How to invade Russia?

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Almalexia

Her Flamboyance, the Calipha
Duke
So, throughout history, Russia has been invaded many times. From the Mongols, to the Swedes, to the French, and lastly, by the Germans. However, every time they have failed. The only one who was able to control (in a fairly loose term of the word) Russia for any extended period of time was the Mongols, or the Golden Horde, if you prefer, and that was only due to their high mobility and letting the Russians rule themselves, for the most part, and even then they were driven out after a hundred years or so. However, Napoleon's invasion set precedent for the next invasions, as it was there that the Russians revealed their main tactic: slash and burn, retreat, wait till General Winter, their most deadly ally, sets in, harass, then advance. Even when the Germans invaded, wise of Napoleon's mistake, they could not take Russia.

So, is there any conceivable way to invade, defeat, and occupy Russia? I have been thinking about this for around a year now and I still have not found a solution that does not require the use of nuclear weaponry, which I, and indeed, most of us, would like to avoid using.
 
Tiberius Decimus Maximus said:
and that was only due to their high mobility and letting the Russians rule themselves

You forgot the part about Russia not EXISTING as a unified political entity at that time. :razz:

I guess the strategic answer is to push them far enough east that they no longer have the big cities/infrastructure/resources to continue fighting, although how the act of pushing them that far east would be done tactically I have no idea.
 
Tiberius Decimus Maximus said:
So, is there any conceivable way to invade, defeat, and occupy Russia? I have been thinking about this for around a year now and I still have not found a solution that does not require the use of nuclear weaponry, which I, and indeed, most of us, would like to avoid using.
Yes. Invade DURING THE ****ING SUMMER.
 
Archonsod said:
Tiberius Decimus Maximus said:
So, is there any conceivable way to invade, defeat, and occupy Russia? I have been thinking about this for around a year now and I still have not found a solution that does not require the use of nuclear weaponry, which I, and indeed, most of us, would like to avoid using.
Yes. Invade DURING THE ****ING SUMMER.

Or in April/May...?

The biggest problem is that the guys who have invaded Russia have either had a poorly equipped army, or too few men.

I think USA could manage to beat Russia, it would cost millions of lives on both sides, but at least USA have the equipment and manpower to do it.

Germany could have done it with a bit better tactics and a few more million men. If Germany had 10 million soldiers on the east front instead of 3 million, what would happen? And 40k armoured weapons (both counting tanks and the assault gun, like the STUG) instead of 20k..?

USA could field an army of 20 million or way more if they wanted to.

And... If the Russians retreat and wait for winter, then you do the same. Fall back, dig in and wait for spring.

Remember that it is also possible to fight Russia on two fronts, no one have tried that before. Stalin thought he would fight on two fronts in WW2 so he stacked a vast army of his best troops up in Siberia in case of an invasion from Japan. If Japan had invaded, Germany would not have to face this fresh army outside Moscow and in Stalingrad.

USA have the capability to invade Russia on two fronts and maintain it.

It would be hard, the death toll would be millions on each side, maybe even tens of millions. But why would USA invade Russia?

On the same not, I think Russia would be the only country able to invade USA, with a few years preparations, but again why would they?

In some time I think China would be able to field an army big enough and strong enough to do the same (either invade Russia or USA), but that would take several years I think, perhaps 10, 15 years.
 
Get someone else to try and do the dirty work of weakening it?
Then attack in the spring before it can recover.
And get a decent logistic system going.


Mirror said:
Nuke it. Wait to see their response. Nuke that too.

Tiberius Decimus Maximus said:
So, is there any conceivable way to invade, defeat, and occupy Russia?

You're supposed to survive, genius.
 
hyperion said:
Get someone else to try and do the dirty work of weakening it?
Then attack in the spring before it can recover.
And get a decent logistic system going.


Mirror said:
Nuke it. Wait to see their response. Nuke that too.

Tiberius Decimus Maximus said:
So, is there any conceivable way to invade, defeat, and occupy Russia?

You're supposed to survive, genius.

Didn't mention nuking myself. Wind will take it into Siberia if lucky.
 
Send in the only other military that is used to winter warfare.... The Canadians!

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Why bother invading atall? Just let them sit around drinking vodka, violating women and getting into fights with eacho....

Oh.
 
Why not just nab somewhere like Saudi Arabia. Also, you don't have to conquer and occupy a country to take it's oil :grin:
 
stygN said:
Germany could have done it with a bit better tactics and a few more million men. If Germany had 10 million soldiers on the east front instead of 3 million, what would happen? And 40k armoured weapons (both counting tanks and the assault gun, like the STUG) instead of 20k..?
They had enough men at materiels. If the Germans had commenced their offensive against Russia a mere month or two earlier they would have crushed the Russians. It was the weather, not the Red Army, that defeated them. Worst winter on record too, IIRC.
 
Archonsod said:
stygN said:
Germany could have done it with a bit better tactics and a few more million men. If Germany had 10 million soldiers on the east front instead of 3 million, what would happen? And 40k armoured weapons (both counting tanks and the assault gun, like the STUG) instead of 20k..?
They had enough men at materiels. If the Germans had commenced their offensive against Russia a mere month or two earlier they would have crushed the Russians. It was the weather, not the Red Army, that defeated them. Worst winter on record too, IIRC.

December 1941 was indeed the worst winter on record.

Talk about bad luck eh?
 
Archonsod said:
stygN said:
Germany could have done it with a bit better tactics and a few more million men. If Germany had 10 million soldiers on the east front instead of 3 million, what would happen? And 40k armoured weapons (both counting tanks and the assault gun, like the STUG) instead of 20k..?
They had enough men at materiels. If the Germans had commenced their offensive against Russia a mere month or two earlier they would have crushed the Russians. It was the weather, not the Red Army, that defeated them. Worst winter on record too, IIRC.

I would say this is something to debate. I have not heard that if they had launched 2 months earlier they'd crush the Russians 100% sure.

And you also say that the massive army Stalin had in Siberia had nothing to do with the defeat of the Germans? Did the winter push them all the way back to Berlin?

The winter and the bad planning is of course the main factors, but without reinforcements from Siberia the Germans would have a fair chance in Moscow and Stalingrad, even with lord Winter smashing them.

If Japan had invaded Russia instead of going on an island hop they would have tied up the forces in Siberia.

That would have helped the Germans more then a mild winter.

AFAIK, mud slowed down the Germans more then snow and frost did...
 
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