[LEGACY] Quick Questions // Quick Answers

I like hybrid, with focus on bow and lance. Others prefer melee + throwing. If you're desperate for skill pts, just go melee and crossbow. Alternative is pure melee with polearm.
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If you're looking for the best, then go for magic. With male hero, max AGI and get 7 in looting and wpn master, then learn all poems and unlock the lute for your CKO, then try to get the rumor about the enchanted noldor flute.
If you buy everyone a beer at the tavern with the rumor, you'll unlock a secret location in the Jatu plains, near the noldor forest. Beat the red brotherhood there, enjoy the short cutscene and gain access to 4 ancient noldor spells.

It's not that popular, because most ppl like to melee, so there isn't much info on this. I think the old post about this dissappeared.
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If you've done all the above and the location doesn't spawn, don't panic.... it's all a lie.

^lol... good one.

zykox said:

Spoiler

reticentReciter said:

A couple of sorta meta-gamey questions!

1) You can in theory get negative relations with your faction, if you didn't start it yourself, since joining only improves your faction relation by 12 points and you retain the ability to jump into battles against your own. Are there any repercussions besides the obvious ones, like not being able to enter faction fiefs? I might join a faction early to grab a walled fief and start custom knights order, for instance, but at the same time I don't really want to make my faction too strong, so the ability to attack an important lord could be handy. This of course raises a bunch more questions, so if anyone tried experimenting with this sort of thing, I'd love to know.

2)You can in theory get negative relations with your own order. Do you get kicked out if that happens? If you're grandmaster, will you still be able to enter Order Stronghold? My guess is no, since it's faction aligned, but you never know.

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Don't know about all about 1), but as far as I know nothing happens except that you can't enter your factions fiefs. Never tried is as lord, or for a longer time, but I guess if you're lord you risk getting kicked out of your faction by the king. So not a good idea.
As merc you're pretty safe though...

About 2): Yes, even as grandmaster, you get kicked out of your order...though buggily enough, the order stronghold is still there and you can still go in and access the quartermaster, armorer and constable.

And there I thought I could conquer an extra castle...Haven't tried joining ANOTHER order though...and currently don't have the patience to try.
Getting from relations 100 to -1 was torture enough, and I am already done with my playthrough this time after a few months.
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Taking a break now...pretty busy with my work as ALT in Japan at the moment, and looking for other jobs. I am pretty sure though I'll get back to PoP...as soon as I have enough money to buy a new pc!

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Thanks. Do you get kicked out of an order if your relation falls into negatives, or is it a matter of harassing them one too many times? I'm not above attacking my own order, but I'd like to keep the membership.

On a different note, I just destroyed Eyegrim on day 52, and Heretic status plummeted down all the way to "Crushed". From my previous experiences with PoP, minor factions never really recover from player victories. For example, Mystmountain Barbs would keep dropping back to "Fading" even two years after I've destroyed Wolfbode. So I'm a bit concerned that killing Grim this early would drastically reduce the number of heretic parties for the rest of the game, and I kind of want to keep them around. How screwed am I here?

reticentReciter said:

Thanks. Do you get kicked out of an order if your relation falls into negatives, or is it a matter of harassing them one too many times? I'm not above attacking my own order, but I'd like to keep the membership.

On a different note, I just destroyed Eyegrim on day 52, and Heretic status plummeted down all the way to "Crushed". From my previous experiences with PoP, minor factions never really recover from player victories. For example, Mystmountain Barbs would keep dropping back to "Fading" even two years after I've destroyed Wolfbode. So I'm a bit concerned that killing Grim this early would drastically reduce the number of heretic parties for the rest of the game, and I kind of want to keep them around. How screwed am I here?

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You get kicked out if you get into negatives. Just harassing them or failing quests will hurt your relations, nothing more...which is why it was such a pain to get from 100 to -1 (-___-)
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I am confused as to how the respawning works myself...The Jatu and the Snake Cult were crushed by day 300, then they never spawned again until I finished the game on day 1600. On the other hand, Mystmountains Wolfbode and Eyegrim just kept spawning every 3-4 weeks.
Syla Uzas also just kept spawning every month.
Meregan, Oswald, Burulgi and Three Seers spawned normally.
Villacio spawned just 3 times, Alaric 1 time, and no one else...??
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I think one of the ancient noldor spells (mentioned above in my former post ) allows you to summon an invader army!

Impossible! Magic has been forever lost.

telume said:

Impossible! Magic has been forever lost.

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But not the items, remember? Hence the magical tune from the enchanted Noldor flute! Besides, if magic was forever lost then it wouldn't be possible to summon demons or have any contact with the gods.

Good to know!

