Battle for Sicily 0.500 for M&B 0.808 now available, probably will have bugs

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Re news -- I've had to do other stuff for the past few days. I still need to find and fix the bug that Faruq spotted. After that I want to finish off the dynamic economy.

You can wear down a capital over time, but it's too slow currently and there should also be more feedback. I'll try to set down more thoughts on this in a bit.

More variety in troop trees would be hard to implement immediately because of the complications involving feudal troops, although I do want to put some in eventually. I will try to make sure that each troop type at least has four categories of experience, so you do get the same sense of building an army of veterans as you do in Native.

Promoting vassals/NPCs from your forces would be a good idea that I would like to implement eventually, but it might be some time.
 
I just downloaded the .411, and I am sorry if this is adressed in previous pages but I lost track during my exams and tried a vain search. But after playing a little while, there are some things that I found out, serving the lord of Troyanum:

1. 119 troops with 3 leadership / 6 charisma
Is it for testing purposes? Because I do recall that you wanted a lower limit earlier...

2. Captured villages with castles
Even after we gain the village for the glory of our lord, when we speak to the sheik, he still claim allegiance to the former vassal, and being part of the former province. This makes me wonder if any of my allied vassals (or me, so to speak) could become in charge of this fief.

3. 15 troops garrison limit
Does this serve any purpose? I know that if I garrison it immediately with, let's say, 10 troops (ie Lombard mercenaries in this example), Troyana is going to send 5 reinforcment to reach the 15 limit. And from now on, no matter how many mercenaries I have in my party, I won't be able to garrison them anymore. However, if I garrison them after Troyana sends out 15 reinforcement, it will combine to become protected by 25 mercenaries.

4. Household knight
Is there a reason why I cannot settle down my houehold knight in my fief? Right now (again being troyanum faction) I can only do so with lombard mercenaries (which excludes veteran mercenaries) and landless knights.

You may already have heard about this, but I hope this will help you out in the making of this great mod.
 
This is the best Mod ive ever seen excluding The Last Days mod, i played this like 2 months ago and SWEAR i found a way to use my advisor to tell me which fiefs i had, u may have fixed this but i got to page 5 of all the posts and got sick of reading, but man u are AWESOME! and i heard u did this mostly on u own, so i will say this *drops to knees and says* PRAISE THE CREATOR! (of this mod) continue working on this and it will prob be better then the last days in no time
 
I did wear down the enemys capital Enna enough to start a siege. Massive! Absolutely brilliant, and although the AI is a problem, it isnt as bad as some of the castles are. I play as a lombard, having two fiefs in Troyanum territory under Robert. Now that we have taken Enna, I visit the war council, and the other lords are given new fiefs and gets to choose whther to remain under Robert or swear allegiance to Drogo of Benveneto who is the new appointed ruler of Enna. He stands next to Robert in the courtroom, I talk to him and he offers me to join him. I don't, wanting to check my relations with him using my advisor first. When I get back to the courtroom from the mapwindow Drogo is gone. I was going to pledge allegiance to him. Drogo never appears in Troyanum or Enna again, despite having a bunch of vassals standing in his new court there. When I ask my advisor through the cheat menu about Drogos location, he says he is resting. Bug?

And by the way, the game just ran out of new names for lords, so one of the guys in the court is called LASTLORD. Guess you know about that already.

*EDIT*
Forgot the other bug(?)
When you raise a levy from two of your fiefs in a row, and then talk to the advisor about sending them home, it seems only half of them actually go home, ie the ones from the last place you visited. The first levy you raised remains as ordinary troops without a timelimit on their service. Only tried this once. Bug?
 
Thanks to everyone for the kind words.

The disappearing liege is the same bug as Faruq spotted. I think I fixed that, but I still need to test.

Oops -- I thought I'd added enough lords so that the famous LASTLORD of PLACE would not actually be forced out of retirement. Will add a few more.

Disbanding your feudal levy should release all your feudal troops from service. If only half leave, that's a bug. I'll check that out. If they upgraded while in your service, however, they will stay with you, as will household units.

You can find out your fiefs by speaking to your adviser, under the "I need some information" sub-menu.

A conquered castle will not switch lieges unless the province is conquered. I should however have the sheikh explain this more explicitly, as quite a few players have found this to be counter-intuitive.

The 15 garrison limit is arbitrary. I could change it for captured castles, as they tend to be quite easy to recapture.

There is in fact no upper limit on the number of troops you can have in your party. If you have too many, however, you run into discipline problems. I also want to add in other forms of attrition, which I'll try to make both less common and more serious than the discipline problems.
 
nijis said:
Disbanding your feudal levy should release all your feudal troops from service. If only half leave, that's a bug. I'll check that out. If they upgraded while in your service, however, they will stay with you, as will household units.
Click to expand...

