Remember SOPA? Meet ACTA

[Vincenzo]

Viccard please stop saying WRONG if you have no idea what you are talking about at all..

The Internet is a worldwide network of thousands of computers and computer networks. It is a public, voluntary, and cooperative effort between the connected institutions and is not owned or operated by any single organization.  The Internet and Transmission Control Protocols were initially developed in 1973 by American computer scientist Vinton Cerf as part of a project sponsored by the United States Department of Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (ARPA) and directed by American engineer Robert Kahn.    

The Internet began as a computer network of ARPA (ARPAnet) that linked computer networks at several universities and research laboratories in the United States. The World Wide Web was developed in 1989 by English computer scientist Timothy Berners-Lee for the European Organization for Nuclear Research (CERN).

"The design of the Internet was done in 1973 and published in 1974. There ensued about 10 years of hard work, resulting in the roll out of Internet in 1983. Prior to that, a number of demonstrations were made of the technology - such as the first three-network interconnection demonstrated in November 1977 linking SATNET, PRNET and ARPANET in a path leading from Menlo Park, CA to University College London and back to USC/ISI in Marina del Rey, CA." . - Vinton Cerf explains the timing:

http://www.ideafinder.com/history/inventions/internet.htm

Internet is invented by Americans, the World wide web by English people, however it does not matter.

Maybe it's best if you don't post in these topics anymore since you do not contribute anything but keep shouting WRONG when you are clearly wrong yourself 

[mikkel the great]

Nope much easier to blame it on America (**** yeah)

It is... it really is.

Hey Mikkel, do you know who created the foundations for what we now call the internet? America. Do you know what Denmark gave to the world? Hans Christian Andersen. Thanks.............. my life would be meaningless without "The Ugly Duckling".

Many many many many more things... But where in my earlier posts did I say "Denmark is better than america and have given the world so much more"? And just to clarify, the sail (sure, obsolete today) was a danish invention.


The thing I dont like about america today is that you pretend to be the fighters of freedom, while your own people live in ignorance and all you fight for is oil. American companies have more influence on politics than the people.

Goddamn it... now I got all geared up again... now, Im not gonna risk another warning/whatever because Im going to argue with a bunch of damn americans, if you wanna discuss this further lets do it by PM's shall we?

[Vincenzo]

Sigh, since when do we listen to the opinion of some commy loving danish kid.
Maybe I should remind you how many people got murdered under the regime of the soviet union, that's much much more then the Jewish people that got murdered in the second world war.

Mikkel I want to go as far as to never want your ignorant american hating uneducated ass in my forum section ever again. Since you really have no idea what you are talking about.

Thank you.

Now lets go on-topic.

[Eiríkr Rauði]

Sigh, since when do we listen to the opinion of some commy loving danish kid.
Maybe I should remind you how many people got murdered under the regime of the soviet union, that's much much more then the Jewish people that got murdered in the second world war.

Yes, it is rather lovely to throw out abuse when you're sat on that high horse, Max [I am told that is your name, right?].
If ye're going to play the Bad-Nation-Good-Nation card, mebbe you should have a read up on the Dutch atrocities commited in Indonesia during the Colonial period. Just sayin', y'know?


On Topic: The road to hell is paved with good intentions. When the first of these acts are pushed through, more will follow.

[Blobmania]

Hypothetical situation here right,

I'm watching some good old school HALO/Minecraft combo porn with a beautifully animated Nyan Cat with a Budweiser logo printed on it's side. Will I be prosecuted.

To be honest though, i'd be more worried that they would be legally required to monitor that I watched said porn than whether I was prosecuted or not.

[mikkel the great]

Sigh, since when do we listen to the opinion of some commy loving danish kid.

not a fan of commies, big difference between socialism and communism, build on the same ideas, but there's still a huge difference.

And I do not approve of all the killings, but the numbers you are mentioning are exaggerated. Millions were sent to the gulags, but not very many were killed (of course the captured germans all died... but the number of civilians was very low) just let me point out that Im not in anyway saying that the soviet union was the best thing ever, it was not, by far.

Mikkel I want to go as far as to never want your ignorant american hating uneducated ass in my forum section ever again. Since you really have no idea what you are talking about.

Thank you.

Sure thing.

[Tiger WOo]

Just to bring the conversation back on topic

Sure ACTA will not be the end of the internet, and it might not be misused. My problem is what ACTA represents and how it came about. ACTA wasn't made because the people wanted it, it was made because Hollywood and the music industry think they are losing a lot of money on filesharing. We are talking about two industries that have done nothing towards using the internet to their own advantage. Why is there not a Steam like service for movies? if Apple had not made iTunes would you then not be able to buy music online?
Because they don't want to or can't innovate their business model, they instead sue and jail people.

When the VCR recorder came out, the movie industry freaked out and demanded it be made illegal. They were sure that it would ruin Hollywood. Instead the law was passed that you could record movies and TV for personal use and for your friends, but it was made illegal to sell those copies. Then came about the internet, and the movie and recording industries freaked out again. So for no apparent reason other than those industries have a lot of lobbyist, it was made illegal to make copies of music and movies for personal use online. There is nothing that points towards file sharing actually hurting these industries. A famous statistic is that 50,000 jobs and up to $250 billion a year was lost in the US economy thanks to IP infringement. The FBI then years later admitted to it being entirely made up figures.

