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Dark Elf Army Impressions

After playing the mod for a decent amount of time, almost all of it with the Dark Elves, I've had a few thoughts about their army composition. 

Infantry: Executioners and Black Guards get two handers/halberds respectively, so they do have some decent hitting power.  However, as with any shieldless unit, they are very vulnerable to enemy ranged attackers.  Consider keeping a 2 to 1 Guardmaster (the highest level infantry that get shields) to Executioner/Black Guard ratio.  An alternative to addressing the archer vulnerability of the top tier infantry is to split your infantry into two groups, one of Guardmasters/Spears (defensive role) and one of Executioners/Black Guards (shock troops, to engage the enemy only once they've contacted your first infantry group.  Overall, in my experience, the main purpose of the Dark Elf infantry is to slow up the enemy and give your crossbows time to pincushion them. 

Archers: This is the strength of the army.  While the Assassin line ends up being the highest level common unit available to the Dark Elves (and good at melee and range to boot), the Repeater Crossbowmen (elves?) are the true stars.  They are easy to train up, have a very reasonable upkeep, and are equipped with the best ranged weapon in the game.  Repeater Crossbows may not hit as hard as firearms, but have a much higher rate of fire, while still hitting harder than bog standard bows.  Have the bulk of your army be these guys (mix in some Assassins to help out in case enemy melee attackers reach your archer line) and watch cavalry charges wither under a hail of semiautomatic rifle crossbow fire.

Cavalry: Not much to say on this topic, as I haven't used these troops too much, but Dark Elf cavalry seems pretty average.  Cold Ones are tougher (but slower) than regular horses.  I'd use these guys for disrupting the enemy archer line/chasing down routing foes (bog standard cavalry work).  The riders do feel a bit squishy to me, so I'd be hesitant to deploy them against infantry formations.  In other words, they're more of a pursuit rather than spearhead unit.  I would compare them to Vaegir cavalry in Native; decent, but definitely not top tier heavy cavalry. 

Overall, the Dark Elves are a hard-hitting if somewhat fragile force.  Consider mixing in Chaos infantry and cavalry elements for a stronger backbone.  I apologize if the previous sentence completely broke the lore. 
 
Jarl:  I know you've done a lot with Orcs.  Do you have any tricks for testing individual troop balances?  Or do you have to fight a bunch of battles and get a broad view?
 
leonn said:
is there a ork friendly way of telling by looking at the mod in its folder that tells you the patch is...in..installed..working? i extracted the patch again but i opened it in the rar first,selected all the files and then extracted it to the mod folder. cheers

The quickest way would be to start a new Chaos character - if their "king" is called Archaon the Everchosen(as opposed to Warlord Archaon) then my stuff should be applied correctly

He is at Mt. Vanir at the very start and you spawn right by that town.

wcparker said:
Jarl:  I know you've done a lot with Orcs.  Do you have any tricks for testing individual troop balances?  Or do you have to fight a bunch of battles and get a broad view?

Oh you really have t do both; fight lots with and against the unit/faction. For example I only judged my first batch of Orc changes by observing friendly Orcs fighting Dwarves (Enlistment is great for that) which lead to me later (as an Empire character) having to face the now totally overpowered/overbuffed Orcs I had created (Very Frankenstein's monsteresque!) and had to normalize my changes to them - trying to balance Orcs against the Dwarves only made it even worse! Same happened to a lesser extent with Chaos; I had to create entire tiers off armour sets for Chaos because by giving my new units the coolest stuff, they became far too tanky since the cool stuff is really top-tier armour! My Khornate Berserkers could tank stuff like no tomorrow.

This is why my changes are mostly aimed towards Orcs and Chaos, while factions like Araby and Pirate Kingdom remains as of yet entierly untouched - I have no experience either playing with or against them.
 
Birger Jarl said:
The quickest way would be to start a new Chaos character - if their "king" is called Archaon the Everchosen...
Thanks to Warband´s wonderful AI you should change his name to Archaon the Evercoward. He rarely ever leaves the north, even though he has an army between 200 and 300 troops, most of them elites (over 30 Heralds of Khorne!).
 
jarl, i have yet to apply your personal fixes. i was referring to the patch,but i think that has now worked as i installed all again and this time it prompted me to overwrite. i decided to wait for this new rar you spoke of creating because it would contain the whatever-it-was that was missing previously. cheers
 
Articulo34 said:
Birger Jarl said:
The quickest way would be to start a new Chaos character - if their "king" is called Archaon the Everchosen...
Thanks to Warband´s wonderful AI you should change his name to Archaon the Evercoward. He rarely ever leaves the north, even though he has an army between 200 and 300 troops, most of them elites (over 30 Heralds of Khorne!).

Kings are wussies in general. There's even a part of their AI that lets them flat-out ignore a Marshall's summon if they feel like! So not even an ongoing campaign is guaranteed to get him off his fat Everarse and do something.

But at least he has arms.
 
Birger Jarl said:
Kings are wussies in general. There's even a part of their AI that lets them flat-out ignore a Marshall's summon if they feel like! So not even an ongoing campaign is guaranteed to get him off his fat Everarse and do something.

