For those who DO...

[brasidus]

My reason for feeling he is incorrect is that there are a good many SCA fighters who are not only well versed in Fiore I.33 Talhoffer ect, but some that are in the forefront of study and have been since, yes HACA (now ARMA) was just starting.  His post seems to infer that the two (SCA and WMA) are exclusive of one another, when in fact, they can be complimentary, helpful, and sometimes the same thing.

Are you familiar with Charron or Price?
They are excellent examples of what I am talking about.

[Merentha]

One reason I chose to join this SCA group was that at least two of them would be willing to work with me after practice, ARMA style.  I know a little bit about the two you mentioned, enough to recognize their names, and agree that there are very good SCA members who are leaders in the WMA field.  I took his post to mean that many SCAers don't realize or don't think about how the rules the SCA uses can affect their fighting style and how it differs from what might truly be used on a battlefield.

[brasidus]

It differs from area to area. Talking about the SCA can be hard because it is such a loose organization that covers over 35000 people and over 30 years so there is a enormous amount of variation from town to town, let alone say from new Zealand to California.

When I was in we were constnatly discussing the differences between combat form and what we did. All the other issues those outside pick on are really not nearly as big as the fact that shields are indestructable. Tactics wise, the most effective forms are actually blends of Roman/Greek tactics involving pikes, halberds and shields with other weapons forms for specialized assaults.

Some are very aware of the differences and try to get closer as much as possible within the rules. Others are aware and choose to create thier own sport forms, and some just like to hit people hard. 
Keep in mind that as far as one on one bouts those were usually done in the tournament mileu and as such there were often regulations not very different form many SCA rules such as numbered blows or restricted strike zones. To be technical the SCA initially was intended to represent the high middle ages and the chivalric ideals of the tourney companies rather than the battlefield. The Company of Saint George founded by Brian Price truly was the epitomy of this ideal IMHO.

Which reminded me of this site of his:

http://www.chronique.com/

Wish he kept it going.

[Blackthorn]

You see, there's always limitations as to what you can do when you're a group primarily for display; my group have a very limited hit-zone specifically to prevent injury etc. because we're fighting with steel weapons in front of an audience. That and I'm still to be convinced on how 'easy' it is to injure someone in some areas, but I digress...
However, this doesn't mean I can't fight with other hit-zones... I'd actually say once you've fought with ANY hit-zone you can adapt fairly quickly (I'm actually at an advantage fighting with an expansive kill-zone, because I'm using a full-length flat-topped kite, which basically covers me chin to shin) as long as you've got the parrying skills, binding techniques etc. required. It's just a case of a few moments of ''what kills me again, oh, right... yeah...''

[brasidus]

As a father of two little ones who puts in a 50 hour work week sleep deprivation is a constant, and as such my posting clarity often suffers. 

I guess all I'm trying to say is stick with your training from ARMA while learning how to adhere to the local combat rules of the SCA. And as I am sure you realize you will have whole different view after being able to apply it to full contact melee scenarios and such.

I don't know what weapons you have, but I suggest making your SCA weeapons based upon real ones you have access to. Granted an SCA waster will never fully represent a steel blade anymore than the historical ones of wood and whalebone but they can be made to mimick the balance and feel fairly well if you put some effort into it.

[brasidus]

Just found this article from Brian that sums it all up nicely.
http://www.chronique.com/Library/Fighting/study.htm

[Merentha]

I guess all I'm trying to say is stick with your training from ARMA while learning how to adhere to the local combat rules of the SCA. And as I am sure you realize you will have whole different view after being able to apply it to full contact melee scenarios and such.

You know, I think I was trying to say that's exactly something I can do, while some SCA members just aren't so lucky.     Well, thank you for the advice there, I am excited to see how SCA combat actually works.

