Author Topic: [SP][Submod] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released) -DEAD for now-  (Read 18450 times)

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DrunkenFrenchman

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (test version released)
« Reply #30 on: March 23, 2016, 03:59:12 PM »
Sounds good. Btw, is there a way to recruit sea bandits that I missed? Party isn't strong enough yet to go clear out the ruins or Odin's cave so haven't checked that out yet.

Btw^2, I posted a question regarding you and Kalahrans tweak tool but I think neither of you saw it because he answered the following post without chiding me as he usually does :P Anyway, would appreciate if you could take a quick look.

kalarhan

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (test version released)
« Reply #31 on: March 23, 2016, 04:05:34 PM »

DrunkenFrenchman

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (test version released)
« Reply #32 on: March 23, 2016, 04:22:00 PM »
Haha new travels fast I see ^^

Hey Kragg I just had an idea (inspired by the Saxon Tales for which I need to thank this forum).

So Haestan and other Viking jarls use the lure of silver to attract crews to them in order to raise an army.

What if, similar to being a marshal, you added a convo with your followers which called upon all your outlaws to join you. (Even if you are a sworn noble). That would cost imfamy and the troopd which answered would come depending on how much cash you have (the more cash, renown and infamy, the more men show up and for longer) allowing you raise short lived but huge armies to plunder land. They eventually disperse making it difficult to hold any land (can't garrrison them) but could make a really cool dynamic.

Its ambitious but I'm excited just to think about it. Something like golf and renown = how many show up (Long term reputation as warrior will attract crews) Infamy = how long they stay (Short term success defines whether they stay or now. If you lose, your men will desert you while if you win, they will stay.)

kraggrim

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (test version released)
« Reply #33 on: March 23, 2016, 05:17:43 PM »
Sounds good. Btw, is there a way to recruit sea bandits that I missed? Party isn't strong enough yet to go clear out the ruins or Odin's cave so haven't checked that out yet.

Thanks for reminding me, I need to add the tweak for recruiting sea-vikings.

Haha new travels fast I see ^^

Hey Kragg I just had an idea (inspired by the Saxon Tales for which I need to thank this forum).

So Haestan and other Viking jarls use the lure of silver to attract crews to them in order to raise an army.

What if, similar to being a marshal, you added a convo with your followers which called upon all your outlaws to join you. (Even if you are a sworn noble). That would cost imfamy and the troopd which answered would come depending on how much cash you have (the more cash, renown and infamy, the more men show up and for longer) allowing you raise short lived but huge armies to plunder land. They eventually disperse making it difficult to hold any land (can't garrrison them) but could make a really cool dynamic.

Its ambitious but I'm excited just to think about it. Something like golf and renown = how many show up (Long term reputation as warrior will attract crews) Infamy = how long they stay (Short term success defines whether they stay or now. If you lose, your men will desert you while if you win, they will stay.)

Do you mean like a marshal gathering the lords, so all the created parties would converge on you for a time? I'd think that would be possible. Some sort of bandit horde mechanic.

DrunkenFrenchman

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (test version released)
« Reply #34 on: March 23, 2016, 06:18:10 PM »
That's exactly what I mean. A bandit horde which could then lead large a scale raids but without the ability to use the horde to garrison. (To balance the potential huge mass of soldiers you could lead)

kraggrim

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released)
« Reply #35 on: March 24, 2016, 03:19:07 AM »
Here's the second test version (24/03/16) for download:
http://www7.zippyshare.com/v/EmPYdRVl/file.html

Copy your VC 2.023beta module folder, rename it and overwrite with these files. If you're not using this version it might still work, I'm unsure.

Try:
Raid villages/caravans/monasteries to earn 'infamy' then spend it recruiting bandits from lairs.
Engaging the Pictish raiders (should be near Farmland special location).
Clearing then revisiting Odin's Cave.
Releasing a caravan master to reveal other nearby caravans (requires 2 infamy) using the dialog option.
Create bandit parties from owned lairs (bring you money and prisoners). Pay to upgrade their party size.
Have these parties follow you using infamy.
Ship-stealing mission.

Changelog
Ship-stealing mission implemented (no restrictions for now).
Created parties can be ordered to follow you.
Ship bandit parties now recruitable.
Opcode errors when your bandits fight fixed.
Created bandits now have ships icons when on water.
Lair bandit recruit cost halved
Bandit merchant money halved
No more relation loss from talking to your created bandit parties.

Bugs/notes
-Requires starting a new game.
-All lairs are visible from the start for testing purposes.
-Pay no wages for troops stored at lairs.
-Ship stealing can be done multiple times.

DrunkenFrenchman

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released)
« Reply #36 on: March 24, 2016, 05:50:19 PM »
Also, I would recommend making the elite vikings both cheaper, lower level and with weaker weapon proficiency for balance. Its quite easy to recruit now (Guaranteed offer from lair) so they need to be nerfed a bit so that the elite troops from other factions can compete. I would put them on a similar level to norse elite spearmen with slightly higher wage (their bandits not sworn men) so that the best troops remain the household troops available to lords.

Ty for everything :)

PS: could you release the python modules or let me know which txt files aren't altered so I can use your tweaker with this?

EDIT: You mentioned earlier that infamy was lost by doing 'legit' actions. Does that include being a mercenary?
« Last Edit: March 24, 2016, 05:53:20 PM by DrunkenFrenchman »

kraggrim

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released)
« Reply #37 on: March 24, 2016, 07:39:43 PM »
I was planning to rework the vikings into a more progressive troop-tree at some point, but it's a low priority I'm afraid. Should probably also give a chance of recruiting lesser vikings/bandits, or restrict the elite ones. I think I know how to do that.

