Your Educational reforms

Inspired by the (now locked) rant thread by Sonzai...

Let's say you're the head official of Generic Prosperous Democratic Western Nation. You are given absolute control over the educational system in your nation, from kindergarten all the way up to and including graduate programs. You are given an arbitrarily large amount of funds to enact the reforms (or, if you prefer, build one up from scratch), but excessive waste of cash will be frowned upon. As for ethical parameters, assume general "Western" ethical standards (that means no lobotomies on disobedient children, no torture as corporal punishment, etc. You're running educational programs, not death camps  ) What subjects will students be required to take? What subjects will be banned? Why? Will students be required to extra curricular activies, or will they be encouraged to do so? Or will all such timewasters be utterly banned, requiring students to focus on only academic subjects?

Feel free to post humorous ideas (BRAINWASHING CAMPS FOR MY FUTURE ARMY BWA HA HA), but please keep the thread as serious as possible.

Disband the DES, or whatever its called now, schools, families and ****.

I think there should at least be some sort of half hour debate in classes every week on current affairs. If the moderator is well clued up about the subject in question, it could save millions of school children each year from being beaten and ridiculed on internet forums

Final grades should be marked on work within the classroom, rather than just strictly controlled coursework and examinations. This would perhaps show that the student worked hard constantly, rather than just regurgitating stuff onto a piece of paper every year or two. Yes, it would be nigh on impossible to implement but it might be handy for those who are good in class but terrible at taking exams.

Weekly or monthly meetings with academic advisors. These meetings would be designed to focus on strengths/interests, plan out means for accomplishing goals, and provide feedback and advice on past successes/failures.

Wiki-surfing should be a subject. Finding out about **** that interests you is something the elementaries could use. Who in here hasn't lost himself in the magical world of Wikipedia?

interestingly enough, tonight there was a little epidode on tv about using some of the many millions spent by the australian gov to keep kids in school, to actually help them get out. studies showed once a child was 16 and was no longer interested in school, keeping them there for 2 extra years actually made their grades worse, and empacted them poorly in the long run, after school. i won't doubt it either. i know of a friend who sort to get an apprenticship in mechanics or something, his parents wouldn't have a bar of it. well two years late he finished up, with minimum grades of course as he only did what was needed to pass. got himself an apprenticship through TAFE, though only after 2 more years in that study. .... working for a bloke his age, who had left school 4 years prior and was now obviously working for himself.

i say let the kids who want to study, study. those who arn't cut out for school, or do not require further study in english, history and so on, especialy if they are going to be a mechanic. the educational board should have some sort of funding. considering the trade shortage in Australia at the moment, it couldn't hurt. as for the ins and outs, i've been out of school too long, things have surly changed a fair bit in 12 years. 

Pagan said:

those who arn't cut out for school, or do not require further study in english, history and so on, especialy if they are going to be a mechanic. the educational board should have some sort of funding. considering the trade shortage in Australia at the moment, it couldn't hurt. as for the ins and outs, i've been out of school too long, things have surly changed a fair bit in 12 years. 

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Considering the trade shortage at the moment, that's what their doing. Note that it was his parents who wouldn't let him, not the school holding him back.

I do, however, beleive that there should be trainiee ships via school for the senior years, not dropping out of school entirely

I would make almost everything digital, but the most important thing of them all, it would be fun to study and you would have the complete control over your subjects and the subjects would be customizable.
Basics of the Mathematics, Physical education, Geography and Language would be the only subjects that you couldn't customize or remove.

What do you mean "make everything digital". Electronic books? Distance learning (ie no classrooms?)?

How would you prevent cheating?

Maths is easier with real paper and real people explaining it.

Mage246 said:

What do you mean "make everything digital". Electronic books? Distance learning (ie no classrooms?)?

How would you prevent cheating?

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Every student would get some sort of computer or whatever you call it, with the size of an A4 the whole front would have a touchscreen and it would be rather thickness of an ipod. it would of course synchronize with the school server or some other device.

Mage246 said:

Weekly or monthly meetings with academic advisors. These meetings would be designed to focus on strengths/interests, plan out means for accomplishing goals, and provide feedback and advice on past successes/failures.

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I'll have to agree. We did that (and will do next year) as part of the Welsh Baccalaureate twice a term, and was quite handy to see where you (and tutor) thought you would be in 2 months' time. Feedback is handy if you are pessimistic about acheivments.

Yeah, and there's absolutely no reason why anyone should be in college but have no idea what they want to do with their life. College is short enough without the first year or two being wasted trying to figure that out.

I am pretty happy with the way it is now, but lets just say this "generic democratic nation" is having problems teaching its native language (not english). Mainly becuase it is hated for its lack of accessible books and iron nosed teachers, a welcome change would be in order, out with the old in with the new.

Mage246 said:

Yeah, and there's absolutely no reason why anyone should be in college but have no idea what they want to do with their life. College is short enough without the first year or two being wasted trying to figure that out.

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So, uh...when ARE you supposed to decide, then? High School? 

I'm about to start college after summer and I STILL don't know what I should major in. I'm rather conflicted you see.

13 Spider Bloody Chain said:

Mage246 said:

Yeah, and there's absolutely no reason why anyone should be in college but have no idea what they want to do with their life. College is short enough without the first year or two being wasted trying to figure that out.

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So, uh...when ARE you supposed to decide, then? High School? 

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Ideally, yes.

I'm about to start college after summer and I STILL don't know what I should major in. I'm rather conflicted you see.