On the subject of minor factions, I've done some forum searching and according to this thread, the well-being of a minor faction is determined by the difference between the repression values of all faction parties currently on the map and the repression values of the parties destroyed by player. Also, the thread mentions that the game actually only updates and recalculates repression values when you check victory conditions.

I'm not exactly sure what to make of this. If both facts are correct, minor factions will never really recover after you destroy an army, even if the same army makes a comeback later, even after a really long time. In theory, once you defeat, say 5 heretic armies, their status will remain at "destroyed" even if you manage to get both Three Seers and Eyegrim to spawn via rumors. Which is upsetting, because in my 60 day game the Heretics are at "crushed already" (I personally banished Grim with the help of a few Fierdsvain lords) and in the past 20 days I've seen a grand total of 1 Heretic patrol. I want my loot and heretic magni recruits!

On the bright side, if repression only updates when you check victory conditions (as the linked thread suggests), I could try rumormongering until multiple heretic armies spawn, then let the game detect the change in repression, hopefully freezing Heretics at "Healthy" or better until the very end of the game.

Would...would that work  ?

zykox said:

telume said:

Impossible! Magic has been forever lost.

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But not the items, remember? Hence the magical tune from the enchanted Noldor flute! Besides, if magic was forever lost then it wouldn't be possible to summon demons or have any contact with the gods.

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Magic is not real. Demons are summoned by certified Dark Scientists and only via properly tested and peer-reviewed invocations.

The info on the minor faction seems weird to me...at least in my game, it's been my routine to go after every rumor in every tavern in every city, in the hopes of getting more spawns and at least get the major factions to slow down the pace.
In the end though, Eyegrim and Syla Uzas just kept spawning superfast, even without their rumors popping up. Snake Cult rumors had been abound as well, but as I said, over 700 days no spawn anymore. Maltise spawned once, I defeated her once, that was it...the other snake cult armies were destroyed without my doing.

I know for a fact though, that if you let minor factions spawn loads of armies (or minor raiding parties), their faction status will increase. I am guessing that the lower the status, the longer it takes to respawn...but that wouldn't explain why the snake cult practically disappeared after day 400, and the heretics just kept roaming the land. At least 2 times, I am pretty sure, Eyegrim and Syla Uzas even spawned within 2 weeks after I defeated them.
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Magic isn't real? I love that sentence: So pls define what you consider "real". Unfortunately most people have sub-consciously taken to define "reality" as the material world.
In this case, what about dreams? Yes, dreams leave no aftermath in the material world...but don't your thoughts, your experience in the dream remain?
I have once dreamt of a math problem...which I solved in my dream. And it was correct after I woke up too. When I meet someone in the dream and have a pleasant time, if I remember that dream, the feeling and the conversation stay with me.

Observation of results/events in the material world, those are concepts purely bound by Western science. Chinese and Japanese for example, have long established a philosophy and concept of non-materialistic energies: Chi (from Tai-Chi) or Ki (in Japanese).
The "reality" of these are easily proven in the far eastern traditional medicines...methods which are until today not provable by Western science, but undeniable since they bring results.

Reality is where your thoughts are, your consciousness. And your thoughts can be reflected in feelings like love, which is also not materialistic, but still forms bonds between you and other human beings. They can also be reflected in words, serving as an expression of your thoughts...like an essay on a sheet of paper. The paper is just a colorless thin material, while the pen just leaves a trace of ink. Words and thoughts are what give meaning to the piece of paper.

Don't let yourself be bound by materialism and results, or else Eyegrim and the heretics will become your reality!!

zykox said:

The "reality" of these are easily proven in the far eastern traditional medicines...

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telume said:

In your opinion what's better, a character that only focuses on melee or ranged or a hybrid of both melee and ranged?

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In a field battle, your actions don't matter that much, especially on larger battle sizes. Best tactics will win out every time. In a siege, you can easily kill 50-80 enemies singlehandedly if you're a good archer, which can make a huge difference.

However, in the mod, it's quite easy to be great at doing both, and you should. If nothing else it lets you have more variety when you play the game.

telume said:

In your opinion what's better, a character that only focuses on melee or ranged or a hybrid of both melee and ranged?

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Generally, if you don't spend qualis gems on temporary and not-so-important stuff like noldors or weapons, and choose to exchange them for elixirs instead, it is not difficult to get almost every WP quite high by the end of the game, so the only questions is "Why not both?".

Empiro said:

In a field battle, your actions don't matter that much, especially on larger battle sizes.

