Author Topic: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)  (Read 46127 times)

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Tingyun

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2018, 02:03:16 AM »
A question came up on reddit during discussion of the 3.0 release as to why I removed the vanilla VC rules against getting permission for courting ladies outside your faction, here's the reasons:

    NPC lords court outside their faction, and nothing blocks that, which makes it weird to apply that rule to the player.

    Many factions are in fact closely aligned, within religion group. Take laithland. They are in some ways an extension of Danmark and Norway, the various adventuring lords of each kingdom. The anglo saxon kingdoms may also reasonably be seen as pulling together, at least by marriages, into an emerging concept of England.

    Famous marriages currently exist across faction in game. Alfred the Great (brother of Wessex king) has as his wife the daughter of a Mierce Lord (even though the VC's missing family relations means it isn't listed, the tavern keepers still talk about it as a rumor)

    Blocking across faction marriages means the player will often have very few choices. Norway is a good example--the only courtable Norwegion lady is Gyda Ericssdottir, the famed loved of King Harald Fairhair. Best not to restrict the player to courtships that make little sense or they don't want.

« Last Edit: January 24, 2018, 06:52:58 AM by Tingyun »

Tingyun

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2018, 06:44:24 AM »
Discussion of the 3.0 release at Reddit has given rise to a tiny 3.1 update. Reddit user Joaquin823 gets credit for striking the final blow in convincing me to slightly change the default options included in the full install version.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2018, 06:52:02 AM by Tingyun »

Zeqe

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #17 on: January 25, 2018, 01:43:34 AM »
Hey!

Loving the mod so far, great changes. I'm having an issue trying to integrate your mod with Dark Age graphical enhancement mod. I like the gritty darker look of the Dark Age graphics. Can you give me any pointers on how best to accomplish this? All my current attempts result in either weird texture glitches, or buttons in menus ceasing to function.

Any help (from anyone) appreciated!

Tingyun

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2018, 02:58:31 AM »
Hi Zeqe!

I would love to help, but I'm afraid I don't understand the graphics side of Warband modding.

My only thought about something to try is :

1) determine what text files are absolutely essential to the graphics mod, test run a vanilla VC installation to make sure it runs with just the graphics mod installed and only those files without the issues

2) use winmerge to combine that stripped down version with the files from this mod.

But, that could get very complex, depending on how many files it has. And it may not be possible at all. Hopefully someone more knowledgeable chimes in.

Pode

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2018, 03:07:47 AM »
I would start by comparing the 2 mods module.ini files and creating a 3rd that included everything from both. I suspect that will resolve many of the issues related to not loading properly graphical resources.

Tingyun

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2018, 04:16:27 AM »
Great advice Pode, thanks for replying to help him out!

If anyone is interested, we are having a lively debate (around 40 comments so far) about what to do with Berserkers for future versions of Balance Mod, as well as general historical issues surrounding them, over at Reddit. Come join if you are interested!

https://www.reddit.com/r/mountandblade/comments/7sr05g/vc_berserkers/

Tingyun

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #21 on: January 26, 2018, 08:32:20 PM »
After a lively discussion with over 80 comments in the linked reddit discussion, we settled on the following changes to better balance berserking:

- berserking no longer gives a 5% chance of the berserker attacking your own troops. This was not justified by compelling historical reasons and terribly unbalanced, outweighing all the potential positives attached to the berserking mechanic.

- berserking now lasts the entire battle. There is no historical basis for it consisting of only minute long bursts followed by short-term fatigue, and the AI wasn't smart enough about when to start the berserking, often rendering itself exhausted before battle was joined.

- berserking now only provides a speed bonus, no changes to damage or other stats.

- this bonus is only 10% speed for the AI, as berserker units high WP and skills can already reflect the contribution of their berserker rage, since it is now activated for the whole battle. Damage bonuses have too dramatic an effect given how armor reduces damage in Warband.

- for the player, the bonus is 20% speed. This helps an infantry player out, and they could use the boost. It needs to be somewhat high here to balance for the fact that the player only gets 1 trait, and misses out on the others--before berserker was a terrible trait to receive for the player.