Sorry, forgot to point out that they weren't upgraded, but still remained. I had 5 "Norman Knights" and 2 "Sicilian Archers" in my party after I disbanded my levy, which I believe can only come from fiefs.
 
Hmm... I couldn't duplicate that bug. Was this after you changed factions, by the way? If so, that might be the cause, as I'd forgotten to send home your troops to your old fiefs when you gave them up to go to the new faction. I've hopefully fixed that now.

Another possibility is that your fiefs suffered population loss due to raiding and/or a disrupted economy, so that there weren't homes in the fiefs to which your men could return. That's a pretty drastic population loss for only seven game days, though. (To explain -- the game calculates disbanding by figuring out for each of your fiefs how many troops it is missing, then takes those troops from your force. I should program it so that any leftover feudal troops are reset to mercenaries, so at least they can be settled elsewhere).
 
nijis said:
Hmm... I couldn't duplicate that bug. Was this after you changed factions, by the way? If so, that might be the cause, as I'd forgotten to send home your troops to your old fiefs when you gave them up to go to the new faction. I've hopefully fixed that now.

Another possibility is that your fiefs suffered population loss due to raiding and/or a disrupted economy, so that there weren't homes in the fiefs to which your men could return. That's a pretty drastic population loss for only seven game days, though. (To explain -- the game calculates disbanding by figuring out for each of your fiefs how many troops it is missing, then takes those troops from your force. I should program it so that any leftover feudal troops are reset to mercenaries, so at least they can be settled elsewhere).
Click to expand...

It was before I switched. It might have been to pop loss, but many of the "xxx has a surplus of -30, chance of losing knight at xxx 120"-messages I don't fully get the meaning of. I can't see any lost knights at xxx despite that message.

I actually ended up rejoining Troyanum instead of joining the missing Drogo at Enna, but then you lose all your previous fiefs. So my character is back where he started, no fiefs and a lord that hates him :smile:

*edit* I've been playing for some 2000 game hours with my current character now, having recieved two fiefs, taken one capital. I am level 18 and usually travel with a 30 man strong mercenary party. Just thought you might like to know that I play your mod alot :smile:
 
*Sigh* I just conquered Enna and right after the division of the fiefs, I got an illegal operation thing that from now on keeps me from playing this game ever again.

Ah well, I know it is error prone. It has been fun and I'll probably look after the next version for a new game.

I have a few little bugs that I encountered, though, and that you might want to hear about. Keep in mind that I am serving the lord of Troyanum.

1) When you head back to Troyana, if you encounter the army of your liege, it shows up the menu for a siege of Troyana. However it does not seem to affect anything thereafter.

2) When you defeat a bandit party near a looted city, it says that you destroyed it in the province of 'Abandoned' for instance.

And I have a few questions:

1) I wonder how big must be our party to be able to siege a city. I thought I read something in the likes of 65%. However, it was not my case. At all. Had to cheat :sad:

2) Also, would it be possible to become the liege ofthe captured province (in this case, Enna)? Because I tried it a couple of time and it was left the title of baron to Gilbert (Drogo has been slain in the exercice of his functions) and gave the same fiefs to the same lords. I didn't get any more fief, by the way, although I am by far the best reknown and everything.

3) I found out that it was possible to increase our piety and our generosity quite easily, the same for our deviousness and unjustice. I wonder how if we can affect our other traits, if it is possible as of now.  Now that I think of it, it was possible at the beginning of the game to become 'cruel' by attacking the villagers of the towns without a castle. But soon enough, it was no longer the case as I looted as soon as I entered in the town. Was i thought that way?

Thanks for your advices, and keep up the good work for this great mod
 
Sorry I'd been offline for a few days.

Flatine -- 2000 game hours, wow. In that time, have you ever seen one of the AI-controlled factions launch a final siege against another AI faction? If not, I probably have some number-jiggling to do.

Haupper -- sorry about the bugs, and particularly sorry about the one that shut down play. Just to check -- which version are you playing? It wouldn't surprise me at all if those errors cropped up in the latest version, but I just want to be sure before I try to reproduce them.

Your party's size is not important in determining whether a final siege is possible, but the garrison of the capital of your province must be considerably stronger than that of the enemy -- at least one and a half times, if I recall correctly. In order to launch the final assault during the final siege, the enemy garrison must be below 100 troops, I think.

In order to be made lord of an entire province, you need to be the largest landowner in your faction (ie, have more fiefs than anyone else, not just renown) at the time it is conquered.

Trait losses and gains are not fully balanced yet, so some reputations will be easy to gain and others virtually impossible. I hope to to start fixing this in the next few months when I develop the political system. There will also be a lot more options, so if you're under-fiefed and have a lord that hates you, you can try to do something about it.

 
Nice that you replied this soon, and don't worry about taking a break once in a while - the last thing this community would want is burning you out. On the other end, I hope our enthousiasm keeps on your interest (by the way I had something in the likes of 1600 hours under my belt and nope - no AI taking on other AI's capital).