[Destichado]

*sigh* 

You know, I've been prejudiced against ARMA since before it changed itself from HACA, back when John Clements and J. Christoph Amberger were flaming the hell out of each other on Swordforum and their respective desciples carried on the battle and spread it over to Netsword.  I got sick of it all and said "screw you both and your groups too, I'm paying attention to AEMMA!"  That was... jeez, six or seven years ago now.  Maybe more.  And ever since I've listened closely to what's been coming out of WMA circles in the SCA, European reenactment groups, living history societies, online communities... while studiously ignoring ARMA.

Maybe I ought to get over it.    It seems like that era in the group's development is over.  Everyone I know who "also does" ARMA is great, and it seems like I'm the only one that remembers the old days.  Which, honestly, is probably for the best. 

[Merentha]

I'm sorry to hear that Destichado.  I'd like to state that Clement's ARMA-only zeal can get excessive, such as his devotion to keeping ARMA 'secrets' within ARMA alone.     I wasn't around then, so I don't know much of my group's inception.

So, back on the original topic-Pennsic?  Anyone?  What can I expect?  (I know its a year away, but still, I'm excited).

[matlid le sauvage]

as my name sergest i am that of whob is menthiond in blackthorns backstory i can not prove this unless asked buy him except the fact that  i am rather parinoied that he will think i am some one who has taken the info from the back story and worked the name out oh dear this dose sound like i am but thats just me as blackthorn should know and if you wher to look at the the poast about being obsest about re-inactment and the top 40 then blackthorn should be able to ges from that i am the quiet but insane girl that is part of the BSU and if he wishes cold mesage him and spout of many things that i and him self would only know just to prove it.
ok this dose sound realy bad but i am who i say i am i tipe more than i talk but hay dahhh

[Edward of Woodstock]

I have no idea what you are talking about.  Blackthorn, is she right?

[matlid le sauvage]

that is because only people who know me will know what im on about im not shure if blackthorn will but hay im not even shure half the time but i am genrly parinoied
blacthorn is in whales at the moment at uni and might not have the net just yet

apoliges for my teribal speling 

[Edward of Woodstock]

You killed him didn't you?

Just kidding.  Not really

[matlid le sauvage]

no of corce i did not i love him he is a brilant person
(brother siter type love not the bf gf type love)

[Merentha]

A bit of an update for my study group.  Essentially, without the rest of my ARMA group, I'm practicing entirely on my own for the longsword.  However, I did join the local SCA (kingdom of Aethelmarc, in case anyone cares) with the intent to be a spear fighter.  The longsword is just too poor a battlefield weapon when matched against sword/shield, a difference that is exacerbated by the SCA rules.  Also, I tend to be on the light, puny side, so the 7lb shield and the relatively stolid defense was not my style. 

The spear, on the other hand, I can do.  The hewing cuts are reminiscient of some longsword moves, and the block style of the spear comes relatively intuitively to me.  I need to overcompensate less, but I think I can live in the SCA.  The best part of the spear, though, is that I can snipe, and leap away really well.  I probably won't kill many sword/shielders, but I can keep them busy.  I'll need relatively light armor (I'm looking at leather, maybe with a chain haubergeon (I'll make it, which means I need a rivetting tool... ), but with that, I should be able to outlast most fighters.  My crosscountry background means I have endurance aplenty, so we'll see how that works.  Unfortunately, its hard to test at the moment, because the only loaner gear they have is a set of plates made for a 250 lb man (I'm a little over half that).  Needless to say, agility drops precipitously.  Someone is bringing chain next week, which should at least be less clunky.

I'm also considering archery.  I'm not a bad shot and am certified to teach it.  Unfortunately spear and bows don't tend to mix that well, so I'm thinking that buckler/roundshield and a sword is something I can also do.  The roundshield style tends to be more aggressive than the standard heater, which is preferable to me.  Also, if I get good with buckler/sword, I can wear the buckler while I'm spearfighting.

*sigh*  I just wish the lack of shincuts didn't make heater shields so damn good...