Since i do all 3, i dont mind.

Now try and translate that into MB... its really a cool idea, but would it blend? I doubt it.

Click to expand...

Exactly what I think, I personally do not hate Rippers Due in CK2, but I can't see how this would add to vanilla BL. A mod might be able to bring it into a full scale fun factor, but if it solely focus on this, then it'll also be kind of boring...

Anyway, I love to read people's ideas, don't ask me why, if the OP decides to bring a team and actually create this mod it could work like Diplomacy for Warband, in which it is sort of used as an OSP and not a mod itself... I can see this working well with mods that try to go for historical accuracy, yeah, it'd do good in a BL version of 1257ad (not 1257 per se, but you know what I mean)

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Last I heard, mods we're going to run more like Skyrim, where you can run multiple modules as long as they don't interfere. If that's still the case, a mod such as this could release on its own, and other players could download and install it in conjunction with just about any other mods (assuming of course they don't effect the same parts of the code).

Precisely that! And that is what gives me a little hope

Code:

TM

: like a mod or toggleable DLC, I certainly would love having to fight off hordes of pestilent battanians, and then slowly and agonizingly die while I desperately try to make my heir fit for rule due to my premature death. But as a base game/native/release feature? Pretty much a no. Requires ton of balancing, not mentioning the coding and writing.
So long as DLC and mods are the TURN OFF/ON, anything is quite possible with the game, even if it's not all that fun. So long as you have fun playing it, what's the matter? But forcing people to cope with it... not a good play.

Rodrigo Ribaldo said:

If you could spin it into interesting plague-fighting gameplay, it might work. Just getting random beatings from a game sucks.

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How about a plague that turns those infected into rabid zombies? AI Lord zombie parties who’ve lost factional allegiance attacking and infecting anyone. Economy crashing in zombie villages. Players having to fight mutinies from their own troops who’ve turned into zombies and butcher their own villagers.   

As a twist, the player’s first character could remain in the game as a zombie Lord once infected, forcing the player to switch to his heir and potentially fighting the husk of himself.

NPC99 said:

How about a plague that turns those infected into rabid zombies? AI Lord zombie parties who’ve lost factional allegiance attacking and infecting anyone. Economy crashing in zombie villages. Players having to fight mutinies from their own troops who’ve turned into zombies and butcher their own villagers.   

As a twist, the player’s first character could remain in the game as a zombie Lord once infected, forcing the player to switch to his heir and potentially fighting the husk of himself.

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Well, that's the first DLC basically done.

John C said:

Well, that's the first DLC basically done.

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Certainly would make for a great AAR

No thank you.

Only way I'd be okay with it is during a siege and kept to an absolute minimum for both sides.

Love this idea, because until the 20th century more soldiers died from disease than battle ("He who lives by the sword, dies by the sword", whatever).
Each year, half the soldiers would be dead in the Thirty Years War before the first battle. Admittedly, plague was a big portion of those deaths.

Due to watching my nephew play With Fire and Sword, I know there are at least nutritional diseases in that mod.

Clean water can be provided with ale, wine, coffee, or tea (boiling is part of the manufacturing process), so if your troops get cholera it is your own fault (cholera was not introduced to Europe till after the Middle Ages, but there are other water-borne diseases).
Unit size and diversity would increase outbreak chances. Visits to villages could be bad but not compared to spending the night in a town as your soldiers will be in close proximity to each other as well the population (who cares about morale when everyone is dead). Looting clothing has the potential of typhus from lice. 
Like Hannibal, you can sneak through a swamp to bypass your enemy, but you might find the malaria from the mosquitoes much worse(or you could become blind in one eye like he did).
Your army of trained mercenaries will kill more of your own troops from bringing in diseases your other troops' immune system are not capable of handling than they kill of the enemy.
The warmer the atmosphere, the more chance of sickness, as long your troops remember to not huddle together in the cold.

Disease doesn't need to kill, it could just take someone out of the ranks for that day, or however long the illness last.

+++

For those that want to play doctor during the plague: what are your other options besides dressing like a crow, becoming a flagellant, scapegoating, or prayer?

viocult said:

Love this idea, because until the 20th century more soldiers died from disease than battle ("He who lives by the sword, dies by the sword", whatever).
Each year, half the soldiers would be dead in the Thirty Years War before the first battle. Admittedly, plague was a big portion of those deaths.

Due to watching my nephew play With Fire and Sword, I know there are at least nutritional diseases in that mod.

Clean water can be provided with ale, wine, coffee, or tea (boiling is part of the manufacturing process), so if your troops get cholera it is your own fault (cholera was not introduced to Europe till after the Middle Ages, but there are other water-borne diseases).
Unit size and diversity would increase outbreak chances. Visits to villages could be bad but not compared to spending the night in a town as your soldiers will be in close proximity to each other as well the population (who cares about morale when everyone is dead). Looting clothing has the potential of typhus from lice. 
Like Hannibal, you can sneak through a swamp to bypass your enemy, but you might find the malaria from the mosquitoes much worse(or you could become blind in one eye like he did).
Your army of trained mercenaries will kill more of your own troops from bringing in diseases your other troops' immune system are not capable of handling than they kill of the enemy.
The warmer the atmosphere, the more chance of sickness, as long your troops remember to not huddle together in the cold.

Disease doesn't need to kill, it could just take someone out of the ranks for that day, or however long the illness last.

+++

For those that want to play doctor during the plague: what are your other options besides dressing like a crow, becoming a flagellant, scapegoating, or prayer?

Click to expand...

Forgot to most important part, its not enjoyable to play

Mechanics like this that happen at random are frustrating and are out of players hand. It just causes the game to be less enjoyable

Younes123 said:

Forgot to most important part, its not enjoyable to play

Mechanics like this that happen at random are frustrating and are out of players hand. It just causes the game to be less enjoyable

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+1