Eternal said:
Zaffa said:
Let's be realistic here though. Even in a chosen system you aren't going to win just by being good at 1-2 maps. With the way Warband functions and the way its maps are designed, the ability to play well on one map type (closed/mixed/open) generally allows you to play well on the equivalent map type. Though there are exceptions to this, it is highly unlikely that you are going to dominate on one map only and get **** on all the rest.
You can. If you choose first, you literally have to be good at 2 maps. Do you not comprehend how this is a problem? Yes, if you're really good at 2 maps you don't necessarily have to be bad at the rest, but the point stands that all a team has to practice is two maps. Now, you actually have to get off your ass and practice the preset maps. God forbid.
Dont understand your 2 map argument at all, in part because i don't know whathe is talking about. Unless you are assuming everything resulting in an 8-0, 8-0 tie and third map always going to whoever picked first, you aren't going to see a situation where a team only has to practice two maps to win.
The problem with the NA scene now isn't that a clan can be good at 10% of maps and not play the other 90% (not going to happen anyways). The problem is that a clan can be good at 90% of maps and be forced to play against a good team on the 10% of maps they suck at. This is an incredibly silly way for teams to lose high end matches which is why many other competitive games offer some type of "ban/block" system to avoid these scenarios from occuring.
Additionally, I cant even think of an example where a team won a tournament by only playing 1-2 maps very well. BkS did really well in old tournaments because they would pick random plains twice, but this problem was not the result of them only being good at one map, but because everyone else sucked **** at it and they were able to pick same map twice. By preventing them from picking the same map twice (which has since been done) or allowing teams to block their choice, this could have easily been avoidable. That being said, even in this circumstance, BkS still beat most teams on their own maps with GK being one of the only teams to actually beat them on a map. Point is, I can't think of a single situation where your 2 map scenario is anything other than a strawman scenario.
Eternal said:
The problem that I am pointing towards is when you have teams of equal callabre playing each other on a map where one team is very familiar and the other isn't at all. While you have teams that may be amazing at most closed maps, they may absolutely suck at village. This can lead to a very lame situation where a team loses because they were forced to play the one map that the other team could stomp them at. The preset map system is completely chance based, and while teams have an opportunity to plan in advance, the lack of control is unsatisfying.
The other team could, you know, practice Village? Especially since preset maps are known in advance? If we go with your logic from your first point, then being good at one map in Closed means you should be pretty good at all of them, right? You're starting to contradict yourself.
You seem to be becoming rather attached to those logic jumps. As I explained before, while most maps of the same category overlap (nord town vs vendetta for example), there are exceptions to the rule (such as village) or maps where people are just uncomfortable/unfamiliar against a particular design element. In cases such as this, it is silly that a team that can beat you on 95% of maps beat you because you got the one map you sucked at (talking in hyperbole to make the point). As to the premise that you should practice every map until you are perfect at them all, it is simply unrealistic and harmful to the NA community. It is not feasible for clans to effectively practice every single map such that they play ALL of them at a comparable level of proficiency, and unless you want to further limit the number of clans that have a chance of effectively competing, you will take this reality into account.
Whatever system the NA community decides to use needs to account for the number of clans that can realistically compete with different rulesets and what will be most fun. Completely taking away people's ability to pick maps is not in the right direction and actually magnifies various problems. The better approach is to allow a choice based system where clans are given the narrowly tailored ability to prevent particular maps from being played that would unfairly represent their playing ability. Promoting map diversity is also an important goal to shoot for.
