The wedge formation was for...?

[13 Spider Bloody Chain]

Ok, so in the Total War series, charging in a wedge formation seems to give a charge bonus to charging troops (especially cavalry).

That wasn't the point of the wedge IRL though, was it? If so, what was the wedge formation really used for?

[nonrumpali]

In a Medieval : Total War tutorial you have your royal knights ordered in to a wedge and charge the enemy. The tutorial narrator says something along the lines "This will effectively divide the enemy unit from the middle and cause disorder in it." So, in the Total War games you we're supposed to use the wedge to effectively divide enemy units or something like that. Never really worked for me that good so I just staid away from that formation all together.
I don't really know either if that is the case in history. Just a little tidbit, I remember from that tutorial.

[James]

That's what the vikings used it for. It was called a boar's snout, and was used to break a shield wall.

[13 Spider Bloody Chain]

How did it do that? Did making a wedge concentrate the force of the charge into one point?

I can't imagine that happening, though, unless what works for metal works for people too...

[Archonsod]

Kind of. Rather than a more traditional charge where you push against the line, the wedge means you're pushing against only part of the line. The idea is to move through whoever is in your way out of it so you can reform in their rear.
 If you were lucky, the unit you hit would break formation to engage the long sides of the wedge, allowing you to simply gallop off. In the case of infantry, you'd stand and fight having split the unit. It means your men end up surrounded, but the foe on each side tend to lose the advantage of multiple ranks and formation.

[Valus]

The wedge formation is a purely offensive one and should only be carried out by cavalry who kan break through units outweighing their own in number by using the shear power and speed, infantry trying the same has to be real shock troops since if you cant break through immediatly you risk being destroyed as the enemy can quite easily trap and surround you..
Thus it is not a formation that suits infantry imo and should only be used by cavalry who are in a tight spot and needs to fight their way through loads of soldiers, since if you loose momentum while charging in this way you will have a hard time trying to form into a defensive formation..

[Aqtai]

Alexander the Great's Macedonian cavalry are also supposed to have used wedge formations when charging the enemy.

[rider]

I'd consider wedge a more infantry formation. It is easier to reform and they need the momentum more... the wedge gave large advantages and when one was used against another, the sides bashed away at each other...

[Valus]

Hovewer infantry would imo be harder to reorganise into a defensive formation if attacking using the "wedge" as most lacked "proper" training and officers with the Romans being one of the few exceptions...
Cavalry could fight their way through and reorganise some distance away while the slower infantry often would have had to face various skirmishers or light cavalry attacking their rear and flanks..

[Allegro]

I havent seen it work in TW games, except getting your general killed right away

[Merlkir]

Here's a video of a viking wedge in action. They sure divided the line. Got killed, because there was too few of the vikings and the wedge didn't hold together (I think.)

http://youtube.com/watch?v=b2gnxAd-_e0&mode=related&search=

[Valus]

Yes but the vikings faced mostly locally raised troops such as millitia or levy's who for the most time couldnt match the skill and agressivness of their opponents, had they fought more disciplined and well equipped men then it would probably not have been so sucessful..
If the first charge suceeds well then it is for the most part over as those attacked will most likely turn and run when their formation is torn apart, hovewer if the charge fails and the line holds then it is the agressors who will have to either withdraw or try and hold their enemy back which would most likely result in heavy casualties as it is not easy to shift between an offensive formation and a defensive one in the middle of combat..

[Archonsod]

Yes but the vikings faced mostly locally raised troops such as millitia or levy's who for the most time couldnt match the skill and agressivness of their opponents,

Not when deploying the wedge, they mostly used it in full scale battles, which rather necessitated facing what passed for standing armies of the time. Most peasants and levy's turned tail when they saw the dragonships cross the horizon, let alone when the occupants disembarked.

If the first charge suceeds well then it is for the most part over as those attacked will most likely turn and run when their formation is torn apart, hovewer if the charge fails and the line holds then it is the agressors who will have to either withdraw or try and hold their enemy back which would most likely result in heavy casualties as it is not easy to shift between an offensive formation and a defensive one in the middle of combat..

There's not really such a thing as an offensive and defensive formation. The wedge itself has no difficulty - either you charge through, split the unit and commence the clobbering, or you fail to push through the unit and the 'wings' move forwards to form a line. The real risk of a wedge isn't the guys you're charging, it's the guys you aren't. You lack the ranks to withstand a cavalry charge, anyone hitting the flank or rear can take advantage of your lack of ranks to push you around. You're a lovely tight formation for bowmen to aim at, and any artillery hitting you at the front is likely to have a similar effect as a 10 pin bowling ball.

[Valus]

There's not really such a thing as an offensive and defensive formation. The wedge itself has no difficulty - either you charge through, split the unit and commence the clobbering, or you fail to push through the unit and the 'wings' move forwards to form a line. The real risk of a wedge isn't the guys you're charging, it's the guys you aren't. You lack the ranks to withstand a cavalry charge, anyone hitting the flank or rear can take advantage of your lack of ranks to push you around. You're a lovely tight formation for bowmen to aim at, and any artillery hitting you at the front is likely to have a similar effect as a 10 pin bowling ball.

An infantry unit advancing in line shoulder to shoulder is imo a more defensive formation as it means that fewer men will actually do the fighting, well disciplined armies like the romans switched their "lines" so that those who were in the first linewould be moved back and those at the back would forward etc, but you are more suited to facing cavalry and flanking manouvers by infantry and skirmishers.. This formation is ideally suited to pin down other infantry and then cavalry might attack from the flank, it is really good at holding and engaging enemy formations though it can lack that edge when attacking..
The wedge is imo far more offensive it isnt really any effective if the enemy have cavalry though when for example sallying from a castle it is far more dangerous than the line formation though in a pitched battle it is to easily surrounded to, the wedge is superb when you need to break through a formation and keep a certain amount of momentum to avoid being surrounded...
This is my defination of a defensive and offensive formation..

[Valus]

The vikings are actually one of the few examples of the "hit and run" tactic used by infantry in a sucessful manner, using their longboats to land and embark again and leave if nescessary..