I was using .411, by the way.

And just to know - is there a way to get more than 2 fiefs in your original province? Being an aristocrat, i was given Maniakes and got Kentoripa quite easily (at something like 100 reknown). At the end I being I was 1500+ (did the mistake of leading an +80 army most of the time, it makes your reputation suffer in a irrational way) and my liege kept telling me that I should get another fief but that were none available and this, despite many of my fellow vassals getting slain in battle.

Could we get a hold on the current python version?
 
No danger of me burning out, although there will be times when I won't be able to do any work for a while. It is really gratifying to hear that people are enjoying it, despite the bugs.

Here's the latest Python on rapidshare. If you spot anything that might be the cause of the crash, I'd be very grateful to know.
http://rapidshare.com/files/29655402/Python_Battle_for_Sicily_May5.rar.html

Huge armies do make your relation with your lord suffer in an irrational way because of the endless discipline problems. I've made the effect a little more mild with this version, I hope, although it probably still needs more work.

Could it be that the vassals who were getting killed only had one fief each? If that's the case, then their deaths won't open up any more fiefs, as the available one will quickly be snapped up by whichever new vassal replaced them. Either that or we have another bug.

Most of my work in the last couple of weeks has been on creating a dynamic economy, where goods move to and fro according to supply and demand. Note that this is only half-implemented, however -- goods are produced and consumed, but they don't move around yet, so you can probably make a bundle running grain from a village to a city only a few kilometers away.

The reason that I'm working on the dynamic economy is that it will have a big impact on the wars of attrition, and is a precondition for some things that will hopefully make fief management and province overlordship more interesting.
 
I've been playing more and more in the background, but I just didn't have anything to contribute to the thread... Is the above version save game compatible? What does it add?
 
It fixes a couple of bugs in 0.412, I think, including the one which leads to liege lords disappearing from their courts. There are a couple of other minor changes -- cities will sell equipment associated with the ruling nationality, and improvised weapons like scythes, stones, and the like are sold at villages. However, I don't think it would be save-game compatible. It probably is not worth downloading unless you were already starting a new character.
 
nijis said:
Sorry I'd been offline for a few days.

Flatine -- 2000 game hours, wow. In that time, have you ever seen one of the AI-controlled factions launch a final siege against another AI faction? If not, I probably have some number-jiggling to do.
Click to expand...

Nope, the only capital siege I've ssen is the one I played in myself.
 
nijis you need anything else made? I'm still rather dissapointed in the item choices of this mod. I'll make something else for you today, I think I have the time, armours (lammallar?) or horses (kataphracts?) in particular'.
 
nijis said:
Sorry I'd been offline for a few days.

Flatine -- 2000 game hours, wow. In that time, have you ever seen one of the AI-controlled factions launch a final siege against another AI faction? If not, I probably have some number-jiggling to do.
Click to expand...

Nope, never.

One thing that affects gameplay in a negative fashion is when you're defending a castle. If you have a bow, you can simply shoot a few arrows before the enemy reaches the keep, the press tab, and begin again. When defending a castle, I think the "the enemy is near, you can't flee"-response should come up if you try to escape. Or if you press tab, you should only get "sally forth" or "break out" options, but not "defend the walls" a second time.
 
Chilly5 said:
nijis you need anything else made? I'm still rather dissapointed in the item choices of this mod. I'll make something else for you today, I think I have the time, armours (lammallar?) or horses (kataphracts?) in particular'.
Click to expand...

If Nijis wants them may i suggest some more Norman variety, as it is every norman knight looks the same, same helm and 1 of 2 armor....possbly include a variiation on the current helm such as found in 1066 or holy war mods, then possibly a version without the coif underneath, and/or a version where coif covers mouth....then perhaps a gambeson which can be used by anyone, and a norman mail armor with the chest patch (i can get a pic if needed)

Would be nice to see landless knights wearing gambesons, or weaker mail types while more experianced knights would be better armed.


 
Drusus said:
Chilly5 said:
nijis you need anything else made? I'm still rather dissapointed in the item choices of this mod. I'll make something else for you today, I think I have the time, armours (lammallar?) or horses (kataphracts?) in particular'.
Click to expand...

If Nijis wants them may i suggest some more Norman variety, as it is every norman knight looks the same, same helm and 1 of 2 armor....possbly include a variiation on the current helm such as found in 1066 or holy war mods, then possibly a version without the coif underneath, and/or a version where coif covers mouth....then perhaps a gambeson which can be used by anyone, and a norman mail armor with the chest patch (i can get a pic if needed)

Would be nice to see landless knights wearing gambesons, or weaker mail types while more experianced knights would be better armed.
Click to expand...
Lol, as of yet I have not seen a norman in battle before, I've only been playing as the greeks or arabs.
 
yeah, ask Raz for his norman items at last! :smile:
And some cataphraktoi would be fine :smile:
 
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