Mounted Swordsmanship Guide

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Qwertyman

Sergeant Knight
I got bored so i wrote this:

I hear lots of people saying that mounted melee is weak,  but personally i find it both more powerful and more fun than lancing.  so here is a brief guide on the loadout you should take, as well as how to fight effectively.

Loadout

Horse  -  Your horse needs to be agile above all else,  speed is not important.  Sarranid horses, Steppe horses and Hunters are the best,  in that order. Always remember you can steal horses from your enemies-  so even if your not a Sarranid you can get your hands on one of their killing machines :smile:
Sarranid horses---    the most agile in the game,  makes weaving around enemy lines very easy, as well as dodging enemy lancers. imo the best out there.
Steppe horses---    seem to just be a toned down Sarranid horse.
Hunters---  whilst not as agile as the above,  they have good trample damage which allways helps in close quarters, makes bumpslashing all the more effective.
Corsairs---   Usually not the best choice, more of a lancers horse,  but it makes surprise ride-by attacks easier.  much better to bring a hunter.
Warhorse/Charger---  not worth it if you ask me,  buying one will take money you could spend on weapons or armour,  and they just aren't agile enough.
Saddle Horses---  just don't even bother.
(note:  some prefer the Hunter to the Steppe horse due to the trample damage,  its down to personal preference really)

Armour-  more important than it is for lancers, as you are going to be sticking around the fight for longer,  get what you can afford  but your horse and weapon take priority.
Helmet---  not very important, although most factions have a cheap-as-dirt helm that you may as well get
Body---  you will likely take a few hits being a mounted swordsman, so invest money here
Gloves---  usually not worth it, and never more than leather,  save money for boots.
Boots---  much more important than for infantry, you will take most of your hits to your lower body,  so invest money here.

Weapon-  the most important part aside from an agile horse is your weapon.  you CAN bring a lance,  but don't spend money- get the free one, instead fork out on a good sword.  you have two main options-  one handed and two handed (some factions have alternatives like the nord spear and the kerg polarm thing, but if find them weak)
Two handed---  Two handed weapons have the clear advantage of range and damage,  but lack in speed and protection.  your ride-by attacks will deal massive damage, but you wont be able to strike out as fast, which when facing multiple enemies will pose a problem,  alsothe lack of a shield will make you an easy target for archers or thrown weapons.
One handed---  obviously one handers have less reach compared to two handers,  but their speed more than makes up for it,  you can circle a target and cut them to ribbons without fearing retaliation as well as be able to keep your opponents at bay if your horse rears.  having a shield is a huge advantage too, as it drastically reduces the threat of archers.
(note: I prefer one handed weapons from horseback due to their ability to fend off infantry when your horse rears)

My personal Favorates for each faction:
1. Sarranid Cavalry Sword, Sarranid horse---   long reach, high speed and decent damage coupled with the best horse in the game, nothing better.
2. Rhodok Pick, hunter---    lacking in range and not with exceptional speed the pick may seem a bad choice,  but its high Peirce damage can take down armoured opponents easily. paired with a hunter, you can bumpslash very effectively
3. Swadian Arming sword, hunter---   its massive speed more than makes up for its range,  if you want range go for the bastard sword, but for me speed wins.
4. Kergit Mace, Steppe horse---  it has the shortest range of all their weapons,  but it gets one-hit-kills regularly, and deals knockdown which prevent your enemies fighting back,  second to this is their axe for its sheildbreaking ability.
5. Veiger scimitar, Hunter---    it may not have the power of other weapons but it is VERY fast and has relatively good range,  i prefer this to the elite scimitar due to its speed.
6. Nords...  well I don't play mounted melee as Nord,  as other factions cavalry makes short work of them.



Tactics
Some basic dont's 
DON'T play like a lancer,  in other words-  don't ride in, make one attack and ride out. if you want to do this then bring a lance as it is far more effective with one.
DON'T fight lancers or pikemen head on, you WILL die.  (tactics on fighting them later on)
DON'T spam your swings-  it doesn't work,  by all means attack quickly, but time them well otherwise you will miss your target.
DON'T charge full speed into a target that knows your coming,  most of the time they will time their strike well and bring you down.