The truth is, no one ******** knows.  What we do know however is that thanks to a recent Dutch study, that the people who "pirate" the most, are also the ones who use the most amount of money on entertainment. People who use streaming websites or torrents, consume way more entertainment than most of them would ever be able to afford.

That is my opinion on file sharing, but you do not have to agree with it to dislike ACTA.

ACTA should be offensive to any who enjoys democracy. It was talked about in secrecy without any kind of democratic input. It wasn't until wikileaks spilled the beans that people knew it actually existed. Even then some governments wanted to keep the talks secret, including my own. This was back when the draft of ACTA included a part where people who had been found infringing copyright laws multiple times could be permanently banned from using the internet. I don't have to explain to you how insane this idea is, and that it was even in ACTA at some point is unbelievable and says a lot about who was actually pulling the strings in what was put in ACTA.

While the American people fought against SOPA and PIPA in congress, Obama signed ACTA without any kind of public debate. And if ACTA is passed in the European Parliament it will also be done so without a public debate or information on the repercussions of such an agreement. The rapporteur(guy in charge of overseeing ACTA) from the European Parliament was so disgusted with the whole process of how ACTA has come about, that he decided to quit his job.

Here is a link to an article concerning his departure: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16757142

We need to spread the awareness so a debate can take place. It doesn't matter if you are from Europe, because if it doesn't pass there, then it will fall apart entirely.

Whether you are for or against, it at least deserves to be discussed.

[BraveheartA7X]

This is stupid.

Ill say it

[TADER_BROS_Ltd.]

America, could we please keep the internet free? This might not be the final step towards total surveillance, but its a leap in that direction!


Signed against it, Mikkel Abrahamsen.

I find it funny how you refer to "total surveillance" here. Have you even been to America? I am quite familiar with it and have been to many parts of it, I see many things that are wrong with the country, but there is no reason to blindly demonize it as a whole. I am also quite familiar with and have visited several communist/socialist countries, whatever you wish to brand them as. Trust me, if you want "total surveillance", these countries are the closest thing we have in this world.

I suggest you experience the world a little bit more, maybe talk to some people living under communist governments, before ignorantly spouting your uninformed views in an unrelated forum. Its super easy to be a communism fanboy child on the internet and be an expert, but the world becomes a more complex reality after getting some actual experience of it beyond reading Marx.

There really is no reason to start pointing fingers or going into the your country sucks argument. Basically every country has regrettable past events and actions, and no country is perfect. My own country of Canada, with its peacekeeping history, foreign relations, and human rights records we are so proud of, has a terrible track record of genocide of its aboriginal peoples followed by forced assimilation of these peoples, amounting to a legacy of racism and mistreatment continuing to this day. We confiscated the property of and interned our Japanese-Canadian citizens during WWII. I could continue listing. All countries have things they would like to forget.

And yes, international legislation on protection of intellectual property has been sorely lacking for years. The internet has brought many great things, but has also robbed artists and authors of their livlihood. I like downloading shit for free, but I can definitely identify with the producers of said shit.

One thing I do know, Anonymous, whatever else it may be, is something you don't want to mess with too much.

[RimShooter]

supports the artists

Are you sure about that?

[nilloc93]

can we stop with the political debates and just talk about the merits/demerits of ACTA?

personally i don't think that drafting a new law will help much, i neither support for oppose it as it will not change anything, copyrights have always been hard to enforce *look at the cotton gin before the American civil war* drafting new laws/acts/measures won't help.
The problem is the lack of morality that exists, someone of low moral virtue will ALWAYS steal when they get away with it, and this law will not help much due to the "lost in the crowd" phenomenon. To the "starters" or the king pirates who start the cascade even if you were to arrest say the entire SKIDROW/RELOADED/RAZOR1911 crews (to take from PC piracy), others would just take their place. It would be like arresting an entire crime family, the demand for whatever they were involved in is still there, someone will take their place.

*ignoring topic*

[Col. Argus]

Just to bring the conversation back on topic

Sure ACTA will not be the end of the internet, and it might not be misused. My problem is what ACTA represents and how it came about. ACTA wasn't made because the people wanted it, it was made because Hollywood and the music industry think they are losing a lot of money on filesharing. We are talking about two industries that have done nothing towards using the internet to their own advantage. Why is there not a Steam like service for movies? if Apple had not made iTunes would you then not be able to buy music online?
Because they don't want to or can't innovate their business model, they instead sue and jail people.

When the VCR recorder came out, the movie industry freaked out and demanded it be made illegal. They were sure that it would ruin Hollywood. Instead the law was passed that you could record movies and TV for personal use and for your friends, but it was made illegal to sell those copies. Then came about the internet, and the movie and recording industries freaked out again. So for no apparent reason other than those industries have a lot of lobbyist, it was made illegal to make copies of music and movies for personal use online. There is nothing that points towards file sharing actually hurting these industries. A famous statistic is that 50,000 jobs and up to $250 billion a year was lost in the US economy thanks to IP infringement. The FBI then years later admitted to it being entirely made up figures.