I can't really release the ms until the devs do a proper release of it (what I'm using is just a preview), if I'm interpreting what I've been told right. And most of the files will be changed so you can't easily swap the text files from the other system in. I think just items, skills, quests and factions are untouched. And even then it might not be safe.
You might be able to adapt some of the text tweaks though with some concentration, especially if you use kalarhan's tweaks ms as a reference. But tbh I wouldn't get too invested in any campaign for this mod yet, until I get closer to a final version I won't be bothering to make updates compatible with previous version saves. Just adds a lot more hassle to the development process.

I mentioned that 'legit actions decreasing infamy' thing in the first post, but it's a planned feature (black text not green).  So you're fine to be a merc for now. I'd probably still let the player be a merc anyway, let me know how it plays out in practice.

And cheers for doing this testing :).

DrunkenFrenchman

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released)
« Reply #38 on: March 24, 2016, 08:28:18 PM »
Quote
And cheers for doing this testing :).

You're kidding right? Its only fair given what you've given this community that we help you out.. by playing more awesome features that you're putting in place. Makes me feel useful on this forum for once  :mrgreen:

And sorry should have checked.

Yeah I think merc should be allowed. Its in line with the historical context where bandits and mercenaries were often one and the same depending on the tides of war

In terms of working on a viking troop tree, I can give it a shot with the troop editor tool and try my first dabble into modding VC. see if that works. Don't know how to change recruitment but I'll start with trying to implement a viking troop tree and re-balancing those troops.

SUGGESTION: When you have caused huge damage to a certain faction, have a messenger from that faction offer gold in exchange for peace/become merc for opposite side. (Similar to how Wessex paid the Vikings to leave instead of killing them)

Let me know btw if you're welcoming suggestions. I keep throwing them at you without knowing if you want any :P
« Last Edit: March 24, 2016, 08:35:01 PM by DrunkenFrenchman »

Petro Buleka

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released)
« Reply #39 on: March 24, 2016, 09:02:29 PM »
I am happy to be able to test your mode, kraggrim. This is what I dreamed of :party:. I stole a ship from slavers the name Brujoloco :D

kraggrim

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Re: [SP] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released)
« Reply #40 on: March 24, 2016, 10:45:40 PM »
@DrunkenFrenchman Yep keep the suggestions coming, there's limits to what I can implement but there's no harm in hearing them :).

@Petro Yeah :D, my first modding was helping out with his repolished mod, so a little reference to that.




Changes for next version (not uploaded yet):
-Added visiting mercs to lairs.
--Includes cantabrians and asturians.
--Looter mercs with randomised equipment (cheap but variable, I love these guys).
-Lair recruiters usually give lower-tier troops now, chance of higher tier guys.
-You lose relation with a faction when your created bandits attack them.
-Tweaked ship-stealing mission, now toggle ship between sailing/landing mode.
--Can use this to have your men bring it back if you fall off in the escape.
-Integrated my extra painted Pictish armours.
(click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: April 02, 2016, 11:00:27 PM by kraggrim »

Sir Mordred

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Re: [SP][Submod] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released)
« Reply #41 on: April 06, 2016, 12:55:48 AM »
I'm really enjoying this; it opens up a whole new facet of the game.
I do have a couple of suggestions: first would be allowing the player to decide if they want to keep and own a bandit lair after conquering it or if they want to temporarily destroy it like normal. If, for example, someone wanted to become a Northumbrian lord they could destroy the bandit lairs around Northumbria (and increase relations with a lord for destroy bandit lari quests) like normal but still own lairs and support bandits that are operating against neighboring factions.
Secondly would be to have some limits or prerequisites on owning bandit lairs. Maybe the player can control one bandit lair for every point of leadership and one for every 100 renown; just some mechanism to prevent a player from starting the game by going around and capturing/owning every bandit lair before reaching level 3.
"Observe that noses were made to wear spectacles; and so we have spectacles. Legs were visibly instituted to be breeched, and we have breeches" Voltaire�s Candide

kraggrim

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Re: [SP][Submod] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released)
« Reply #42 on: April 06, 2016, 05:45:40 PM »
Good suggestions, thank you. I may eventually rework the system to have some sort of tax efficiency equivalent, but a simpler restriction system is probably best for now.

Sorenerv

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Re: [SP][Submod] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released)
« Reply #43 on: April 15, 2016, 05:57:04 PM »
I'm really enjoying this; it opens up a whole new facet of the game.
I do have a couple of suggestions: first would be allowing the player to decide if they want to keep and own a bandit lair after conquering it or if they want to temporarily destroy it like normal. If, for example, someone wanted to become a Northumbrian lord they could destroy the bandit lairs around Northumbria (and increase relations with a lord for destroy bandit lari quests) like normal but still own lairs and support bandits that are operating against neighboring factions.
Secondly would be to have some limits or prerequisites on owning bandit lairs. Maybe the player can control one bandit lair for every point of leadership and one for every 100 renown; just some mechanism to prevent a player from starting the game by going around and capturing/owning every bandit lair before reaching level 3.

Hey this is a really neat concept, nice work! Looks awesome.

I wanted to comment that after reading what Sir Mordred said, sounds like this could be OP at taking down other nations. Perhaps maybe a limit to the number of bandit parties you can have, so that one cannot swamp a faction with bandits and then move in for the kill with their kingdom troops. idk just a thought

I really want to try this soon as it sounds fun, just been nose deep in my own little project

Cheers

SubZeroCro

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Re: [SP][Submod] Outlaws Expanded (second test version released)
« Reply #44 on: April 16, 2016, 11:12:59 AM »
Will this work combined with sword and shield?