There are some further interesting ideas discussed that might be incorporated in the future, but for now, with these changes the player should now actually be able to get some real use out of the berserker trait, and roleplay a berserker if they wish, instead of it being near useless and unused outside of extremely niche, rare circumstances. It will hopefully no longer be disappointing to receive berserker instead of one of the other traits!

Thanks to everyone who contributed to that great discussion--your contributions will all be recognized in the special thanks section when the next version is released.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2018, 10:46:15 PM by Tingyun »

Tingyun

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #22 on: January 29, 2018, 12:41:22 AM »
4.0 posted!

Berserking handled slightly differently than described above after some experimenting with the test version. AI no longer uses mechanic--its berserking is assumed to be fully reflected in high stats. This allows removing some unneeded combat checks, which might help performance a little bit in very large battles, and the mechanic wasn't handled well by the AI before. Now fully a player trait.

The player only berserk mechanic now lasts the entire combat, and gives a +20% speed bonus to the player. It is still weaker than the other traits (for example, strong gives +10% speed to the entire player army), but it may actually be somewhat useful to an infantry player now.

Lots of other little fixes as well. For example, fixed the vanilla VC inconsistent mechanic that had martial reputation pagan lords hating low rep players (they now behave consistently with upstanding pagan lords, in other words they don't care). It should now be possible to run a raider that leads a pagan kingdom without all the martial pagan lords getting upset for no reason. :)

Complete changelog available in first post
« Last Edit: January 29, 2018, 08:21:06 PM by Tingyun »

Zeqe

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #23 on: January 29, 2018, 08:29:28 PM »
Tingyun,

Thanks for all your hard work on this. Is it possible to have a fork maintained that has the "Change Wife Gear through Dialogue" option enabled? I really dislike the terrible dresses and hats that my future wives get saddled with on playthroughs, and it would really be nice to have that option (at least for wives, I know some people were bothered by the temptation to do wives and _all_ lords). Especially given that we already have to cope with the terrible VC female facegens.

Regards,
Zeqe

Tingyun

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #24 on: January 29, 2018, 08:47:17 PM »
Hi Zeqe!

Thanks for your kind words! I am glad you are enjoying the mod.

The option to change lady equipment is restored in 4.0. I just checked the changelog and made sure to note this prominently at the start, as well as add a note to the prior changelog that removed it, thanks for bringing this to my attention.

I realized no one seemed to mind that option specifically, so back in it went.

So you can once again add nicer dresses and remove hats. :)
« Last Edit: January 29, 2018, 09:52:17 PM by Tingyun »

Tingyun

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #25 on: January 30, 2018, 06:53:19 AM »
4.1 posted! As always save compatible.

Berserker player ability buffed to +10% damage, +30% movement speed (does not speed up attacks), and lasts for entire battle.

If this seems strong, remember that the other traits give:
Leadership, +5% damage to entire player army
Tough, +10% movement speed to entire player army
Strong, -5% damage to entire enemy army

Berserker only affects the player and therefore needs to be much stronger in effect. Berserker should now be a balanced trait against the other choices, and a great trait especially for a player who does not fight mounted, and so will benefit from the movement speed.

AI units do not use the same mechanic as of 4.0, and so are unaffected.

Seconis

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #26 on: February 01, 2018, 07:54:41 PM »
Since the source code has been released, do you know how difficult it would be to add the Celtic religion as an option for the player? No Lords or Settlements would have to start with it, but the option to build Celtic temples and convert would be nice.

Also, have you found any references to the mercenary contract permanently screwing up relations with factions?

Tingyun

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #27 on: February 01, 2018, 08:34:36 PM »
Hi Seconis!

Adding another religion would be tough--a lot of game mechanics interact with religion, and are probably written under the assumption that there are only 2. I would guess it would be easier to do a small-scale version of it--add a new quest line to the Druid at the the stones in Wales or something like that. However, a broader implementation is possible too.

