Author Topic: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012  (Read 11964 times)

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FrankElliott

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Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« on: July 02, 2012, 10:04:20 AM »
Alright so with the likely shift to a new ruleset, involving a different categorisation system for maps (open, closed and mixed), there's potentially room to add some new maps and it might be time to think about scrapping some old ones in any case. As with before, final decisions will be made by a select few people (hopefully the same few) in a meeting that I'll run. Now dow to bizniz.

If you have a new map to sumbit for the ENL, here is the place to do it. I know that IG_Battlegrounds and The_Beehive have been playing around with some custom maps already which gives us a great headstart, so thanks to them. However, I would request that the map is resubmitted here following the specific rules and guidelines I set.

Also, feel free to use this place to remark on existing maps and map submissions. Positive and negative thoughts are welcome, just keep things respectful.

Creating a map fit for the ENL:
  • Ensure a reasonable level of balance. Symmetry is not essential and infact may be rather boring. Just make sure there are enough options for both teams, to ensure competitive play. A map with imbalances like Port Assault or Village should be avoided.
  • Modifications (including but not limited to alternate spawn points) to Native maps will be considered. However, try to make sure that the modifications you make give a very different feel to the map.
  • See this guide for information about spawn points: http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,89831.0.html . Try to include as many of those as possible, to make the map viable on all game modes. Obviously, the essential ones are battle and master of the field entry points.
  • Use only Native scene props. That should be clear but these maps must be Native compatible.
  • No ugly **** or weird use of scene props. This is a little vague but I don't want to see props stretched out halfway across the map or a bunch of tables put together to make a hut (just random examples). The maps should have good aesthetics.
  • No excess detail. This ties in with the last point but I don't want to see a market place with 100 apples on each stall or anything like that. Keep performance in mind and try to find a balance.
  • Don't include credits or plugs. Don't spell out your name with scene props. This isn't appropriate.
  • Try to make your map clearly open, mixed or closed. To fit in with the ENL rules, the distinction here is quite important. Don't have a castle interior next to a massive field.
  • On that note, no castle interiors. I don't think they're suitable for competitive play.
  • Think about what ought to be possible on your maps. Test for "glitches" yourself and place "barriers" appropriately. Although, by the same token, don't just put invisible walls in places that look like they could or should be accessible. Try to plan for these things and create your map to limit issues like this.
  • Try to keep them interesting. The maps don't need to be works of art but as Alex said, preferably avoid making a bunch of "Ruins" clones.
  • Avoid a clear, direct line of vision between spawns. The only map, in the ENL, that has this is "Ruins". It's not the end of the world but it reveals information about opposition classes and allows for missiles to be directly exchanged.
  • Don't make them too big. This is a common mistake.
  • Try not to include Flora as an essential feature. There are ways to remove it visually and it's best to avoid allowing cheaters, who would do such things, too much of an advantage. The same applies for piles of hay. Either avoid using them or place them lower, so that people can't "Hay Shark".
  • Don't bother with an AI mesh. Infact, it's better not to include one.
  • Don't use giant cliffs to signal the edge of your map. Be more inventive and create something that's believable. See Native maps for reference and how to handle the edge of maps.


Submitting a map for the ENL:
  • The fist thing to say is: Don't just submit whatever you end up making. Take a look at your map and if you don't like it, make another. It would be nice to have a decent amount of maps for consideration but please don't spam a heapshit of maps and expect me to just pick the best one for you.
  • The deadline for custom map submissions is 09/07/2012.
  • Each submission should include (I won't write a template):
    • The SceneObj file, hosted on any hosting site where it can be downloaded for free.
    • The Terrain Code and "outer terrain" used. If you don't know what this is... you shouldn't be submitting a map.
    • Multiple screenshots of the map (the more the better). Certainly one aerial view, with annotations pointing out spawns and flag points would be ideal. Any more screenshots will help, along with indications of where they are. A video flythrough, in addition, would be even better.
    • A written description of the map. It's up to you, how much to write. Make sure you're informative and write a fair amount but there's no point waffling or endlessly repeating yourself. Tactical analysis, for each spawn, as well as indication about which factions might do well/badly would be of value. Obviously there's no way to know this for sure, so don't worry too much about being accurate. Just try to give it some thought.
    • Any problems you think that it might have. Be honest here. We're trying to get some new maps for the community, so there's no sense in concealing what might be a terrible flaw in the map design.
  • Any submissions I like the look of will be put in the OP. Once the deadline is up, we can have some discussions and pick the best to be selected for possible use in the next cycle. At this point, I'll try to get them added to major public servers and I'll add them to ENL servers, so that teams can play practice scrims with them.
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crazyboy11