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See, this is exactly what I'm talking about. By the time you're 17-18, you should have some idea of what you want to do. I'm not blaming you for not knowing, it's not your fault. Frankly there aren't nearly enough opportunities in the schools for students to have that kind of conversation with a teacher. Unless you're lucky  and form a close bond with a mentor who helps you out, you're pretty much clueless. I should know, I went through that.

Oh God, I'd like to make so many changes, but I'm not entirely sure what they all are. 

Ehm...


'Tiered' secondary schooling - some kids excel academically at everything they do, whereas some kids simply aren't ever going to be doctors of physics. So, the focus should be moved from teaching the kids about everything in huge detail to finding a skill that the kid is good at and enjoys, and training them in that, but retaining a founding in the essentials. So, in a way, bring back the technical colleges and the like, and get rid of this drive to eliminate selective schools, but for non-academic schools still make sure that the students get a grounding in Maths and English, and some studies of other cultures and religions, because I'm personally a firm believer that most of the racism and mistrust that goes on is largely a result of a lack of understanding.

So, you'd end up with technical/vocational colleges for those who're best at practical skills, but still teaching the real core subjects, selective schools for the academically gifted, with an aim to getting the students into university, and 'middle ground' schools for those who aren't necessarily academically gifted but are still academically capable, with an aim to getting those students into good work that suits their place on the 'academic/technical scale', as it were.

More religious/cultural education, for the reason I put out above.

More, and more varied sports and activities. One hour a week in school is pretty dismal. I'd like to see at least two and a half, with the option for more provided after school - seems the sports clubs and suchlike are dying off, from what I see.

More options to go abroad with school. The only real trips/exchanges the schools seem to do are to France and Germany. What about the rest of the world? Hell, even the rest of Western Europe would be a start (languages the students are likely to learn in school). And on that note, more language options should be available for study.

Mage246 said:

See, this is exactly what I'm talking about. By the time you're 17-18, you should have some idea of what you want to do. I'm not blaming you for not knowing, it's not your fault. Frankly there aren't nearly enough opportunities in the schools for students to have that kind of conversation with a teacher. Unless you're lucky  and form a close bond with a mentor who helps you out, you're pretty much clueless. I should know, I went through that.

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Gotcha. At the same time though, I'm not sure if the average high school student will know enough about various subjects to decide what he/she wants to do.

Example: Unless you go to an extremely high level, oh, middle school or secondary school, chances are you won't know too much about in-depth biology. Sure, learning silly memes about the phylums and kingdoms and sniggering at the scientific names of critters is fun and all, but that's certainly not what hardcore, Merentha's-major biology. Thus, if you were thinking about becoming a biologist, you'd want to at least have a taste of what hardcore bio is, right?

However, I don't think hardcore bio is something that an American 10th grader (or so) can easily handle. Or if not biology, maybe history (I got a taste of what real, college level research is like during the 1st semester of senior year, and as fun and intense as it was, I don't think what I went through might have been entirely appropriate for a kid two or three years my junior), or maths, etc. By forcing kids to choose earlier, I think you're also forcing kids to learn stuff they might not be able to handle quite yet. True, having a dedicated mentor figure would help that (and in this hypothetical exercise, the logistics won't be as difficult), but I'm not entirely comfortable about making decisions about the rest of my life just because of an explanation that a middle-aged teacher gave me.

Over time, I would use the money as a one-time subsidy for private education for various income levels, dismiss all but the most basic government bureaucracy and requirements for teaching, and let capitalism (through standardized tests, student transfers and self-actualized school reforms) regulate which teachers and schools stay in business, and which ones will be culled. Low income students would also have vouchers that would negate a certain amount of taxes the school would need to pay by educating that person, so that low income schools would have an economic reason to exist. Education should be like eating at a restaurant. If they food is bad, go somewhere else. If the food is really bad, they go out of business.

I say this from a perspective of a person studying to be a teacher. As it is in the USA, there is no capacity for a school to separate the homemaker-turned-state-employed-babysitter from the people who actually know what they are talking about. There is also little ability for students to choose which school they attend, so people who live in low-income regions, despite their own income, can only receive public education from an equally low income school.

Plainly, there is simply too much bureaucracy. It should be up to a particular school what they teach and how they teach it, and a student's choice of which school to attend, not a national bureau.

Also, I would outlaw government student loans and grants. They do nothing but increase the cost of tuition.

John Staussel summed it up : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx4pN-aiofw

The P.E. teacher in our school tells everybody in his class to put a £10 each and whoever gets the best results at the end of the year gets the money. My year was the first year he did it and all the mock results are excellent, the best in years, and so he's doing it with the lower 6ths. It may be a crude way of doing things, but it works. He could also get in big trouble, but he's the vice anyway.

Anyway I'm happy with NI's way of teaching, but their doing all this ****e and ****ing it up, like getting rid of the 11+ exam, making all schools have a minimum of 600, getting rid of grammar schools and so on.
But things I would change would be to stop bringing tech teachers to teach so A-Level subjects. I ****ed up last year since they didn't tell us what to do for the coursework 2 weeks before the deadline, not coming in to teach etc. They got fired so **** them.
Have a more diverse method of teaching, as some people are more vocal at learning, some more visual and so a mixture of methods should be used thoughout each topic.
Make GCSE's harder! Some people find them difficult already, but that's what the different tiers are for. I remember doing **** all for GCSE's, getting good grades and having a great ole time. Then went into A-level doing physics and biology. Sweet ****. Physics in GCSE was piss easy, so I assumed the same in AS. I was wrong.