The truth is, no one ******** knows.  What we do know however is that thanks to a recent Dutch study, that the people who "pirate" the most, are also the ones who use the most amount of money on entertainment. People who use streaming websites or torrents, consume way more entertainment than most of them would ever be able to afford.

That is my opinion on file sharing, but you do not have to agree with it to dislike ACTA.

ACTA should be offensive to any who enjoys democracy. It was talked about in secrecy without any kind of democratic input. It wasn't until wikileaks spilled the beans that people knew it actually existed. Even then some governments wanted to keep the talks secret, including my own. This was back when the draft of ACTA included a part where people who had been found infringing copyright laws multiple times could be permanently banned from using the internet. I don't have to explain to you how insane this idea is, and that it was even in ACTA at some point is unbelievable and says a lot about who was actually pulling the strings in what was put in ACTA.

While the American people fought against SOPA and PIPA in congress, Obama signed ACTA without any kind of public debate. And if ACTA is passed in the European Parliament it will also be done so without a public debate or information on the repercussions of such an agreement. The rapporteur(guy in charge of overseeing ACTA) from the European Parliament was so disgusted with the whole process of how ACTA has come about, that he decided to quit his job.

Here is a link to an article concerning his departure: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16757142

We need to spread the awareness so a debate can take place. It doesn't matter if you are from Europe, because if it doesn't pass there, then it will fall apart entirely.

Whether you are for or against, it at least deserves to be discussed.

Quoted for being one of the more thoughtful and contributive posts in this thread, and because such posts tend to go unread.

Good thoughts. While ACTA is being blown out of proportion, it is not something to be dismissed or take lightly. I fear that very bad precedents are being established.

[James Stewart]

Just to bring the conversation back on topic

Sure ACTA will not be the end of the internet, and it might not be misused. My problem is what ACTA represents and how it came about. ACTA wasn't made because the people wanted it, it was made because Hollywood and the music industry think they are losing a lot of money on filesharing. We are talking about two industries that have done nothing towards using the internet to their own advantage. Why is there not a Steam like service for movies? if Apple had not made iTunes would you then not be able to buy music online?
Because they don't want to or can't innovate their business model, they instead sue and jail people.

When the VCR recorder came out, the movie industry freaked out and demanded it be made illegal. They were sure that it would ruin Hollywood. Instead the law was passed that you could record movies and TV for personal use and for your friends, but it was made illegal to sell those copies. Then came about the internet, and the movie and recording industries freaked out again. So for no apparent reason other than those industries have a lot of lobbyist, it was made illegal to make copies of music and movies for personal use online. There is nothing that points towards file sharing actually hurting these industries. A famous statistic is that 50,000 jobs and up to $250 billion a year was lost in the US economy thanks to IP infringement. The FBI then years later admitted to it being entirely made up figures.

The truth is, no one ******** knows.  What we do know however is that thanks to a recent Dutch study, that the people who "pirate" the most, are also the ones who use the most amount of money on entertainment. People who use streaming websites or torrents, consume way more entertainment than most of them would ever be able to afford.

That is my opinion on file sharing, but you do not have to agree with it to dislike ACTA.

ACTA should be offensive to any who enjoys democracy. It was talked about in secrecy without any kind of democratic input. It wasn't until wikileaks spilled the beans that people knew it actually existed. Even then some governments wanted to keep the talks secret, including my own. This was back when the draft of ACTA included a part where people who had been found infringing copyright laws multiple times could be permanently banned from using the internet. I don't have to explain to you how insane this idea is, and that it was even in ACTA at some point is unbelievable and says a lot about who was actually pulling the strings in what was put in ACTA.

While the American people fought against SOPA and PIPA in congress, Obama signed ACTA without any kind of public debate. And if ACTA is passed in the European Parliament it will also be done so without a public debate or information on the repercussions of such an agreement. The rapporteur(guy in charge of overseeing ACTA) from the European Parliament was so disgusted with the whole process of how ACTA has come about, that he decided to quit his job.

Here is a link to an article concerning his departure: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16757142

We need to spread the awareness so a debate can take place. It doesn't matter if you are from Europe, because if it doesn't pass there, then it will fall apart entirely.

Whether you are for or against, it at least deserves to be discussed.

Quoted for being one of the more thoughtful and contributive posts in this thread, and because such posts tend to go unread.

Good thoughts. While ACTA is being blown out of proportion, it is not something to be dismissed or take lightly. I fear that very bad precedents are being established.

+1

[AgentGB]

Wasn't actually aware of this happening in the EU, other methods will evetually be fount. Steam has probably help clamp down on alot of piracy while adding incentives to purchase the game instead of pirating it, which is obviously harder for movie companys to replicate.
Alot of the newer movies are being released in 3D to give incentive to go watch it in the cinema, while making pirated recording unwatchable. Terrible times indeed , but in no way do i support ACTA

Petition signed

[Krimdor]

New idea: Steam now sales movies! >.<