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2012, 01:02:41 PM »
Can we include Desert Town (a.k.a. de_dust2) please? It has great competitive credentials, would only need a couple of tweaks (imo) to make it suitable.

Maynd

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2012, 02:12:25 PM »


Code: [Select]
scn_multi_scene_4 multi_scene_4 256 none none 0.000000 0.000000 100.000000 100.000000 -100.000000 0x000000003165588c0004c92d0000538c000052de000043b4
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Download: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/14855035/Newvillage/fixed%20map/Shariz_Village.sco



Images

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Map points

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First of all, I would like to show my appreciation to all those that in the last months helped me to improve this map. A special thanks to my clan lads in Wolfpack, that saw this map grow up since day one. To the Guard of Istiniar for hosting it on their server and giving me a great feedback, to Court of Reveran for the match they played against Wolfpack on this map, it was a great test. To AE and the Beehive for hosting and testing it, and last but not least, Azan, for all those hours he spent analyzing this map and giving me opinions and ideas, without him this map would be much different.

The concept
Everyone loves Village and its seems to have a formula that works, so I tough it would be a good idea to reproduce that formula into a new scenario, it is a mix between the SP town Shariz and the MP map Village.
This is a closed map, mainly focused on melee, but archers and cavalry still have a huge rule and impact.
The attackers have 3 entrance, main,side and back, the defenders have 2 exits, main and side. The map provides a wide range of movements and strats since you have 4 streets you can cover/hide/defend/attack and the flags are relativity close3 to each other in order to provide a fair change to both team to fight for it.

Problems
Wolfpack and CoR had a clan match on this map and it ended 5-4(1 draw), the attackers won 9-0, meaning that defending was hard, that has been fixed in this version, still not tested.

Chagelog until this version

  • Removed the access to the roofs and fixed major glitches
  • Removed the big siege ladder on front gate, in order to have a better balance between attackers and defenders
  • Moved the back ladder to a better position, giving more alternatives to the attackers
  • Removed two side streets, many people complained about the map being hard to understand, almost like a maze, this should also fix the ranged/ninja paradise that the map was
  • Removed a huge amount on grass and bushes due to FSP drop reports
  • There's more space in front on the main gate tower, also moved a MOTF to a better position
  • The Town its now composed of four streets, two main streets coming from the deference spawn, and two side streets
« Last Edit: July 02, 2012, 02:19:45 PM by Maynd »

Lord Rich

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2012, 03:35:22 PM »
Verloren - Closed



Download: http://www.mediafire.com/?tvagu1bfpa4g4uw

Terrain Code: Uses Default
Code: [Select]
scn_multi_scene_custom_2 multi_scene_custom_2 256 none none 0.000000 0.000000 100.000000 100.000000 -100.000000 0x00000001300389800003a4ea000058340000637a0000399b
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Description
Verloren is a closed map aimed at getting a good class balance and supporting active offensive play as well as defensive. Neither team starts with very good defensive positions so as to avoid the situation we get on Nord Town (both teams starting with nice positions so no one moves). The only position which could be considered strong defensively is the tower in the centre, however this can be reached at almost exactly the same time by either team so can be contested (and has 3 entrances allowing for it to be attacked even after it is taken). The central tower is also relatively useless for controlling flags as it only has partial far away views of two of the flags, it is however useful for controlling the central area of the map.

