Native Is Dying?

[doomsayer]

I am just starting cRPG and I got mixed feeling about it.  So far nobody play siege, only battle, wich is kinda annoying but I can deal with that.  Also, since nobody have the same gear it's incredibly unbalanced and there are polls all the time about anything.  Hell, I think I got kicked out of a game for no reason at all, I did not see the poll but I assume there was one.. unless some admin received an arrow in his back, turned around , saw me, a peasant archer,  and kicked me out even if it wasn't me. Honestly, I never say anything to anyone in game... And I am extremly carefull not to shoot when I don't have a clear line.

Are there cRPG server reserved for certain clan? It's kinda the only thing I can see..

The balance issue with cRPG is what I hate about it. It's so horribly inbalanced due to grinding that rounds are almost decided before they start, purely because one side has higher level players. What's the point in playing it then? Fancy customization? You might as well play a crappy free MMO for that. Or TF2.
Imagine a field battle in Native/Mount & Gladius/Mount & Musket with the same player numbers as in cRPG. It would be better in every single aspect!

To be fair when you are on a native server the round might just as well be decided because most skilled players stack on one side or it's a very cavalry friendly map against nords, etc.

cRPG is an ever changing mod.

Its tru lvl's make a different in what you can do, just as in sp.

You can be in the best gear but if you suck, you suck and you wont be able to kill many people.

Playing as a peasant really doesnt take too long to grow out of now there's the siege mode and bigger battles.

I like native too but cRPG just brings more to the mp experience.

Meh, it's not so easy if you suck. In native you strive to always control the situation, keep your eyes on the enemy, block his attacks, always know the counters to throw in, etc., because if you don't and he does you are dead (all different skills, so you have a lot of people being better at this or that, not just sucks or owns).
But when you have many bonuses stacked on your side you can do pretty well just playing totally random (or using a completely noob tactic like backpeddle +2h spam when you run faster backwards than he runs forward), since the dices favor the guy with the bonus.
Sure, someone good enough can beat this, but I still find it more enjoyable to be killed by a good player than wearing someone down while keeping track of his random attacks on innocent shrubbery. XP clusterfuck doesn't really make it better. Which is I think more of a problem, than having peasants or levels, but as you can buy "win" skillfull combat is somewhat overshadowed by it.

[Scarf Ace]

To be fair when you are on a native server the round might just as well be decided because most skilled players stack on one side or it's a very cavalry friendly map against nords, etc.

Eh, Nord infantry have war spears, various throwing axes and long axes. I don't see how they're at a disadvantage against cav. It's more of an issue of situational awareness than weaponry when it comes to fighting off cavalry.

Meh, it's not so easy if you suck. In native you strive to always control the situation, keep your eyes on the enemy, block his attacks, always know the counters to throw in, etc., because if you don't and he does you are dead (all different skills, so you have a lot of people being better at this or that, not just sucks or owns).
But when you have many bonuses stacked on your side you can do pretty well just playing totally random (or using a completely noob tactic like backpeddle +2h spam when you run faster backwards than he runs forward), since the dices favor the guy with the bonus.
Sure, someone good enough can beat this, but I still find it more enjoyable to be killed by a good player than wearing someone down while keeping track of his random attacks on innocent shrubbery. XP clusterfuck doesn't really make it better. Which is I think more of a problem, than having peasants or levels, but as you can buy "win" skillfull combat is somewhat overshadowed by it.

That's exactly what I mean. In cRPG anyone with a level advantage can fight off other players without really thinking much. Native's combat is a lot more interesting because everyone's a valid threat, and it's all about using every little thing that happens to give you the edge in a fight. You can't just practically ignore the lower level guy or steer clear of the higher level enemies.

[iben93]

I do miss when the game first came out hundreds of full servers and such

[Sovereignity]

To be fair when you are on a native server the round might just as well be decided because most skilled players stack on one side or it's a very cavalry friendly map against nords, etc.

Eh, Nord infantry have war spears, various throwing axes and long axes. I don't see how they're at a disadvantage against cav. It's more of an issue of situational awareness than weaponry when it comes to fighting off cavalry.

Not to mention that nords, contrary to popular belief, actually have cavalry of their own.

[Scarf Ace]

To be fair when you are on a native server the round might just as well be decided because most skilled players stack on one side or it's a very cavalry friendly map against nords, etc.

Eh, Nord infantry have war spears, various throwing axes and long axes. I don't see how they're at a disadvantage against cav. It's more of an issue of situational awareness than weaponry when it comes to fighting off cavalry.

Not to mention that nords, contrary to popular belief, actually have cavalry of their own.