General tactics- - Agility is your friend,  speed is not important in a fight like it is for lancers,  dodge past dangerous units like pikemen and make your way for vulnerable units like archers or swordsmen,  if the enemy has lots of ranged troops then vary your speed and direction a lot, as this makes long distance shots nearly impossible for them.
A biggie for mounted melee is choosing your battles,  why fight a pikeman when there is a maceman a few seconds gallop away?  choose your fights and keep the enemy on their toes.  attract attention to yourself to draw it away from allies when needed,  then move in for the kill when your enemies attention is elsewhere.

Danger priorities-
  they differ slightly to lancers.  in order of danger to you it pretty much goes; (skill of player plays a part)
Pikemen -- Spearmen -- Long weapons -- 2hander infantry -- Cavalry -- Ranged troops (at medium/long range) -- 1hander infantry -- ranged troops (close up). 
Archers being more dangerous than xbowmen due to reloading.
more dangerous targets should be avoided if there are more vulnerable targets available.


Attacking
Attacking isn't as simple as you'd think, its easy to miss or get taken down as you pass,  there are a few ways of going about it.
Generally if your target is unaware you can go for a full speed ride-by for maximum damage,  but if your target is going to fight back then you may have to use the other tactics available and generally take the slower approach.

Basic ride-by attack- -  ride past your target, you have more reach on your right hand side so try to pass your target on the left. ready your attack some time before passing, as a fully chambered attack deals more damage,  release the swing before passing and keep your target in the centre of your screen throughout the swing to avoid missing.  attempt to pass at the furthest distance you can whilst keeping in range to minimise the risk of being hit back.
To throw off the timing of your enemy, approach below full speed-  then speed up as you go for the kill, or vice vera.

Circle-attack-  go at a lower speed to get better mobility and feint a ride-by (by acting as if your going to, then riding past out of their attack range) slow down and do a sharp turn, passing again and striking.  you can feint a pass as many times as necessary until you get an opening to strike,  once you hit them continually circle and keep chopping,  if you time your blows well there isn't much they can do.

Bump-slash-  moving at low speed, continually trample and slash your victim,  this is especially powerful against archers or shield users. the trample damage lowers their guard allowing your following attack to hit them.
[EDIT]  horses with a high charge stat excel at this, because lighter horses rear too much.  avoid knocking into infantry squarely head on, as this usualy results in rearing,  hit them at an angle.

Harassing-  More of a diversion than an attack,  harassing is usually used against spearmen or highly skilled dangerous players,  you continually circle your target keeping out of his weapon range,  forcing him to keep his attention on you- allowing a teammate to attack from behind.  The best way to do this is to keep speeding up and slowing down at random, as well as pulling away and closing in-  feinting a charge, not only does this make you harder to keep track of, it makes you appear more threatening (which is the point of the harassing tactic)  and if he sees what your doing and pulls his attention away you can sweep in and slash his back.

Reverse-Slash Basicaly using the 'wrong' attack direction,  ie: a right and swing on your left side,  this can confuse your targets block, hit behind sheilds and make yourself a little less predictable.  overheads and stabs can also be used to get past blocks, but they miss a lot.
[from Shik]
As an avid mounted sword-user, one little trick I'd like to add is the reverse slash. Basically, when you use either the left to right swing or right to left swing, you can flip to the other side - that is, use the right to left swing on your left side or your left to right swing on your right side; this helps to trick enemy player's blocks and can be quite effective when the situation is not suited for your normal swing.
[from Ursca]-
you can use a backwards slash to hit the back side of a shield user as you go past, which is useful.


How to deal with specific units

1handed infantry- one of your easiest targets,  a ride-by or a circle attack will do the trick.  take note of how long his weapon is,  if it is short then you can ride just outside of his range and hit him,  if it is longer then you will have to time your attack well to avoid being hit.  bumpslashing works very well here
[from Uscra]
another good trick against infantry is to move past, then cut a really tight curve behind them, probably trampling them a couple of times if you have a horse with good charge, and slash as you do so.
-this is basicaly combining the circle attack with the bumpslash

2handed infantry- a tougher target,  a ride-by wont work unless he doesn't know its coming.  circle-attacking will work if you are good and you can catch him off guard,  but generally you need the element of surprise to take down a 2hander. if you can get a hit in, then you can attempt to bumpslash them to death.
going slow tends to work best here-  if you go too fast they will just get a 1-hit-kill on you.