One point of interest is the tunnels, these allow the teams to get round the back of each other without being easily spotted and also connect through to the central tower.

The flags are arranged so that they are roughly equidistant from each other, the defenders start closer to two of them and the attackers start on top of the third one. However the map isn't really so much a defender/attacker scenario like Village or Port Assault and both teams should be relatively even in their options and tactical positions.

The flags are located at the attackers spawn, the market and another open area nearby the defenders spawn. Each flag location offers some cover for rangers however except for the latter flag none of the cover is on raised inaccessible areas. The flags are also located in the open allowing cavalry to engage and be useful. On that same note pretty much the whole map is cav friendly and cavalry can get everywhere except the top of the central tower. The streets are wide and the majority of detail objects or obstacles are tucked into the sides. Given the map is also mostly flat this also helps cavalry. The map has also been extensively tested so the vast majority of glitch spots or bugs should already have been removed.

Screenshots
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Dry Valley - Open



Download: http://www.mediafire.com/?zb9kqeqcg6971gv

Terrain Code:
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scn_multi_scene_custom_17 multi_scene_custom_17 256 none none 0.000000 0.000000 100.000000 100.000000 -100.000000 0x0000000450000500000591660000431900001af3000077e3
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Description
Dry Valley is an unbalanced open map favouring the defender for position. All three flags are closer to the defender however they will have to spread themselves out considerably to hold them all. The map contains a neutral tower similar to Verloren which in this case gives a good firing position for two of the flags. However there are plenty of places for the other team to go to surround the tower and make it a bit of a death trap, so while it will be a dominant position the round won't exactly be over once it is taken.

The attackers have the option of bypassing the tower and the open area around it by moving through the town. This puts them in a good position for moving onto the defenders spawn area or for holding the hill and central flags.

The map is littered with strong defensive positions for infantry or rangers however these are separated by open expanses. Teams will have to push to hold the positions they want but also be able to use cavalry effectively while their opponent is in the open or out of position.

This map has been played on IG for a fair amount of time and seemed relatively balanced, crossbow factions have the advantage around the cover or in the tower however archer factions do better at the low walls or in the open generally. Cavalry are obviously important but they cannot be completely dominant due to the various strong points and the fact that the flags are located on rock formations or the hill, which make it more difficult for cavalry.

Screenshots
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« Last Edit: July 13, 2012, 06:14:18 PM by Lord Rich »

Alex_C

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2012, 04:22:14 PM »
Azan's asked me to post this for him since he's not able to, but 'Verloren' is apparently supposed to be called 'Rat Market'.

Shemaforash

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2012, 04:55:51 PM »
Azan's asked me to post this for him since he's not able to, but 'Verloren' is apparently supposed to be called 'Rat Market'.

I can confirm.

Folms

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2012, 05:44:10 PM »
Very nice maps there.

Morii

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2012, 11:38:28 PM »
Azan's asked me to post this for him since he's not able to, but 'Verloren' is apparently supposed to be called 'Rat Market'.

I can confirm.

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TurambarMakart

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #8 on: July 03, 2012, 12:55:24 AM »
Turambar Market you mean right ?

: D

Lord_David

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #9 on: July 03, 2012, 10:32:08 AM »
Turambar is just a byword for rat, so i guess so
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TurambarMakart

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #10 on: July 03, 2012, 11:12:09 AM »
Turambar is just a byword for rat, so i guess so

D:

Vivar

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2012, 11:51:47 PM »
Ouh no, saw that too late. Just got endless siege and a few unbalanced battle maps.....maybe I´ll rebalance a few of them, gonna be hard cuz im sick atm, but I´ll try.