With free javelins. Man, I love picking nord cav, not buying a horse, taking 4 stacks of free javs and all the armor I can get. Then I just toss my javs around wildly until I kill something (which is unlikely) and loot the weapons 

[Sovereignity]

To be fair when you are on a native server the round might just as well be decided because most skilled players stack on one side or it's a very cavalry friendly map against nords, etc.

Eh, Nord infantry have war spears, various throwing axes and long axes. I don't see how they're at a disadvantage against cav. It's more of an issue of situational awareness than weaponry when it comes to fighting off cavalry.

Not to mention that nords, contrary to popular belief, actually have cavalry of their own.

With free javelins. Man, I love picking nord cav, not buying a horse, taking 4 stacks of free javs and all the armor I can get. Then I just toss my javs around wildly until I kill something (which is unlikely) and loot the weapons 

If you do the same, but keep the horse, then you've effectively become a short-range horse archer as well.

[doomsayer]

I've seen nords raped by cav often though. In the end, it doesn't really matter, there were many occassions on native where teams were just so unbalanced that I couldn't do much as an individual, just like in crpg.

On an individual level, you can just play crpg in the same way, trying to maximize the damage you deal to the enemy. The main difference is that some level 10 guy blocking everything and feinting can be a lot less dangerous than a level 30 who has removed his right mouse button and the big battle is largely butchering work. Otoh this level 30 guy has to watch out when a good level 26 comes his way, so you can just try to protect yourself and allies with the little resources you have and hope that the others do their job, which can be fun, too. Like charging a shieldwall with a broken shield and a knife in the hope that they get greedy and split into two.
I'd also sometimes think the native police of making everything available to everyone is not always the best.
Everyone can pick cavalry or archer at start (which is good in a way since you can play how you like), but it can also mean that I'm the only infantryman, arriving at the battle just as cav and arhcers have decided it.

It's all just a tradeoff and some like this better or that.
I think taleworlds should have just put more emphasis on marketing the multiplayer part as "medieval cs" or something, in the demo you can only see SP, which is more or less a standard leveling RPG with better combat system and no magic, might have turned off people who would have been interested in a pure fighting game.
Or not, I don't know.

[JackBaldy]

I've seen nords raped by cav often though. In the end, it doesn't really matter, there were many occassions on native where teams were just so unbalanced that I couldn't do much as an individual, just like in crpg.

The situation you explained can happen in ANY online game. People occasionally stack teams, so what? From what I've heard and seen, in cRPG, a lot is determined by levels and gear. Personally, when I play Warband, I don't play to grind. But that's just me. To each their own I suppose.

[Thel]

OH GOD NATIVE IS DYING *MOUTH-TO-MOUTH*.

[Ischenous]

Lol. Best reaction yet.

By the looks of things, this is just turning into cRPG vs Native debate,  as I thought it would...

[Mr.X]

I played cRPG once. Just annoyed me that these guys who absolutely sucked were kicking my ass because my weapons weren't strong enough to register hits...

Back when I started playing MnB (the original), my favourite thing about it was the whole "A guy with a quarterstaff can take down a knight in 3 hits if they knight sucks" idea. The idea that you actually had to be good to do well, and that as long as you were a good player, you could do well with bad gear. Albeit you'll do better with better gear, but still.
Because of that, I don't like cRPG. As for the whole "round is decided by which players on which side" thing, that pretty much happens in native as well. If a few good players join the "bad" team, they'll win, because those players are good. The only time that really doesn't happen is if there are a significant amount of people in the server.

[JackBaldy]

Because of that, I don't like cRPG. As for the whole "round is decided by which players on which side" thing, that pretty much happens in native as well. If a few good players join the "bad" team, they'll win, because those players are good. The only time that really doesn't happen is if there are a significant amount of people in the server.

Team stacking isn't something new with Warband. It's been around for ages. It's something very old. But the difference is, in cRPG, team stacking is not determined by player skill level, it's determined by how much levels he or she has. What gear he or she has. How much grinding has he or she done. I might as well play a gear based MMO if I'm to put up with such nonsense.

Your scenario is highly suspect regardless. A lot of variables. If a few good players join the "bad" team, as you put it, it's very possible they could still lose provided that the other team is better. Of course if it's a bunch of scrubs on both sides, and a single/few good players go to a specific team, then it's obvious what will happen. Regardless, you'd be getting beat because the other team is better, not because they grinded more.

[Mallissin]

Let's be honest, the MP for Warband is weak. The weapons and factions are unbalanced, and the netcode is crap.

As frustrating as it is, the only people who come back are either gluttons for punishment or abusing the imbalances every chance they get.

I'm one of the former.

[Mr.X]

I agree jackbaldy, I was just giving a general example.

[JackBaldy]

Let's be honest, the MP for Warband is weak.

I disagree.