Fantastic mod! One big issue though...

[HappyCompy]

If I may add to that, Jackx, it seems as though the muskets' have a very limited range as well. They feel more like crossbows (which isn't all that surprising, considering that's what they're based on) as the bullet drops off very quickly. You have to arch the musket at moderate to long ranges. I think a boost in projectile speed would fix the issue, is that something that can be done with Morgh's editing tools?

[GABRILDURO]

If I may add to that, Jackx, it seems as though the muskets' have a very limited range as well. They feel more like crossbows (which isn't all that surprising, considering that's what they're based on) as the bullet drops off very quickly. You have to arch the musket at moderate to long ranges. I think a boost in projectile speed would fix the issue, is that something that can be done with Morgh's editing tools?

It is the "Shot speed value", which was actually meant low, since otherwise troops shoot from one side of battlefield to another....
Shot speed for:
Knives should stay below 25
axes    should stay below 30
bows   should stay below 40
flintlock pistols                50
flintlock muskets             60
rifled     muskets             70/80

But.....I was thinking, and now I am testing.....to switch Muskets (crossbows) and Pistols (bullits), in order to have a better result, all over.

Oh, and thx for your upload
....next time just ask, though....cuz I already progressed with my own personal unofficial 1776 files and your work cannot be integrated, now ...or I d loose my progress....

@ META, I explained everything here:
http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php/topic,147421.msg4967410.html#msg4967410

...and about Crumbs, yes...he is my best friend and mate, ever!!!
I had always to insist so much to get an opinion from him. He would always say: It is YOUR mod, Gab. You decide! Just tell me what you need...
But at the end he d always come out with his own idea, and the 2 of us got along so well, as brothers.
I got informed why he had to leave for this while, but info is reserved, sorry.

His full profile:
http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php?action=profile;u=60266;area=showposts;sa=messages

Gab

[HappyCompy]

Thanks for those values. I think I might try and change them to be like the ones from fire and sword (in Fire and Sword they shoot across the battlefield just like you described  )

However, as far as uploading my personal edit, I apologize for not asking first. It was only meant to be a quick emergency fix for those players who want reloading on the move right now. I removed the link.

Also, we appreciate your continued work on this great mod!


One last question, how were you able to mod crouch into the game?

EDIT: I changed musket damage and shot speed to reflect the ones from WFaS, and I must say I am impressed. The A.I. appears to handle them better with the change, landing more accurate shots. The range of the muskets is much larger, which may or may not be what you wanted. It's your mod, and only you can decide how you want it, but I will share my results with you for information's sake. (by the way, thank you (and jackx) again for showing me how to change the values)

For most of the muskets I simply added a 1 to the current shot speed (so a Long Land Pattern Musket with 53 shot speed became 153). I lowered them a bit for the carbines (140ish range), and the damage was lowered to the 80's and 90's for muskets and rifles, and 70s for carbines. Blunderbuss was left at very high damage. Pistols' damage was left unchanged, but shot speed was increased to 90-120.

[imgran]

The 1755 firearms work well in their specific context, and just from looking at the stats, the 1776 firearms should do the same, yet for some reason, the AI can't hit anything half the time, even when they're literally right next to a target.
I'll concede that part of this might simply be that in 1776, battle continuation provides more opportunity to observe the AI perform (poorly), and since it's just SP at this point, I'm also willing to accept the odd instance of random bad luck, but there's still something that doesn't feel right, the AI draws a blank when it comes to effective aiming/shooting too often, without me being able to point to a specific cause for it.
I actually raised the accuracy to ~ 1755 levels, which made shooting considerably easier for me, but seemed to produce no noticeable change for the AI.

                                                                                                          1860 / 1775
I have noticed it also Jackx. I am used to having my massive line of rifles/muskets slaughter oncoming troops with my awesome volleys, and when i try that here it seems to fail and troops stagger through and cause my men to melee with them and not fire, grrr. This seems to mostly occur when there is less than 2-3 rifles per target or the AI has picked one or 2 men, out of their entire army, to fire at. I understand that muskets, on some rifles, at this time were somewhat inaccurate, but firing a volley of 70-80 (medium-Top tier) muskets at an enemy line of 70-80, at about 20-30 yards, should at least yield 20 casualties, not 5-6. Unfortunately, as Jackx said, this makes them ineffective vs melee units.

Ps. Gabby, where did you get the URL for that signature, i have been meaning to change it but i haven't been able to find it. Possibly the signature thread of 1860's

PPs. How exactly did the whole "Gabby's bunch" thing fall apart, i am curios to know, and where did that guy "Crumbs" go, i used to see him on the forums a while back. Pm me if you choose to respond. Ciao

That's actually pretty historic.  Not a lot of battles were settled in the 1700's with an exchange of volleys.  Volley fire was like artillery fire, its purpose was to soften up the enemy line for the bayonet charge, which is where most of the damage in a given battle was done.  Only with the rifle bore near the end of the century did sharpshooting become anywhere near accurate enough to be more than a nuisance.

