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Earl_of_Rochester

Hello my darlings,

This topic is directed towards our foreign counterparts across the globe, as I am quite awful at foreign languages it is by the grace of God that many websites are written in English. This is indeed a blessing for me, tho I hear once those Chinese Commies start to industrialise properly then a few things might change, but in the meantime I think it's fair to say that the English tongue is paramount for international communication & offers a common language for all to be understood.

Which brings me to consider the question, that there are words in foreign languages that exist but have entirely no translation in English. If we do not have a word for that event are we even aware then that these events & feelings take place?

i.e. ‘Beerexpectation’- this could be a word in a foreign language to describe the exhilarating feeling of drinking a cold beer on a hot day, yet there are no words in English to describe it.

Ergo, I must ask the dirty foreigners if they might be obliged to offer a little of their linguistic expertise for this philosophical topic & enlighten the rest of us with some words of wisdom.

I have the honour, &c.

~EoR
 
Earl_of_Rochester said:
Ergo, I must ask the dirty dear foreigners if they might be obliged to offer a little of their linguistic expertise for this philosophical topic & enlighten the rest of us with some words of wisdom.
Click to expand...

I fixed that tiny, surely not intentional flaw above.
However, I'll forgive you that one cause you came up with a pretty interesting topic (at least for a freetime-pseudo-linguist like me).

To be quite honest, I don't have one of those words in mind right now. I'm sure there are a lot existing in German, I'll come back to it, as soon as I can think of something.
Generally, there are tons of not only single lexical items but also idioms and phrases in many languages that have no exact correspondence in English. Yet, there are many, which have a very clear equivalent with almost literal translation of each word, since they are based on a very similar metaphorical image for example.

Others have to be replaced by similar idioms that can't be translated literally. And very often, people with a somewhat decent intelligence can figure out the meaning  of unknown words /phrases even if they never heard about them before.
 
Adviser said:
Do we need to try and translate the words somehow or just describe the meaning of it?
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I guess both would be interesting: First of all a description, then a possible ready-to-use translation into English.
Thus, we can enrich the vast English lexicon even more, hurrah! Condition is, that EoR starts using and spreading the words, I count on you, Earl :wink:
 
Well these words are from Meänkieli: kläppi, which usually means lapsi and is translated as child, knapsu, which means naisellinen mies and is translated as man who is feminine, källi, which means hauska and is translated as funny, pranttu which means kasvimaa and is translated as vegetable garden, kartano, which means piha and is translated as  yard, kahveli which means haarukka and is translated as fork, häntyyki, which means käsipyyhe and is translated as handtowel, saikata, which means värkätä and is translated as tinker. Going to add more when i find some more.
 
I shall endeavour to implement an Anglophonic translation service as an unofficial poet-laureate, as an Englishman I speak Her Majesty’s English & am at liberty to create new words as I wish. Tho I must be careful, our cousins over the pond speak that ghastly bastardised-colonial version & have tried to alter the language to their own cause, one wouldn’t want to be associated for tampering with a word that already exists.  :wink:

~EoR
 
It's usually a syntactic problem rather than a lacking word or concept. While certain languages can create a cognate, for example the German schadenfreude, others cannot because of grammatical or syntactic rules. English has several two word phrases for the same meaning, but under English syntax you cannot create a one word equivalent, except as a proper noun.
I mean if you do the same thing in English you end up with HarmJoy, which sounds wrong. Unless it's a name, but then it sounds awfully Dickensian.
 
Adviser said:
Well these words are from Meänkieli: kläppi, which usually means lapsi and is translated as child, knapsu, which means naisellinen mies and is translated as man who is feminine, källi, which means hauska and is translated as funny, pranttu which means kasvimaa and is translated as vegetable garden, kartano, which means piha and is translated as  yard, kahveli which means haarukka and is translated as fork, häntyyki, which means käsipyyhe and is translated as handtowel, saikata, which means värkätä and is translated as tinker. Going to add more when i find some more.
Click to expand...

An interesting list, tho are there any that exist that describe a desire or an emotion that we ignorant English have no conception of?

~EoR
 
Don't we just absorb words and phrases from other languages (and vice versa) already? Or am I getting deja vu over your schadenfraud?
 
tommyboy said:
Don't we just absorb words and phrases from other languages (and vice versa) already? Or am I getting deja vu over your schadenfraud?
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Of course. Exchange of linguistic material happens always and in many languages. The degree and direction of exchange can vary of course.

As Archonsod said, it's often a problem with syntax that may result from different language types. That's probably why I stick with phrases and present this german example:

Imagine the following situation somewhere in Germany.
Mrs. Fleischer is very angry, she is exceedingly angry, because she just found out that her young, rebellious son spent another night going on World of Warcraft raids, with a second account (Mrs. Fleischer deleted the first one and with it two lvl 60 characters). She screams at her son, bangs her remarkably strong fists on the table and accuses her son of many things, not only the WoW abuse but also alcohol abuse, not helping in the household and pubertal behaviour in general. Long story short: Mrs. Fleischer is mad, the son has tears in his eyes.

In German you would now say: " Der Junge hat einen ordentlichen Einlauf gekriegt!"
Literal translation: " The boy received a proper clyster!"

Now let's see what you can do with this. Maybe it exists already in English and I successfully wasted time on the forums again.
 
In English we'd say he got a bollocking, or a barracking if we were being polite :lol:.

Most European languages follow similar rules, so it's less prevalent between them. Particularly when looking at those with the same root. It's when you look at languages which change the entire structure that you start to get the more out there occurrences.

Earl_of_Rochester said:
An interesting list, tho are there any that exist that describe a desire or an emotion that we ignorant English have no conception of?
Click to expand...
Doubtful. I think it's safe to assume most cultures had fully explored their full range of emotions and desires long before any modern language came about :lol:
 
The term "gezelligheid" in Dutch means something like a cross between 'cosiness', 'companionship, 'warmth' and perhaps 'familiarity.' If something or someone would be found to be 'gezellig' (ie: pertaining to or possessing 'gezelligheid'), then you can count on them to be friendly, talkative and caring, more or less. None of those terms are actually accurate translations, though. The only word that spring to mind that has a similar meaning would be the German "Gemütlichkeit."

Ááánd as it turns out, "Gemütlichkeit" as been  accepted more or less in the English vocabulary, so I'm not adding much here. :razz:
 
I'm not sure if the german 'Gemütlichkeit' includes that notion of familiarity, Frisian.

Adviser said:
Read: Meänkieli.
Click to expand...

What kind/type of language is that? Related to Finnish/Suomi?

Archonsod said:
I think it's safe to assume most cultures had fully explored their full range of emotions and desires long before any modern language came about :lol:
Click to expand...

Sure.
But concerning the possibilties of encoding concepts with linguistic structures there are many crazy things out there. I just think of the variety of cases for the weirdest things in Finnish (please correct me if I'm wrong here).

 
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