Arch3r

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #12 on: July 04, 2012, 03:20:48 PM »
Snowy Village 2.0

I've never really liked the Native Snowy Village because of various reasons:
- I found the gameplay to be not so fun: cavalry and archer spam, bunkering up on the mountains and spending one minute to reach each other if a team does choose to charge.
- It's an ugly map, it's named 'Village' but it looks more like randomly placed houses and the environment is just dull.
- One of the master of the field flags is on the mountain and for some reason it seems to spawn there 75% of the time. It's just an ill placed MotF really.
- The little hill that's just waaay to speed and buggy as hell. Also looks weird.

So here's my attempt at a remake, hopefully I'm not the only one who hates Snowy Village (I don't believe I am) and people would actually like to test this map as a replacement for Snowy Village.
I took the key elements of Snowy Village by still having a mountain on one side and houses (with some trenches, fences, terrain elevation that that kind of stuff behind them) on the other side. In the middle it's mostly open and both teams spawn behind a small hill. From the small hill they can go behind the houses or get on the mountain. Both have near equal distances and a safe walk to either team. Also, the barn is still there because barn camping in public servers when you're in the losing team can be incredibly fun. I wouldn't dare to remove such a key feature.

Anyways, screenshots:
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This map works for the gamemodes originally supported by Snowy Village: Battle, Fight n Destroy, CTF, DM, TDM, Duel.

Terrain Code:
Code: [Select]
scn_multi_scene_9 multi_scene_9 256 none none 0.000000 0.000000 100.000000 100.000000 -100.000000 0x00000000400032320003c0f300001f9e000011180000031c
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Download link:
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12128647/Snowy_Village_remake.rar
http://www.gamefront.com/files/21878642/Snowy_Village_remake.rar

Do note: The ENL team might or might not choose to use this map in the next ENL, it's not certain yet but it could depend on positive comments from you.
                                                                                           

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HaraldGG

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #13 on: July 07, 2012, 05:09:24 PM »
Fort in the Mountains-Open


Download:http://www.mediafire.com/?w1e2i97f9rl9am1
Code: [Select]
scn_multi_scene_custom_2 multi_scene_custom_2 256 none none 0.000000 0.000000 100.000000 100.000000 -100.000000 0x00000001300389800003a4ea000058340000637a0000399b
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Short description:
"Fort in the mountains" is an open map. Team1 spawns in a small Village, Team2 at the gates of a castle, which isn´t accessible.
Flag can spawn in a forest, in the middle of the map and at a lake. Spawncamping isn´t usefull for both teams.
Overview:
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Spawn1:
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Spawn2:
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Flag1:
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Flag2:
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Flag3:
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screenshots:
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The map is suitable for Battle, CTF, TDM
« Last Edit: July 09, 2012, 04:40:48 PM by Siggi123 »
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Lord Rich

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Re: Maps | Let's mix it up - Deadline: 09/07/2012
« Reply #14 on: July 07, 2012, 08:08:53 PM »
@Siggi, the map has a couple of problems that I think you might want to address.

First and most importantly the team 1 spawn doesn't work (you end up spawning in the middle of the map), you only have entry points 1-31 in there, you need to create an entry point and renumber it to 0 to act as the team 1 battle spawn.

The next point is here, you have transparent terrain:

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This path looks really bumpy and could do with being smoothed down.

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Most of the ruin meshes are accessible to both infantry and cavalry, not sure whether you really want that but if you do want some vertical gameplay going on I might suggest replacing one of the ruined pieces with one that has an accessible upstairs.

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You have a pool of water here that allows you to be fully submerged even when mounted, you should probably make it shallower as Warbands modelling of water is really bad, if you want deep water in a map you should always have it be inaccessible in my opinion because otherwise you get people standing around underwater and not drowning.

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Finally and this is an entirely aesthetic and subjective point but I am not keen on the mixing of styles, you seem to have wood based buildings sat right next to stone ones and in general it ends up feeling a bit cluttered. I might suggest simply removing many of the objects from it and cleaning it up a bit.

This tower is especially strange, just sitting there on its own next to a palisade wall.

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