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It depends on the enemy. For example, several Demonic Magni can easily destroy your whole army when you are not helping your soldiers much, and your troops are usually very ineffective in killing them, so at least in my case I always find myself taking down most of them personally even on medium battle sizes (about 150). Also if you mostly focus on eliminating enemies' top-tier troops, your personal contribution is very high as well.

zykox said:

The info on the minor faction seems weird to me...at least in my game, it's been my routine to go after every rumor in every tavern in every city, in the hopes of getting more spawns and at least get the major factions to slow down the pace.
In the end though, Eyegrim and Syla Uzas just kept spawning superfast, even without their rumors popping up. Snake Cult rumors had been abound as well, but as I said, over 700 days no spawn anymore. Maltise spawned once, I defeated her once, that was it...the other snake cult armies were destroyed without my doing.

I know for a fact though, that if you let minor factions spawn loads of armies (or minor raiding parties), their faction status will increase. I am guessing that the lower the status, the longer it takes to respawn...but that wouldn't explain why the snake cult practically disappeared after day 400, and the heretics just kept roaming the land. At least 2 times, I am pretty sure, Eyegrim and Syla Uzas even spawned within 2 weeks after I defeated them.

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A lot of it is random luck, it seems.

Is it possible to become a mercenary after having been a vassal at one point? I started out as a mercenary, eventually swore fealty to Ravenstern, and then later decided to quit and go back to being a mercenary, since I was making a lot less money as a vassal and the jackass king refused to give me a castle that I took alone. Unfortunately, nobody is offering me a mercenary contract. I've tried in both Ravenstern and the Empire so far and talked to a ton of lords.

EDIT: Turns out that eventually people will start offering you mercenary contracts again. Took a few weeks and a few dozen tries at asking lords, but finally I got an offer.

Empiro said:

In a field battle, your actions don't matter that much, especially on larger battle sizes. Best tactics will win out every time. In a siege, you can easily kill 50-80 enemies singlehandedly if you're a good archer, which can make a huge difference.

However, in the mod, it's quite easy to be great at doing both, and you should. If nothing else it lets you have more variety when you play the game.

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You are underestimating Warrior Avatars, especially Melee ones. Melee characters aren't limited by such things as "ammo" and "friendly fire."


When my Avatar gets KOed enemy Knights have a tendency to loiter within my forces far longer. This can get especially bad when I deploy >80% archers.

I agree that you can go melee + archery with little issue, especially as both Power Strike/Draw are STR dependent. I think the bigger question is what you want your secondary stat to be, especially with the recent Qualis Gem nerf. Although really, while Qualis Gems are nice I've never seen much merit in relying on them for a character build. Too luck based, and it brings your game to a crawl.

Is there anything wrong with taking my time with the game, with it taking thousands of days? Or am I supposed to try to win ASAP and always be constrained to make the best choices and do the most productive things at any given time? Does the game get harder or something as the game advances in days so I have to rush to win or can I be leisurely about it?

telume said:

Is there anything wrong with taking my time with the game, with it taking thousands of days? Or am I supposed to try to win ASAP and always be constrained to make the best choices and do the most productive things at any given time? Does the game get harder or something as the game advances in days so I have to rush to win or can I be leisurely about it?

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I play WB as a sim/RPG game, so I take my time. Even when I do this though I find it rare for a game to last thousand(s) of days.

Warband penalizes you for playing long games by increasing odds of having permanent stat drops IIRC. You can disable this, and Qualis Gems also reset your character's age as well IIRC.

You can read more about this stat loss in such topics as:
http://forums.taleworlds.com/index.php?topic=105148.0

Well stating it in the thousands was purely exaggeration lol, I doubt it'll take that long but it's still good to know I can take my time.

Illumina, I take it all those kills are from polearms lol? I should try some myself, I've been going with lance couching and 1h+shield and maybe it isn't the best way to get kills and have fun with melee. Lately I've been going the horse archer/archer route though, but seeing all those kills that's a far cry from what I get with couching and 1h/shield, when I get into melee again I'll give halberds a shot. What's your weapon setup?

telume said:

Well stating it in the thousands was purely exaggeration lol, I doubt it'll take that long but it's still good to know I can take my time.

Illumina, I take it all those kills are from polearms lol? I should try some myself, I've been going with lance couching and 1h+shield and maybe it isn't the best way to get kills and have fun with melee. Lately I've been going the horse archer/archer route though, but seeing all those kills that's a far cry from what I get with couching and 1h/shield, when I get into melee again I'll give halberds a shot. What's your weapon setup?

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The vast vast majority. I noticed that there is one where I had just recently used a bow, the one without a shield on my back.  I will vary my loadout a lot depending on situation, mood, and present build. I used to use throwing weapons, but have started to just use a secondary shield if I don't intend to use a bow.

Ruby 1h sword, shield, hammer and a knight long lance do me very well.

If i don't get the bow when Wolfbode spawns, if there a chance/way i can get it later?