In Bunker Hill for example, the British had no trouble getting to the top of the hill several times.  They were pushed back by good supporting fire and fortifications that allowed the underequipped and undertrained American militia to multiply their effectiveness.  The British wouldn't have even attacked if they'd really known how complete the American defenses were.  They thought they had the initiative on an unprepared force of farmers, not a fortified militia.  As it was, they won because the Americans couldn't stand up to Redcoat bayonets despite the nasty little crossfire they arranged on the approach against the Brits.

Musketry didn't become accurate enough that the firing line and bayonet charge became obsolete until close to the end of the Civil War when the breech loader and the repeater started really catching on (and right towards the very very very end when Richard Jordan Gatling came to Abraham Lincoln with an invention that would become infamous by the end of World War I).  If you had a musket line with no bayonets, then you had a force that was going to be driven off the battlefield before the end of the fight, unless it was backed up by bayonet-wielding regulars.  It's just how it was back then.  Your best bet with a force like that was to use it like Nathaniel Green used them at Gulliford Court House

BTW I'd like a way to differentiate between types of firearms.  Pistols should be reloadable on horseback.  Carbines could possibly be reloadable while moving.  Full blown muskets should not.  The kind of muskets used on the battle line, like the Brown Bess, were tall enough that you'd have to reach up to shoulder's height or higher to put the ball and powder in while the stock of the rifle was on the ground.  They were built to double as pikes in a melee line.  NWIH you should be able to reload a Charlevlille, a Brown Bess, or other basic infantry combat muskets on the move.

[QWW]

Moving while reloading is an easy change, you can do that yourself in a couple of minutes using Morgh's editing tools.
All you have to do is find the longarm (filter for crossbows) you want to reload on the move and tick the "reload musket" flag in the animations list.

The 1755 firearms work well in their specific context, and just from looking at the stats, the 1776 firearms should do the same, yet for some reason, the AI can't hit anything half the time, even when they're literally right next to a target.
I'll concede that part of this might simply be that in 1776, battle continuation provides more opportunity to observe the AI perform (poorly), and since it's just SP at this point, I'm also willing to accept the odd instance of random bad luck, but there's still something that doesn't feel right, the AI draws a blank when it comes to effective aiming/shooting too often, without me being able to point to a specific cause for it.
I actually raised the accuracy to ~ 1755 levels, which made shooting considerably easier for me, but seemed to produce no noticeable change for the AI.

Just in case your wondering why you can't just tick it to "reload while moving" crossbows are hard coded and unable to change without some "fun" editing.

[GABRILDURO]

--@ QWW
VERY true!!! 
I will have to work things around.....
Hey!!!... I could make all "reloadable" guns as "Pistols" and non-reloadable as "Muskets" 

--@ WOW!!! Imgran is back!!!  hehehe...how are you doing, man?


Gab

[jackx]

Not in this thread perhaps, but I did include best wishes for the next year in my general christmas/holiday greetings iirc... anyways, doing it again won't hurt, so Happy New Year and all the best for 2012 to you, Gabby!

EDIT by Gab:
Thx, it is true!! 
Moved your comment in the 1776 Happy New Year Topic

Imgran: Since you seem interested in the subject, I'll recommend you Duffy's Military Experience in the Age of Reason... a very good concise yet comprehensive overview over 18th century warfare.

[Hazzardevil]

Hi, I'm new here adn would like to say thanks for the fantastic mod. But I think there might be a problem with balance. Even fighting between native tribes and the foreigners seems deeply in the natives favor due to how they are far more mobile. Although this might just be me not paying much attention to friendly AI in battles. I do intend to have a deeper look at AI vs AI combat though. I'm glad that the projectile speed is fast, because I find it strange in mods like blood and steel where you can see bullets flying towards you.

[HappyCompy]

Try getting more musketeers...In my experience enough muskets can beat just about anything however I'm using tweaked muskets, so your mileage may vary...

On a side note, I fired up 1776 today and it still surprises me with it's grandeur. It really captures the period perfectly, and the music is a nice touch as well. The custom musket smoke, sound effects, and the addition of crouch make the combat very satisfying, you really have a gem here Gab!

If only we could get the World Map running smoothly  ... the lag kills Ctrl+Space 

[Hazzardevil]

Also, the sell automatically option isn't working for some reason.

[QWW]

You should say that in the bug topic.

[jackx]

He's right, it should be in the bug topic, but what's wrong with it exactly?
I haven't had any issues with it at all, my NPCs sell what they're supposed to... don't want to imagine what it'd be like selling the tons of cheap crap manually... :/

[imgran]

--@ WOW!!! Imgran is back!!!  hehehe...how are you doing, man?


Gab

Been worse.  Not so much into Warband anymore but I still kick around here and there.  Thanks for the welcome.