Because I am trying to stay faithful to the original overall design of Viking Conquest, and only rebalance some things, it wouldn't fit into my current plans for the mod. Also, I am committed to 100% save compatibility with vanilla saves and older versions.

However, if you wanted to create a submod, and an additional quest line from the Druid is not enough, then you could also decide to replace one of the existing religions, perhaps Christianity. Take the Druid model, sub it in for the bishops in the scenes, make a Druid unit in place of priests, change the dialogue, change the building names, and it would work pretty well I think. Then make the Anglo Saxon settlements and lords the Norse kind of pagan, and confine the Christianity turned Celtic pagan beliefs to Ireland, Scotland, and Wales. Then change the monastery map icons to something more fitting, maybe the standing stones or hofs, and then tie them to different scenes, or just make them additional farms or something.

Then, you would be playing an alternate history where Christianity was never adopted by Rome, and so the old pagan beliefs survived in Britain and were being challenged by the Germanic beliefs of the Anglo Saxons and Norse. You are welcome to use stuff from my mod as a base if you create that fun alternate history mod--I am sure many would find it interesting to play!

As for mercenary contracts, I have not looked into it in detail yet, but it is on the list. It would help if you could provide a step by step account of how it currently behaves, and what specific changes you would suggest (i.e., what currently happens when contract starts, what you think should happen instead, what happens when contract renews, what you want to happen, what happens when you end contract, what you want to happen).

I like to get as much discussion and input from multiple users before making changes, so you posting your ideas could help get that discussion started. In the past those discussions have usually been at reddit, but that is just coincidental and discussion here is most welcome.

EDIT: you might also try out the new Age of Arthur mod: http://www.moddb.com/mods/age-of-arthur

It uses a lot of Viking Conquest and Brytenwalda features, but is set even before Brytenwalda, when the Celtic religion was still going strong (I think there are celtic religious quest lines and locations within it).

The modder seems to be doing amazing work--tons of beautiful scenes, new troops, etc--and it looks very exciting!
« Last Edit: February 02, 2018, 07:00:56 AM by Tingyun »

Tingyun

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #28 on: February 03, 2018, 02:11:09 AM »
If anyone is unhappy with their trait assignment on their character, I wrote a quick optional file to cycle through traits every hour (ie, it will go berserker--->leadership/inspiring----->strong----->tough---->berserker, going one step per hour, as long as you are walking around on worldmap. It also gives you a trait if you don't have one, if you want that).

The file is up for download under optional files here: https://www.nexusmods.com/mountandbladevikingconquest/mods/5

Obviously, once you have the trait you like, you should save, quit, and restore the original files (either from backups, or just copy VC Balance Mod 4.1 back over into your Viking Conquest folder)

Tested and works fine.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 02:20:13 AM by Tingyun »

Seconis

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Re: [VC][S] VC Balance Mod (saved game compatible)
« Reply #29 on: February 03, 2018, 05:13:10 PM »
Posting this over from the reddit thread and answering your question

Issue: When a mercenary contract expires, there seems to be a chance that your relations with the factions you were at war with aren't normalized.

Example: I have 0 relations with East Engle. I sign a mercenary contract with Mierce, who are at war with East Engle. My relations with East Engle drop to -40 (or some other negative integer), due to this war. I fight East Engle as my contract requires and my relations with East Engle further deteriorate. After my contract expires, my relations with East Engle go to -5 (or some other negative integer, always equal to or less than what it was the moment before my contract expired).

The main issue is that sometimes the relations with the enemy faction go to 0 after the contract and sometimes they don't and I haven't been able to figure out what causes this discrepancy. I play a lot of PoP, where I've never noticed this issue, but this is the only 'core' Warband module I've played.

A few quick notes. I never raid villages when I'm a mercenary, so this isn't the issue. Sometimes I attack caravans of the enemy faction when I'm under contract, but sometimes I don't; this action doesn't seem to affect it one way or the other.

How I think it should work:

Contract Signed: Working as intended - relation drops with the factions your employer is at war with.

Contract Renewed: Relation boost with currently employed faction

Contract Expired: All negative faction changes with factions you were at war with are undone.