But at least he has arms.
There is one way of getting them to move though. Make sure to piss them somehow so you have a negative relation and get yourself a nice village. Jackpot! They will pillage it even if they have to cross the entire map to do so. Just another thing that should have been fixed in Warband a while ago.
 
huzza and hurra, success! all has installed as it should have. whipped up a chaos character and sure enough there was wossname the everlovin in charge. so my gratitude for all your aid and patience jarl. cheers
 
leonn said:
huzza and hurra, success! all has installed as it should have. whipped up a chaos character and sure enough there was wossname the everlovin in charge. so my gratitude for all your aid and patience jarl. cheers

Now I just hope it lives up to you expections after all the trouble, lol
 
thus far its been exellent. playing empire enlisted and its been a non stop fight, just how warhammer should be. oh,every now and again i get script saying errors in red,do you need to know about those? cheers
 
leonn said:
thus far its been exellent. playing empire enlisted and its been a non stop fight, just how warhammer should be. oh,every now and again i get script saying errors in red,do you need to know about those? cheers

We all get those, it is a script error on the part of the developers which thankfully doesn't really affect anything. Personally I suspect it has something to do with the land-based Beastmen Army mobs spawning out in the seas rather on land.

 
Installed and dark elves all have human skin, just slightly long faces. Looks pretty dumb, anyone know a fix? Tried reinstalling by downloading from different sources, tried with and without the bugfix but dark elves remain human.
 
vyyye said:
Installed and dark elves all have human skin, just slightly long faces. Looks pretty dumb, anyone know a fix? Tried reinstalling by downloading from different sources, tried with and without the bugfix but dark elves remain human.

That's how they're supposed to look - elongated faces and elven ears but otherwise human...
 
jarl,report thus far. the orks have definatly perked up,and if as empire you dont outnumber them and use your missile troops you will get a big slap. im loving it big time! cheers
 
Birger Jarl said:
vyyye said:
Installed and dark elves all have human skin, just slightly long faces. Looks pretty dumb, anyone know a fix? Tried reinstalling by downloading from different sources, tried with and without the bugfix but dark elves remain human.

That's how they're supposed to look - elongated faces and elven ears but otherwise human...
Oh, I thought they'd be more.. y'know, dark. Well good that it's not a bug then.
 
Some major bugs with ramps in sieges goblins and scaven can not climb them  stay as big blob of troops at base of ramp. Watched this occur in siege over Karak Hirn only the rat ogres and trolls seemed to be able to climb up it and an occasional goblin.

One does not recieve the money on bets during tournaments most of the time on occasion will get the cash earned assigned.

Book salesman is broken.  does not sell books when you talk to him.

The orc east of karak Hirn stairs to battlements to large for smaller races to climb them.

Karak Hirn one of the stairwells  leading up to wall is not complete.

Mousillon event with bandits cannot be completed...wonder if some bandits spawn in the water? spent over an hour searching through that huge city only found three of them. They need to spawn all in one spot preferably in the large open courtyard.

 
vyyye said:
Birger Jarl said:
vyyye said:
Installed and dark elves all have human skin, just slightly long faces. Looks pretty dumb, anyone know a fix? Tried reinstalling by downloading from different sources, tried with and without the bugfix but dark elves remain human.

That's how they're supposed to look - elongated faces and elven ears but otherwise human...
Oh, I thought they'd be more.. y'know, dark. Well good that it's not a bug then.

They're not Drow...

The Dark Elves are for all intents of purposes exactly the same as High Elves; the schism is political/religious in nature rather than a racial conflict á la Orcs/Dwarves. It is civil war.

Though Dark Elves are usually portrayed as black-haired as opposed to the blonde High Elves because evilness is the leading case of black hair. If theycould grow facial hair I'm sure they'd have goatees, too.
 
Birger Jarl said:
vyyye said:
Birger Jarl said:
vyyye said:
Installed and dark elves all have human skin, just slightly long faces. Looks pretty dumb, anyone know a fix? Tried reinstalling by downloading from different sources, tried with and without the bugfix but dark elves remain human.

That's how they're supposed to look - elongated faces and elven ears but otherwise human...
Oh, I thought they'd be more.. y'know, dark. Well good that it's not a bug then.

They're not Drow...

The Dark Elves are for all intents of purposes exactly the same as High Elves; the schism is political/religious in nature rather than a racial conflict á la Orcs/Dwarves. It is civil war.

Though Dark Elves are usually portrayed as black-haired as opposed to the blonde High Elves because evilness is the leading case of black hair. If theycould grow facial hair I'm sure they'd have goatees, too.
I kind of went in expecting drows. Time to read up some on them, just saw some fanart where they basically looked like drows.
 
It is funny how the lore is similar to Star Wars; Malekith quite literally "pulls a Darth Vader" by being burned/mutilated so badly he has to be permanently sealed in a suit of armour. Also incest.

I digress...

What do you guys think about this change for Tomb Kings: I am toying with the idea of granting all their lords 5 levels of Surgery by default. This is to represent the fact they are actually all undead and can reanimate their units. 20% of their losses would be knocked unconcious rather than killed which the lord  will "reanimate" so unless the lord loses he can do his thang and glue some of his skellies back together. It might be overpowered but as long as I keep their Wound Treatmemt low/none at all the process should be a slow one.

Alternatively I might buff their tank to high heavens but burden them greatly/take away their Athletics to give them that "shuffling undead horde" feel.

I dunno... I feel that they aren't living up to their potential atm b
 
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