Spearmen/Pikemen/Long weapon infantry - The hardest target you will face.  a ride-by is impossible unless they don't see you,  and a circle attack will most likely not work either.  Harassing is the only real option-  keep them occupied so others can take them down, or move in when they draw their attention away.  but when faced with a pikeman the best thing to do is avoid them and move on,  they are designed with the purpose of stopping you getting close.
A single good stab will make your horse rear, which will probably be the end of you unless you can get out of there quick.
[EDIT][from RaVeN]
  Block down/block thrust with your sword and ride sideways or diagnally around the spear/pikeman. After they released their thrust and you blocked successfully, ride at them immediately, bump them sideways and slash. The key is to get as close as possible by riding sideways and not straight because polearms cannot thrust effectively, block a thrust, bump to stun them and releash a slash.
  -  be careful with this,  as if the spearman aims at your horse instead it will rear, and he will make short work of you.
[From Uscra]
The thing to do with spearmen and 2h users is to move slightly out of reach, let them attack and miss slightly, then swoop in and slash them before they can prepare another attack.
[From okiN]-
The trick is not to expose the front of your horse. That way, even if they stab it, it won't rear up, and you can turn hard and swoop in for the kill. Obviously it'll still take damage, though, which is a bummer. But sometimes you can fake them out into stabbing at nothing, and if your horse is maneuverable enough, that lets you turn in quickly and get the kill again.

Archers/Xbowmen- your easiest target,  Lancers will have a hard time fighting them but you will make mincemeat out of them.  to get close you should vary your speed and direction to throw of their shots,  and when close simply don't let them get far enough away to get a shot,  bumpslash them to death.

Lancers- DO NOT ATTACK HEAD ON, you will die.  you 'can' feint a head on charge and pull away at the last moment, slashing as you pass but this is very very risky.  your best bet is to use your agility to attack from their flanks or rear,  and remember-  you can attack at any speed, whereas they can only couch at high speed, use this to your advantage.

Horse Archers- close match up,  attempt to dodge their arrows, and use your shield (2handed cavalry is not an option here),  its all about mobility,  outwit them and try and cut in front of their path when possible.

Mounted Melee-  even match up,  you can use similar tactics as with lancers and horse archers-  its all about mobility,  cut in front of their path and slash as you do. don't put yourself where they can hit you, and attempt to get the drop on them with a surprise attack.



--------------------Hope this helps, I may write more of these if this gets positive feedback.  Feel free to add to this and I will edit it in. cheers :grin:-------------
 
tl;dr

I'll read it in a bit, though, and I'm glad you wrote it. Mounted swordsmanship is pretty great, very fun way to play. I've been doing it a lot lately, and I daresay I'm quite good at it, as my many victims may attest. :wink:
 
I have cursed that Rhodok pick quite a few times yesterday (or was it the day before :???:), Disgruntled_Peasant :razz:. Good guide.
 
Interesting and informative, I do prefer both lancing and mounted slashing, both excel at their own situation, though bump slashing's something I'd avoid, since horses tend to rear when you don't want them to even if it's a single infantry.
 
Varric said:
Interesting and informative, I do prefer both lancing and mounted slashing, both excel at their own situation, though bump slashing's something I'd avoid, since horses tend to rear when you don't want them to even if it's a single infantry.

yeah, but not so much with hunters-  and only if you ride directly into them.  i probably should have gone into more detail on how to bumpslash (in fact, i'll edit that in now).

basicaly you hit them at an angle, with the side of your horse-  not squarely head on. partly to avoid rearing and partly so you can follow up with a swing.
 
Against a spearman/pikeman:

Block down/block thrust with your sword and ride sideways or diagnally around the spear/pikeman. After they released their thrust and you blocked successfully, ride at them immediately, bump them sideways and slash. The key is to get as close as possible by riding sideways and not straight because polearms cannot thrust effectively, block a thrust, bump to stun them and releash a slash.

That is what I do.
 
RaVeN said:
Against a spearman/pikeman:

Block down/block thrust with your sword and ride sideways or diagnally around the spear/pikeman. After they released their thrust and you blocked successfully, ride at them immediately, bump them sideways and slash. The key is to get as close as possible by riding sideways and not straight because polearms cannot thrust effectively, block a thrust, bump to stun them and releash a slash.

That is what I do.

I'll add it,    but if the pikeman aims for your horse instead of you, he will rear it and will make short work of you. and a spear is a fast weapon, it can spam at you enough so you can hit back.
 
Another harassing tactic I sometime use is to threaten as much as possible dangerous opponents, especially 2 handers, I go in front of them, the i go backward, and same thnig on the side, this will force them to  release some blows at nothing, giving you the time to rush at them and cut their eyebrows. It doesn't always work, as some 2 handers are really skilled at releasing a blow at the perfect moment, so take the time to size up your opponent's skills and improvize.
Adding a new agile khergit horse would make the khergit class a lot more enjoyable for everyone, but the current one is pretty good.

I often use the khergit 2handers, they are pretty usefull, but not to use against some opponents, especially when they grouped, as you can't really block the blows aimed at you.
But the high damage is perfect to hit some crossbowmen or archers who didn't see you, and to kill them instantly.

But some kinds of long maces and hammers and more cavalry sword would make everything even more enjoyable.
 
:evil: great, now everyone knows how to handle a horse and sword right... 

nothing more that i can add except that hunters are better then stepp... the extra toughness makes up for decreased maneuver. 

And do always bring a lance, even the free one.
 
Nothing can make mountec combat as good as it should be, in my opinion it needs some different attack animations so that you can actually hit the oponent instead of swinging over his head.
 
bgfan said:
Nothing can make mountec combat as good as it should be, in my opinion it needs some different attack animations so that you can actually hit the oponent instead of swinging over his head.
Longer cavalry swords then? The swads short swords could be changed and so on.
 
bgfan said:
Nothing can make mountec combat as good as it should be, in my opinion it needs some different attack animations so that you can actually hit the oponent instead of swinging over his head.

it takes some practice to get the aim right,  but the animations are not at fault,  im assuming your playing as you did in singelplayer-    where you let the animation hit the player by itself,  in warband you have to aim the animation,    keep your target in the centre of your veiw as you pass and you will hit him.
if you look straight ahead as you swing, you are swinging horisontaly-  and since your on a horse, thats gonna be above your targets head.

EDIT:  big_mac,  I do agree that it would be nice to have cavalry swords for more factions,  but even the swad short arming sword can hit infantry at high speed once you get the aim right.
 
Big_Mac said:
bgfan said:
Nothing can make mountec combat as good as it should be, in my opinion it needs some different attack animations so that you can actually hit the oponent instead of swinging over his head.
Longer cavalry swords then? The swads short swords could be changed and so on.

a combination of both would be best
 
CtrlAltDe1337 said:
BTW the new faction is called Sarranid, not Saradin.

Edited,  thanks :razz:  I allways spell it wrong,  same with Rhodok and Veiger  (or whatever they are :razz:)
 
As an avid mounted sword-user, one little trick I'd like to add is the reverse slash. Basically, when you use either the left to right swing or right to left swing, you can flip to the other side - that is, use the right to left swing on your left side or your left to right swing on your right side; this helps to trick enemy player's blocks and can be quite effective when the situation is not suited for your normal swing.

The bump-thrust and overhead attacks have their uses in certain situations as well.
 
Shik said:
As an avid mounted sword-user, one little trick I'd like to add is the reverse slash. Basically, when you use either the left to right swing or right to left swing, you can flip to the other side - that is, use the right to left swing on your left side or your left to right swing on your right side; this helps to trick enemy player's blocks and can be quite effective when the situation is not suited for your normal swing.
You can use a backwards slash to hit the back side of a shield user as you go past, which is useful.

But yes, nice thread. With an agile horse, you can really out-dance infantry and perform some neat manoeuvres. The thing to do with spearmen and 2h users is to move slightly out of reach, let them attack and miss slightly, then swoop in and slash them before they can prepare another attack.
And at the risk of giving away my precious secrets, another good trick against infantry is to move past, then cut a really tight curve behind them, probably trampling them a couple of times if you have a horse with good charge, and slash as you do so.

You can achieve some remarkable finesse sometimes.
 
Qwertyman said:
I'll add it,    but if the pikeman aims for your horse instead of you, he will rear it and will make short work of you. and a spear is a fast weapon, it can spam at you enough so you can hit back.

The trick is not to expose the front of your horse. That way, even if they stab it, it won't rear up, and you can turn hard and swoop in for the kill. Obviously it'll still take damage, though, which is a bummer. But sometimes you can fake them out into stabbing at nothing, and if your horse is maneuverable enough, that lets you turn in quickly and get the kill again.

A_Mustang said:
nothing more that i can add except that hunters are better then stepp... the extra toughness makes up for decreased maneuver. 

I disagree strongly, but that's a matter of personal preference, I guess.

And yeah, as Shik pointed out, the reverse slash is very useful indeed. A lot of people never see it coming.
 
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